cobalt123

Hi all,
I've been going in circles in considering a touring bike.
I recently got back on a bike after 25 years as a means to lose weight. I've dropped close to 45lbs so far, and in riding I revived a long latent desire to go touring that I had back in my college days. I've become rather obsessed with this idea. And while I'm glad I was able to get a bike and lose weight, i think I bought the wrong bike now that I'm developing some cycling goals beyond not being hugely fat.

So, here's some of my desires:
1) a bike capable of carrying me and my bulk (I'm currently at a smidgen over 300lb and dropping - but it will be a looong time till I'm under 250). 36 spoke minimum I think.
2) a competent road bike with appropriate touring gearing
3) there are a number of reclaimed rail beds near me that trace central MA and Southern NH. But from what I have gleaned about these trails they can be pretty rough and have some muddy stretches. This is where I feel I'm under biked right now. My current bike will only handle 34mm tire max, and that with no fenders - which I would like to have.
4) Roads near me are ROUGH. Potholes are a thing here. We take pride in our lack of road maintenance...
5) I will not be mountain biking, though may use bike packing gear as I think I'll be more of a credit card tour kind of guy and will limit the gear and weight I'm hauling. I still want to maintain an option for racks front and rear though for the future.
6) I'm not likely to be doing touring in far flung places, so I don't have tire size considerations to worry about.
7) I really want to do some winter riding next year. Another reason I'd like some large tire capacity.

• My best guess right now is a Surly Troll - maybe built up from a frame - but I'm not clear on how well it runs on the roads where I'm likely to spend most of my time.
• Another option is a surly Disk Trucker with 26" wheels so I could run 2" tires. Will this run well on the rail trails?
• Looked at the Salsa Marrakesh also - but again... tire size
• Other?

Thanks for the feedback,
Matt

Wilfred Laurier

A burly all-purpose bike like the Surly Troll is probably a good choice - it will be a little heavier than a 'road' bike, but this has less effect than you'd think. The frame and fork are likely ~3 lbs heavier than a comparable aluminum, 4 lbs more than carbon, which, if you add up rider + gear + bike, is (3÷340 = 0.008) less than one percent of a weight increase. The tires you chose will have a bigger impact on your speed than the weight. Even if you choose fatter tires (~45mm width) you can find ones that have a lighter casing which have less rolling resistance.

You will feel the weight of the bike compared to a lighter one, but this is a psychological issue more than a practical one.

And while the Troll is a good choice, don't rule out an aluminum bike that meets your needs - it would likely be stiffer and therefore a good choice for a heavier rider. Cannondale has some very nice gravel bikes that are worth a look. Many other manufacturers offer similar bikes.

lurch0038

Surly ECR? Supports 29x3.0 tires
Surly ICT? Supports 26x5.0 and can support 29x3.0
Steel frame is a must for a Clyde.

cobalt123

Knet

I have been supremely happy with my Salsa Marrakesh, except when I hit serious mud, but it doesn't really have the tires for that. It has a ton of clearance, not sure what the limit is as I am more likely to go narrower for what I want to do. But not until this set wears out.

tyrion

A Troll with 26x2.5" tires would give you almost as much cushioning as a 29x3 ECR and wheels/tires will be lighter, stronger (smaller wheels are stronger, all other things being equal), and give you more options for faster tires. (The giant circumference of the ECR tires allow you to roll over bigger obstacles and it sounds to me like overkill for what you need.)

But a Disc Trucker with skinnier/lighter wheels/tires will be faster than a Troll, generally speaking.

jlaw

I have a 2015 Specialized AWOL Elite (not the one in the photo below). It has OEM fenders and Tubus front/rear racks - a very solid and comfortable bike - 9 speed with brifters, 45mm tires, TRP Spyre mech. disk brakes, 12-36 cassette, 50-39-30 crankset.

