sci_femme

Touring bike or cyclocross - they are designed to play in less than ideal conditions. As far as IGH is concerned - derailleurs are not all that scary. Good luck.

SF

IrishBrewer

That's the ticket! If I move to a cold enough climate, I'll be going so slow, I'll be going backwards at a high rate of speed so I'll just turn in the opposite direction and be to work in no time flat.

tsl

I, for one, don't think the OP is off base WRT to desired speed.

I'm 58, have mild emphysema, several areas of partial collapse in the lungs, an arrhythmia, and one bum knee, yet I can do 17 miles in an hour with 750 feet of climbing, riding 28mm tires, with fenders, panniers, and a dyno hub. (For the record, it didn't come easily. I've worked effing hard for ten years to get this fast, and I think it's about my personal limit.)

So I don't think 20 miles and 850 feet of climbing in 1:10 is much of a stretch.

True, not everyone can commute at speeds like this, and not everyone wants to in the first place. But that's no reason to put down the new guy if that's what he's doing and he likes it.

It's the winter bit that I think is maybe a little bit off. Of course, it all depends on what you call winter. SoCal winter, or even PNW winter, is a lot different than it is here in Rochester.

I've found it's easier to think in minutes per mile, rather than in miles per hour.

3 mins/mile = 20mph
4 mins/mile = 15mph
5 mins/mile = 12mph
6 mins/mile = 10mph

Just mounting the studded tires on my bike adds one minute per mile to my times. That's on dry roads. Throw in a couple of inches of snow and some ice, and it adds another minute per mile.

For the OP currently running at 3.5 minutes per mile on a 20 mile ride (70/20=3.5), just one minute per mile adds twice his 10-minute goal amount to the ride.

I think we need a better understanding of what the OP calls winter.

Meanwhile, his spec isn't that bad for a commuter. Except for the IGH, it's what I've been running for nine years.

Personally, I think the weight/performance/maintenance equation works better for derailleur systems, but I understand the attraction to IGHs. I'd point the OP towards the 11-speed Shimano Alfine rather than the 8-speed. It's a little heavier, but I find closer ratios are important when keeping speed and cadence up is the goal.

kickstart

3800 miles of all weather commuting on my Gazelle, and to date the only maintenance its needed has been tire pressure. Its 5 minutes slower on my 16 mile RT commute compared to my road bike, but only having to do maintenance once a year is mighty nice.

dprayvd

I'm already ridin' this bike for sometime. It's a BD flatbar. Ain't gonna' talk about it though.

79pmooney

“very very low maintenance while being really really fast” Very low maintenance? Go fix gear.

“Winter is getting closer and snow might be as intense as last year” Go fix gear – best control in snow and ice by far. They also survive right side crashes and always come up working. If you have salt, they don’t care. (A could of frozen chain liknks? Slide the wheel forward a ¼”)

“Having at least 3 gears is important as I've some pretty steep climbs both ways” Get strong on hills. Consider a flip flop hub. With a road frame, a longish dropout and a chain peg, flipping the wheel (using a Pedro’s Fix Gear Tool) takes maybe two minutes and you never have to touch the chain. You’ll come out of the winter a lot stronger, I promise. Might save yourself a crash or two also.

But (you knew this was coming) do this now so you can get 1000 miles fixed under your belt before you see the bad stuff. Also get a bike that supports big tires. Lower end Japanese bikes from the early ‘80s are a great start. Horizontal dropouts, usually sized for 27” wheels so big 700cs and fenders work just fine. Get some Mafac Racer brakes. (Any old bike shop is likely to have a box of them.) They have the long reach to handle the smaller rims and have plenty of stopping power. (My all time favorite winter brake.)

And last – you want fast? Start working on the engine.

Ben

Bike Gremlin

Building yourself is a good idea.

I'd also recommend a touring frame - room for fenders, winter tyres, rack, panniers won't be struck with heels and longer rear chainstay will make ride more comfortable.

If temps don't go into deep freeze, 8 speed standard derailleur system will work fine.

