bigfred 

O.K. guys,

My 36h Open Pros started making concerning noises the week before last. So, on went the 32h CXP's. And on this mornings ride, while descending at some considerable speed and with Mrs. Fred in the draft, two spokes let go.

The build my own campaign has been accelerated and I'll be adding at least one new rear wheel to the garage.

Right now the plan is:

Rebuild the 36h Ultegra rear hub that the OP is on with a Velocity Deep V

Rebuild the 32h Tiagra rear hub with some other rim, possibly a DT 1.2/585 or a Deep V

Purchase a new rear. Components to be decided.

So, the question is: With my desire and this opportunity to try a few different rims, what would be your third choice for a clyde training rim?

(presuming deep V and 585 are already on the list)

jimblairo

DT RR2. Bombproof!

socalrider

The quality of the Dt Swiss rim is a just a hair better than the Deep V.. This is from someone who has both wheels.. I loved the RR1.2 / now 585 that I had an another rear built up.. Never had to touch them as far as going out of true.. Great rim.. A little pricy but worth the money.

bigfred 

Thanks for the endorsement. If they made them in 36h drilling, I would put the DT 585's on the Ultegra hubs. But, unfortunately they don't. So, in addition to the 585 and Deep V, do you have a third choice that you'd recommend?

Since I'm going to be buying at least one new wheel, I'm not beyond making it 32h in order to mount the 585's to a nicer hub than the Tiagra. I'd then put the third choice on the Tiagra hubs.

socalrider

If you want to go lighter the velocity fusion is a nice choice - medium deep rim..good deals can be found at speedgoat

https://www.speedgoat.com/Catalog.aspx/Browse?Cat=C156

CliftonGK1

The IRO Cold Fusion is (to the best that I can tell) an unbadged version of these. Weight, specs, and measurements all match up; mine even arrived in a Velocity box, although some people have reported slight weight differences (equivalent to a Kinlin XR-240) and receiving theirs in a Kinlin box. Either way, the IRO version is $15.00
I've been riding 2 pairs of these over the last year; one on my roadie commuter and one on my monstercross/CX racer.

peteydink

I would recommend looking at Peter White's site and seeing what he says about the different rims and especially tandem wheels.
I have had some good luck with Mavic T217 albeit they are an older and hard to find rim.

ericthered

I did not like the deep V. I dented two rims. I replaced them with Mavic a719 which have been much better and one used by peter. The eyelets are also an advantage over the Deep V.
Eric

bigfred 

Out of curiousity, when you dented the two deep v's, what did you weigh, what size tire were you running and at what pressure?

maidenfan

I have a set of RR585's on Ultegra hubs and like them a lot. If you have to have 36h check out these H Plus Son SL42's on this track bike. Hella strong and look great.

ericthered

220 pounds, I am pretty sure i had 700x32 at the time but nothing under 700x28. They were a 36h rim on tiagra hub. i usually kept them inflated up around 85 psi depending on the tire. These were both rear rims. One dimpled symmetrically on the weld joint. The replacement rim failed a year later. I noted some spider cracking around the spoke holes as well on the second rim. They were built by a reputable LBS. I decided to move to an eyeleted rim and from what I read at the time the mavics were highly regarded but heavy. They are also wider. My opinion is very subjective since I could not ride them side by side but I like the ride of the mavics better and wish I had gotten them from the start. I did not because they are usually significantly more expensive. I never tried any of the other box style rims but I really do not want to replace them any time soon.
Eric

ericthered

I also switched to a sun-ringle cartridge bearing hub from the tiagra and think it rolls much better.
Eric

Leebo

For the back wheel of my commuter, I had a mavic A719 rim built around a 105 hub with dt swiss db spokes, 36 holes. I'm 235 lbs and ride lots of crappy Boston roads and carry 1 loaded bag on the back of my cross check. The mavic web site lists this touring rim as "bombproof". With 6,000 miles on it , I'm in agreement.

