Heel Strike. MegaRack XL to the rescue?
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Ok, newbie poster with a situation:
Recently moved back to Chicago and am refitting a 1999 Gary Fisher Marlin for use as a commuter.
I've got two problems: I'm 6'4", size 13 shoe; and obviously the bike has a shorter chainstay length.
I've just thrown on:
A Performance Transit Rack
A pair of Performance Transit Pro Panniers
I've moved the panniers as far back as they'll go an am still skinning my heels. I'm not too worried about going too far back on the bike from a weight balance perspective since I don't plan on carrying a load worthy of touring, but I do need to take enough stuff to shower, change, perhaps some work materials.
I've investigated various racks and bags. My first hope was to just get an extended rack, like the Jandd Expedition Rack, but at ~$60, before I start dropping coin on a rack intended for touring, I'm just wondering if there is something that'll better suit my needs and my wallet.
So, I came across the Delta MegaRack XL. For ~$30.
My questions:
Ok, I've rambled enoough. I appreciate everyone bearing with me. I've been pondering this topic fairly incessantly for a few days now. I hope to have some resolution soon, if for no other reason than to give my wife some peace and quiet.
Regards,
Sam
Recently moved back to Chicago and am refitting a 1999 Gary Fisher Marlin for use as a commuter.
I've got two problems: I'm 6'4", size 13 shoe; and obviously the bike has a shorter chainstay length.
I've just thrown on:
A Performance Transit Rack
A pair of Performance Transit Pro Panniers
I've moved the panniers as far back as they'll go an am still skinning my heels. I'm not too worried about going too far back on the bike from a weight balance perspective since I don't plan on carrying a load worthy of touring, but I do need to take enough stuff to shower, change, perhaps some work materials.
I've investigated various racks and bags. My first hope was to just get an extended rack, like the Jandd Expedition Rack, but at ~$60, before I start dropping coin on a rack intended for touring, I'm just wondering if there is something that'll better suit my needs and my wallet.
So, I came across the Delta MegaRack XL. For ~$30.
My questions:
- The MegaRack seems to have a rounded end to the rack, and I'm afraid that this is going to effectively negate the benefits of the additional 2" on the XL? Does anyone have any experience with this rack that can speak to it, and potentially what the actual, usable, dimensions are once you take out that rounding?
- Does anyone have any recommendations or ideas for a longer rack aside from these two? I'm considering Delta bags as well, to try and get a bag with the heel knock out on the corners, but again, before I spend heavy money on touring grade stuff, I'd like to know the options.
- Finally, I've read the other threads on this topic of heel strike. I'm just generally wondering if the extended length of the racks are what cause them to cost more (eg, Jandd), or if there is also some added "beefiness" that is being added to such racks with the expected additional load for additional rack space?
Ok, I've rambled enoough. I appreciate everyone bearing with me. I've been pondering this topic fairly incessantly for a few days now. I hope to have some resolution soon, if for no other reason than to give my wife some peace and quiet.
Regards,
Sam
Last edited by gwaereth; 06-07-05 at 04:05 PM.
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I am no expert, and don't have personal experience with either rack. I have the same heel strike problem you do though, as I am the same height with size 13's also. The Jandd is going to be one of my next purchases. From looking at the Delta model I don't think that it will offer as much room to move the panniers back. For me one of the key features of the Jandd is the long section near the bottom that makes it easy for a variety of mounting positions. The only other racks I can find that offer that flexibility are even more expensive than the Jandd.
My current solution is a cheap one. I have a Blackburn Mtn-1 on my old moutain bike. I got some fairly large zip ties and used them for bag stops, just behind the vertical support on the rack. That keeps the bags back far enough to miss my heels. But the hook and bungee mounting system didn't like the off center mounting and the hook next to the zip tie would twist and the whole thing would come loose. The panniers are old and mediocre but the price was right (free) so I didn't mind messing with them. I just took the hook off one end and mounted it a little over an inch towards the rear. So far so good. The only drawback I have found is that the panniers are dedicated to use on one side of the bike only now.
The Jandd stuff is expensive (relatively) but they have always been good quality. Plus they used to make all of their products in the US, though that has changed some recently with their bags at least. I still think they make very solid designs that focus on practicality. One of my favorite Jandd products that I own is their nylon & velcro ankle strap. I have been using it for around 15 years and it is still going strong. I can adjust it with one hand while riding if necessary, the velcro is still good after all these years and the reflective material has stood up to scuffs very well. It was 4 or 5 times more expensive than the generic ones but has outlasted them by the same factor, and works better.