PatrickGSR94

Why do you find it necessary to insult people or be otherwise snarky in almost every post you make? Everyone here is trying to be helpful to the OP but you.

OP if you want a light and fast commuter, have you considered a titanium frame bike? It sure as heck won't be cheap, but you can build one up to be quite light depending on component choices.

Do you have a budget? Your OP doesn't say, which is kind of important to know if you're wanting suggestions.

Leisesturm

Prove it. Don't cherry pick. Pick a block of my posts from date A to date B with no deletions and lets see how many are snarky and how many not. I call them as I see them. You call them as YOU see them. That's the way the wheel goes round. How have I not been helpful to the o.p.? More to the point. How have YOU been helpful in suggesting that he look into a titanium frame. Jesus wept, I am surrounded. Surrounded I tell you.

PaulRivers

Yeah, my winter bike has an IGH, but if you want something light and fast for the summer stick with a regular derailler. It's a little bit slower, little bit heavier, and my Shimano 8 speed definitely doesn't have any many gears for hills.

CliffordK

I don't worry about 10 minutes... but the OP seems to be concerned about it.

20 miles in 1 hour: 20 MPH
20 miles in 1 hour 10 min: 17 MPH

A HUGE difference for riding.

One could probably calculate watts for riding and watts for drivetrain and other losses...

I certainly have no problem with someone wanting to ride a "nice" commuter. Will they find what they desire? I don't know. I know that my Tricross stays parked most of the time since I don't like the feeling of a little extra rolling resistance, real, significant, or just perceived.

Plus, there are often reasons for a tight schedule, for example juggling two independent schedules and needing to start at one time and end at another time without an option to change either time.

charlesrg

Guys, as a beginner rider I really appreciate the help. In special the experienced riders that opened my mind about several facts.
I've been considering and comparing single speed/igh, chain/belts and checking the pro's and con's of each.
I totally agree that the most important is the engine. At the same having less drag and lighter bike would help too.
The single speed will probably make me a better rider, maybe a bit slower at the beginning but I feel the extra drag of IGH could also help me improve the engine.
I want to really thank you all. By gathering your opinions here I can build a very fast and low maintenance bike without having to spend several winters on trial and error.

I discarded the option of a pedal assisted as I feel I need to improve the engine. I agree I could still improve the engine on a pedal assisted however I could start reaching speeds that are dangerous or unsafe, I'm specially afraid of causing harm to others on the same path.

After reading all the posts I decided to browse the current bikes posted here trying to find something that matched what you guys explained and found this on the Commuter Bicycle Pics thread:



With a bit of more digging I've found this beauty and fell in love:


Looks like a bike like this is what I would need to go fast in the summer and change the tires for winter months. I understood that I might be much slower than 10 minutes during heavy snow/ice, that's okay, as long as I'm riding I will be working on the engine.

It would be really hard to put all the requirements into a single bike but I feel like giving a try on a build with the same components as the english bike:

• Alfine 11 Di2
• hydraulic brakes
• lightweight frame (some alloy composite or titanium)
• Gates Belt
• Lights will be rechargeable instead of hub as I read I can get more light output from rechargeable.

If the belt does not perform I can take it off and put a chain with a cover like this:

I will ensure the frame has good tire clearance for fenders, a good fit geometry and nice gear ratio, for that I'm playing with this bikecad drawing. Next couple days I should have the geometry set and will start ordering parts. Meanwhile I hunt the frame that will fit the stuff in or I would order the custom frame.


Thank you all, I will post updates as I get closer to it.

NormanF

Get a frame that can take 45c tires so you can run 40c tires with fenders.

It should have a relaxed frame geometry for stability. You'll get a good speed with IGH but you'll never go as fast as on a road bike. The trade-off is acceptable for a commuter bike.

Steel is best because it deadens road vibrations. Alloy doesn't do that but the road chatter can be muted with wide tires.

You'll want a tough frame that can stand up to anything an urban environment can dish out.

Good luck on your build.