The 2019 entry-level AWOL is set-up similarly except for the fenders and racks. It is suitable for heavier riders and off-road or on-road. It carries a front load well using low-rider rack and bags. Mine weighs about 31 lbs. The one in the picture is probably around 28 lbs.

The tire clearance is huge - 55mm+ will fit with no problem - but perhaps not on the OEM rims (inner rim width may not support such a wide tire. ?)

I like the AWOL but it is a tank.

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/aw...=239479-128933

indyfabz

You want a "competent road bike" and won't be MTB-ing yet you want to run 50mm tires? *scratches his head*

I've done things like this (and rougher things) with full camping and cooking gear on my LHT with 700x37c tires. I also commute/run errands on it.

indyfabz

jsigone

check out The Path Less Pedaled https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaT...21yRK4seqq3-Sw

they do a bunch of gear review, bikes bag ect. They focus on running 38+ c tires. Bikepacker aka same as touring bikes. Modern bike bags don't need special holes in the frames and forks anymore.

Gravel bike aka longer wheelbase cyclocross bike is the new style "touring bike"

my old CX bike was great for my style touring (pack light, travel farther), bit more upright than my normal rig and still rode pretty fast. Used 28c gravelkings on this San Fran to LA trip. Now has 38C tires mounted.

tarwheel 

jlaw

I looked at the Specialized website - the OEM wheels are 32 spoke using 14 straight gauge spokes and the 'double wall' rims that appear to be the same ones I have - pretty beefy -should be ok for your 300# current weight. I also found a Specialized document that shows the AWOL has a 'structural' weight limit of 300# (the highest allowable loading of the weakest component) and a 'cargo'weight limit of 30# front and 55# rear. I'm not sure if this is in addition to the 300# structural limit or not.

Here is the document: https://media.specialized.com/suppor...0000057489.pdf

Your LBS is the best resource for questions re: the load limit of a particular bike. The base model AWOL goes for $1200 and is spec'd pretty nicely. The 30-36 low gear combo is reasonably low for general riding. You could possibly go lower with a different cassette and/or crank. The best way to know if this gearing is low enough is to test ride the bike.

The only concern about this bike is the slender seat stays. When I stand up to pedal hard I can flex the frame enough to make a 44mm tire rub on the fender. I put 37mm tires on it and this no longer occurs. I am significantly lighter than you. If you test ride the bike you should see if this is an issue for you.

Also, the cranks and the bottom bracket area of any bike frame that you buy should be of concern to you if you stand-up and really pull/push hard when climbing. Having a crank break while doing this can yield a very bad result. Again, consult your LBS.

For any bike you buy there should be a documented allowable load limit. I think you're on the right track with a 'touring' or beefy gravel bike....low gearing, large tires, disk brakes, strong frame, etc. - steel or maybe alloy.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

cobalt123

kingston 

An old dirt drop could be worth considering.

csport

1) Good steel bike. Dedicated touring bikes are made tankish on purpose -- LHT, AWOL etc. Gravel bikes are less stiff. Surly bikes in general are overbuilt and more tankish. If you tour with a full load (front/rear panniers) this may be a good thing. You may not need it for credit card touring.
2) Good reason to build it from frame and run a triple
3) Have you ridden them? You may be overestimating the problems. Rail trails are more solid than towpaths like C&O. I am just under 300, and i have done C&O in the pouring rain with load on 42mm tires (Conti SpeedRide).
4) NYC roads can be rough as well. Get some wide supple tires. For me 32mm Paselas work well even with the aluminum hybrid.

+1

With disc brakes you can do road+: use 650b (27.5") wheels with 47mm wide tires. They can be interchanged with some 700c wheels. You can do this with Double Cross (https://www.somafab.com/archives/pro...ble-cross-disc -- I have one) or Black Mtn Road Plus (https://blackmtncycles.com/frames/road-plus/).
These folks make frames using thinner tubing compared to Surly. They also make monstercross frames which can fit up to 50mm tires (Some Wolverine, Black Mtn Monster Cross).