maidenfan

I have a 340lb buddy who rides the A719 on a Karate Monkey who's having the same experience as you - pretty tough rim.

phlydude

Read:
https://www.bikerumor.com/2011/12/07/...eavier-riders/

gyozadude

Personally, having been 255 - 325 lbs for all of my adult life, I've rarely ever had rims come out of true due to riding. Instead, my rims have warped primarily because of the spokes failing, usually at the head, and 80% of those failed on the rear wheel, drive side, most of those having been stock wheels on a bike. So, I'm of the philosophy that most any rim will do. We just need enough spokes (36 holes preferred), and we need quality spokes (DT, Wheelsmith, or Sapim) and we need enough rubber around the rim to protect the wheel. Beyond that, I don't worry so much about the rim.

bigfred 

Where I am now:

1 pr. 36h Ultegra hubs, Front Open Pro, o.k. but worn, Rear MA3 rebuild in progress, both 14ss X3

1 pr. 32h Tiagra hubs, Front CXP11, almost new, Rear, Questionable CXP 11, popping spoke heads, have found that last mechanic loc tited nipples, as of a couple hours ago has been down graded from "needs attention" to "needs replacing" or at the very least relacing.

Wher I would like to be:

1 pr. Everyday Training wheels that can be relied on for 100-200 miles/week without issue. Likely to be either 36h Velocity Deep V's or DT 585's mounted to 105 or Ultegra hubs

1 pr. Back up wheels, some thing that's there when ever I need them. Probably my Ultegra OP/MA3 combo if they prove to work alright.

1 pr. Rain wheels, the Tiagra's laced to whatever is cheap. Maybe the IRO Cold Fusions, or, Deep V's

1 pr. Event Day wheels, probably Ksyrium Elites, maybe something else, time will tell, but, those are still some time away.

Current plan on how to get from the former to the later:

1. Purchase components for either Deep V's or 585 on Shimano hubs, 36h or 32h respectively, 13/14 drive side, 14/15 non and front, X3
2. Assess the OP/MA3 combo for suitability after completing my first rebuild, both of which require the purchase of a tension meter and perhaps a truing stand
3. Put a rim on the Tiagra rear.
4. One day, some day, get some event wheels.

Thanks for the thoughts on other possibilities. The fusions and A719 both intrigued me, but, not enough to favor them over Deep V's or 585's.

What does the peanut gallery think?

marcusbandito

The Salsa Delgado Cross has held up well through the years, so has the Alex Adventure. Both come in 36 holes but are a wider rim than what the OP has been using. These less expensive alternatives to the 719

Buck_O

Wow, another thread about overbuilding wheels as a result of poor bicycle maintenance, and wheel servicing.

When will the madness end?

theblackbullet

+2

I'm rocking a set of 32h hplussons on my nishiki. I've weighed between 250-280 the entire time I've owned them and haven't had any issues whatsoever. I even bunny hop over speedbumps, speedhumps, railroad tracks, etc. on them lol

cyccommute 

Unless the spokes that "let go" pulled out of the rim, the problem isn't with the rims. The problem is with the wheel build and with the spokes. The spokes were probably not tight enough nor tensioned properly.

The other issue is that rims seldom have much to do with wheel strength. The rim only serves as a method to hold the spokes in place and as a convenient place to put the tire. The rim 'floats' on the spokes and the spokes are where nearly all the wheel strength lies. The rims and hubs that you have chosen will do a very adequate job for just about any wheel. Don't overlook the spokes...a common misconception. If you go with a DT Alpine spoke or a Wheelsmith DH13, you'll have a truly stronger wheel over what you are currently using.

Denting rims isn't a rim problem.

Bingo! Your dented rims resulted from a low tire pressure and, probably, from hitting stuff on the road without unweighting the wheels. The fact that the rear wheels were the ones that were dented suggest that you 'ride heavy' in the saddle rather than 'ride light' in the saddle.