CliffordK

Looks like some great ideas.

Also consider:
Versa VRS-8 and VRS-11 Shifters for the 8 & 11 speed Alfine.
The TRP HY/RD Cable actuated hydraulic brakes would work with a wider range of brake levers.

The belt drive needs specific frames, either some kind of a split seatstay, or perhaps those single tube stays on folding bikes. And, of course, either track ends, or horizontal dropouts work best with your IGH.

I've been using a bright rechargeable light. But, truthfully, it puts out too much light, and I always have to carry a spare battery. I did snag a SON dynamo hub myself, but haven't built it up yet. I'd really like the set it and forget it idea.

Do they salt the roads in your area? Titanium would be nice. But you're quickly heading into custom territory... and could easily drop a LOT of money on the bike. How is parking security at both ends of the commute?

There are a few fully custom Titanium builders around the USA, but they do get expensive quickly.
Ti Cycles :: Hand Made in Portland, Oregon USA is local here in Portland, Oregon.

My "new" Winter bike is a budget Titanium build which I'm very happy with so far, but I don't think I'd go for a few thousand dollar build

PatrickGSR94

Man that's going to be one seriously expensive build, especially with a titanium frame.

This custom Ti frameset starts at $4,300

https://fireflybicycles.com/bikes/utility-titanium

charlesrg

Firefly makes great bikes, however I can't afford it. If it was a custom carbon fiber It would be more acceptable.
Talking about carbon fiber, I thought about buying a van hawks and using the frame as it's carbon. https://www.vanhawks.com/static/img/build_black_red.jpg
However I'm almost sure Alfine Di2 won't fit on it. I have no problems with the Nuvinci however there is no nuvinci shifter for dropbars.

bobbyl1966

12 miles average speed for bike trail with elevation from 700 feet to 900 feet is low average speed or is normal. The 10 miles i do in around 50 minutes.

gregjones

Especially if you have ONE red light that you might have to stop at. Or, a stop sign to go through when a car has the right-of-way.

It's a bike.......light, strong and cheap. Pick two. You don't get all three. Call the government to help you if you think that you can.

Low maintenance, super-fast......and a commuter.

Dream on.

gregjones

Just the way it is. Don't blame me.

NormanF

I would say if you're going to run IGH - either go carbon fiber or aluminum. Keeping the frame weight down is important because the hub is already heavy. You want it to ride smooth and fast like a derailleur bike.

The other consideration is you want a neutral, urban geometry for a relaxed and comfortable ride. You want the seat and fork stays to have generous clearance for up 45 c tires and fenders.

No - the changes won't make it as fast as a road bike but it will be comfortable, stable and handle well under load. There's your ideal commuter bike in a nutshell.

charlesrg

What about Titanium, would it be heavier than Aluminum ? I found no frame available in carbon that would fit a belt drive with di2.

NormanF

No - and I suspect to get what you want with titanium/carbon, you'll have to go custom to fit a belt drive with di2.

CliffordK

Have you decided on a budget.

There are custom and semi-custom CF manufactures that you could contact.

Calfree and Parlee come to mind.

I can't imagine they would be cheap

You can also get Titanium and Stainless custom frames from various builders, generally not cheap either.

You can think of wanting to "make up" a few pounds from the IGH investment. Or, you could also just decide that now you've added an extra kg or so with the IGH, to sweat the milligrams.

HardyWeinberg

When I hear "low maintenance" two things pop into my head: fixie, and belt-drive. Belt-drive goes w/ igh more than fixie, lightweight goes w/ fixie more than igh. Ultrafast, well, the fixie makes you go at the speed it is geared to so ultrafast is definitely possible.

rmfnla

Low-maintenance to me means using quality components.

I built a steel road frame (Curtlo) up flat-bat style with Dura Ace and XT components (and SRAM Force brakes, don't like Shimano brakes).

Riding weight is 23 lbs (w/ lights, pump, Brooks Flyer saddle and saddle bag with tools) but as a road frame it's plenty fast and it rarely needs attention...