My current solution is a cheap one. I have a Blackburn Mtn-1 on my old moutain bike. I got some fairly large zip ties and used them for bag stops, just behind the vertical support on the rack. That keeps the bags back far enough to miss my heels. But the hook and bungee mounting system didn't like the off center mounting and the hook next to the zip tie would twist and the whole thing would come loose. The panniers are old and mediocre but the price was right (free) so I didn't mind messing with them. I just took the hook off one end and mounted it a little over an inch towards the rear. So far so good. The only drawback I have found is that the panniers are dedicated to use on one side of the bike only now.
The Jandd stuff is expensive (relatively) but they have always been good quality. Plus they used to make all of their products in the US, though that has changed some recently with their bags at least. I still think they make very solid designs that focus on practicality. One of my favorite Jandd products that I own is their nylon & velcro ankle strap. I have been using it for around 15 years and it is still going strong. I can adjust it with one hand while riding if necessary, the velcro is still good after all these years and the reflective material has stood up to scuffs very well. It was 4 or 5 times more expensive than the generic ones but has outlasted them by the same factor, and works better.
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Originally Posted by Alloy Addict
The Jandd stuff is expensive (relatively) but they have always been good quality. Plus they used to make all of their products in the US, though that has changed some recently with their bags at least. I still think they make very solid designs that focus on practicality.
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The last bag I bought from them said something like "Designed in USA, Made in Mexico."
Woohoo! At least an American designer kept his job I guess.
Woohoo! At least an American designer kept his job I guess.
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Damn, I was going to tell you to buy the Nashbar Commuter Rack but I can't find it anymore on their website. It was nearly square in back and had a HELL of an extension on the front and bottom for sizing. I've also got 13's and my "cargo bike" is a compact frame mtb which just makes the problem worse. The nashbar rack had a set of extendable struts on the bottom that were nearly twice the length on their other racks. I really like the design of the delta tho having seen one a while back. If I had to do it again I'd probably go with one of those.
As for panniers I don't have any real recommendations other than check how stiff the plastic inserts are. I had a pair from REI with inserts that got fairly floppy on hot days (not normally a problem in anchorage). Well last summer it got above 80 degrees and my panniers got so floppy that they wrapped around the bottom of the rack on a bump and got sucked into the rear wheel. I'd personally pick up a pair from a LBS. They'll probably let you try them out to see how they fit on your bike, you can check how easy it is to change their mounting position and I seriously doubt the price is going to be significantly different when you factor in shipping and getting a perfect fit the first time.
As for panniers I don't have any real recommendations other than check how stiff the plastic inserts are. I had a pair from REI with inserts that got fairly floppy on hot days (not normally a problem in anchorage). Well last summer it got above 80 degrees and my panniers got so floppy that they wrapped around the bottom of the rack on a bump and got sucked into the rear wheel. I'd personally pick up a pair from a LBS. They'll probably let you try them out to see how they fit on your bike, you can check how easy it is to change their mounting position and I seriously doubt the price is going to be significantly different when you factor in shipping and getting a perfect fit the first time.
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I bought the Jannd a year ago, I'm very happy, can't get a heel/bag hit if I wanted to. It's excellent, can't get a foot/bag hit if I wanted to. Mine is on a 26" commuter, I don't know if there's a 700C version.
Cheers,
Ed
Cheers,
Ed
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Howdy all,
Thanks for the updates, thoughts, and recommendations. At least I know I'm not alone
Something I've found, which I'm currently investigating and wanted to throw out.
I've found these:
Axiom Odysée, 382mm x 145mm Platform Area
Axiom Journey, 390mm x 150mm Platform Area
Now, since Axiom is a Canadian company, it took some digging to find an internet reseller in the US that carries the racks, in addition to their bags. Found one out of San Diego, CA:
AirBomb
Now, 390mm = 15.35 inches, which is an additional 2 inches off of the Performance Transit Rack I now have. Once more, according to AirBomb, these suckers only cost ~$20. Am I missing something?