+1

daoswald

A Surly is always surely a good suggestion. But I wanted to point out the Cannondale Quick CX line. I have one with a Tubus Cargo Evo rack in back, and SKS Chromoplastic fenders. The bike will accept tires over 40mm, though with fenders 40mm may be the approximate max. I have GP4Season 32mm tires but maybe someday I'll go a little wider if I can find the perfect tire in 35 or 38. The front fork has bosses for fenders too. If front suspension isn't your thing the Quick (non-CX) might do it for you though tire clearance may be slightly reduced... probably 40mm max even without fenders.

I thought I wouldn't like the suspension fork, but it has lock-out and seems just fine for a mix of mostly pavement with some rough roads and light trails here and there.

indyfabz

Another road I did fully loaded on 37c tires. Gibbons Pass in Montana. I think the super wide tire craze is counterproductive when you are doing a mix of on and off road. Another one to look at is the Surly Straggler. Surly referred to it as kind of a Cross Check on steroids.

As an aside, this photo was taken while I was climbing and thus is a good example of why you should occasionally stop and look back.

jlaw

I looked at the specs. for the 3 different AWOL models. I don't think the price jump from $1200 (base) to $2100 (middle) to $2500 (top) is worth it. Hydraulic disks are nice, but not really nec. IMO because the TRP Spyre mechanical disks are solid. The higher-model drivetrains don't really impress compared to the Sora triple and 12-36 cassette on the base. Fenders, racks, and the dyno-hub on the $2500 model can be added for about a third of the $1300 price increase over the base.

Stangely, the Specialized website shows all sizes of the AWOL as 'Out of Stock' - I read elsewhere that the AWOL may not be available for 2019 - not sure.

Maybe the Spec. Sequoia is the way to go - not sure about the specs. or load limit on that model.

jlaw

This bike might work for you - I'll admit to being a fan of this rig - steel frame/fork, 650bx47mm wheels/tires, TRP Spyres, lots of possibilities for racks, fenders, etc. - but the drivetrain has gearing that's too tall and the price tag is $2000 - could probably find a better stock set-up for less. But this bike has the look.

Surly Midnight Special:

jlaw

Beezer makes some nice steel bikes with a good spec. for the money. The various 'Radar' or 'Doppler' models are possibilities for you. I think the 'Radar Expert' has a good spec. and is a good value for $1069. Not sure if there is a shop that carries Breezer near you - might have to drive.

Here's the website: https://www.breezerbikes.com/bikes/a...r/radar-expert

jlaw

Kona Rove ST (steel) - a nice 650b all-road bike with a decent spec. - but not a fan of the 1x drive train. $1599

KONA BIKES | ROAD / GRAVEL | ROVE | Rove ST



Kona also has the Sutra - $1499 includes fenders and racks - and a triple crank with a 26-34 low gear combo (a slow walk!)

KONA BIKES | ROAD / GRAVEL | SUTRA | Sutra

jlaw

Last suggestion - All City Space Horse - touring bike - $1499 with a solid spec. but lacks super-low gear combo. The fork on this bike may be a little more forgiving on rough roads given the slight curvature.

https://allcitycycles.com/bikes/space_horse

cyclist2000

I like a Kona Sutra

KONA BIKES | ROAD / GRAVEL | SUTRA | Sutra

This is what I would get if buying a touring bike this year. I would really like to find one of their frames from a couple of years ago since it was a chrome frame.

cobalt123

indyfabz

Thought you wanted a triple.

One thing you need to keep in mind if you think you are one day going to tour with a rear rack is chainstay length. Don't want your heels hitting the bags. The above has 450 stays. That's pretty good. By way of comparison, the LHT has 460 stays. It's when you start getting into the 440 or shorter range where you may get into trouble depending on the shape of the bags, how much you stuff them, the size of your feet and how far back on the rack you can place them. (You want to try to avoid having them sit far back.)