When you ride heavy, you sit on the saddle like it's a chair. When you hit something, the wheels take the full impact. If you ride light, you hover over the saddle most of the time. When you hit something on the road, your legs take the impact and let the bike move up and down under you. It takes most of the stress off the wheels.

Finally, if you are riding on tires that are 35+mm wide, 85 psi is okay. But you since are riding on 28mm or narrower, that way, way too low.

matthewk459

^^^ This

nymtber

I have slowly creeped up from 200 to 235 over the past 10 years, and have been riding 32h wheels the whole time, except when I had the Allez that had a 28h radial laced front wheel. Even with the radial laced wheel, once they were properly tensioned, and trued, I never had an issue with them again. Including mountain biking, hopping curbs, hitting small jumps (2' of air or so) etc. Even when I was younger (180-200lbs) and had a rigid bike with cheap wheels on it, I could hop curbs, hit jumps, beat the bike up pretty good.

Anyone that has mechanical ability should just get a truing stand, I have a $40 stand, and a Park tensiometer and some decent nipple wrenches. Tension and true your wheels when they are new, de-stress them and re-true. I do not believe, for one second, that anyone under 300lbs needs a huge profile V rim, IF the wheel is properly built in the first place. Get a good quality rim, build it right with DB spokes, and go with 32h 3x (36h if you really want) and use bigger tires. My Allez had 23c tires at 120psi, wheels stayed true of course I was only 225 then...

bigfred 

The only failure here with regard to wheel maintenance and servicing, is the bicycle industries inability to deliver competent mechanics at LBS's. I was very happy with my wheels for years. But, since moving to Auckland have been through half the shops in the city looking for a tech that can understand whats important to keeping a solid wheel under a clyde.

On the overbuilding note: What's wrong with overbuidling "TRAINING WHEELS"? These are no nonesense, ride the crap out of without concern wheels, that should consider themselves lucky if they get their bearings cleaned and adjusted more than once a year.

Fella's I'm 6'5", have lost 35 lbs to get down to 255, don't see myself getting much below 250 and ride reasonably strong. If you see 32 or 36 spoke wheels as "overkill" so be it. 14/15DB spokes are pretty standard fair for even light riders. The only thing that might be considered overkill would be the use of 13/14 SB on the drive sides. But, what the heck, I'll give 'em a go and see how they work.

Buck_O

Well, im 5' 10.5", and at present i weigh about 285. When i was in top form before my massive off last year, i was at about 255. My "training wheels" are off brand generic Felt OEM hubs, relaced with DT Swiss spokes, on Mavic CXP22 rims, 28H radial front, 32H 2 cross drive, radial non drive side. My "go fast" wheels are Mavic Aksium Race wheels 20H Radial front, 24H radial/cross rear. THe CXP22 has about 10,000 miles on them, the Aksium about 6,500. I also ride a hybrid material carbon/alu Felt F75 race geometry frame.

Based on all the posts on this form i should have broken my bike in half by now, and folded all of my wheels in half like a taco, and shredded spokes just by looking at them, and clearly i cant possibly ride the miles i do because i dont have a Brooks saddle.

I will let you take a wild guess as to how many spokes ive broken...

ANy number over zero, would be to high.

Infact, my last big off saw me hit another rider while i was doing over 30 on the flats. That front wheel dented slightly at the point of impact, and the energy transfer through the wheel (by way of properly tensioned spokes as cyccommute spoke to above) caused the rim join to break open, and the wheel made a teardrop/taco like shape. But even still...not a single spoke broken. Hell, even the tire was salvageable.

And as one of the other guys here mentioned, i bunny hop curbs, and railroad tracks, and cement pathway heaves. Still havent broken a spoke.


The name of the game is tension. You can have the most "bomb proof" wheel, and if it isnt tensioned properly, you will be blowing spokes regularly.