The other threads I've found here generally speak well of Axiom. For instance:
Axiom Journey Rear Rack- It's Cheap But Is It Of Decent Quality?
Wondering if there is any experience out there with either of these models from a heel strike persepective. Seems to be fairly well regarded in Canada.
I think my LBS has these, but they are closed today, so I'll have to check tomorrow.
Anyway, just wanted to throw all that out there for the collective good.
Regards,
Sam
Thanks for the updates, thoughts, and recommendations. At least I know I'm not alone
Something I've found, which I'm currently investigating and wanted to throw out.
I've found these:
Axiom Odysée, 382mm x 145mm Platform Area
Axiom Journey, 390mm x 150mm Platform Area
Now, since Axiom is a Canadian company, it took some digging to find an internet reseller in the US that carries the racks, in addition to their bags. Found one out of San Diego, CA:
AirBomb
Now, 390mm = 15.35 inches, which is an additional 2 inches off of the Performance Transit Rack I now have. Once more, according to AirBomb, these suckers only cost ~$20. Am I missing something?
The other threads I've found here generally speak well of Axiom. For instance:
Axiom Journey Rear Rack- It's Cheap But Is It Of Decent Quality?
Wondering if there is any experience out there with either of these models from a heel strike persepective. Seems to be fairly well regarded in Canada.
I think my LBS has these, but they are closed today, so I'll have to check tomorrow.
Anyway, just wanted to throw all that out there for the collective good.
Regards,
Sam
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Well I went to my favorite LBS again yesterday shopping for a car rack, which is even more confusing than pannier racks. They have the Jandd racks (Expedition and a lighter one) and they have the Delta Mega XL. The Delta was nice, and verrry light, but I don't think that it would help with heel strikes because of all the reasons mentioned. It was nice to be able to compare the racks side by side. The Jandd is definitely heavier. It was assembled in Mexico. Don't get me wrong I have nothing against Mexico or any other country, but if a product is going to be made in a country with much cheaper labor I would like to see at least a bit of a price drop. I guess the quality of the end product is the most important thing.
Those Axiom racks look nice, I will have to do some research. For the price I think they would be great on the grocery/errand bike I am refurbing.
Those Axiom racks look nice, I will have to do some research. For the price I think they would be great on the grocery/errand bike I am refurbing.
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Originally Posted by Alloy Addict
For the price I think they would be great on the grocery/errand bike I am refurbing.
Thanks for looking around at the Delta XL, much appreciated.
Regards,
Sam
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gwaereth, another option might be to re-attach the mounting hooks on your current panniers. I ride a converted '89 converted Rockhopper Comp. It is a 16" frame and the chainstays are really short. I found the Cannondale bags AND the Performance bags both hit my heals. I remounted the hooks on both and had no problems. Just an idea before spending more money.
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Just bought the Axiom Journey, and the Axion Cartier pannier bags last night. Not gonna have a chance to put em on till this afternoon. But, at the same price as the Performance equipment, thus far I'm encouraged. I'll be sure to post a review and some thoughts once I get them on and have given them a spin.
jharte: thanks for the thoughts. I had considered some "surgery," but considering how close I was to having clearance, I figured just a slightly different set up would get the job done. Besides, the Performance gear is getting returned, so hopefully I'll only be spending, literally $10, more.
Regards
jharte: thanks for the thoughts. I had considered some "surgery," but considering how close I was to having clearance, I figured just a slightly different set up would get the job done. Besides, the Performance gear is getting returned, so hopefully I'll only be spending, literally $10, more.
Regards
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Alfred E Bike (aebike.com) sells the Axiom racks as well as their panniers. I have an Odyssee on my MTB/commuter and put a Journey on my son's bike for an upcoming trip. I also had heel strike problems (not as severe - size 8 shoes but a smaller frame makes up for it) and the Axiom racks solved it.
The Odysee is more adjustable than the Journey; the Journey has a solid splash plate that helps a little if you don't have a rear fender. Both racks have a very adjustable mounting system for the front stays. It may be more difficult to use taller panniers that have a bungee cord or strap and hook (Performance Transit Pro and Epics, Jandd Economy, and ironically, some of the Axiom panniers) on the Odysee. There is less distance on the Odysee between the top of the rack and the swoopy lower bar; depending on where you want to hook the pannier, the strap or bungee cord may be too long. The Odysee has an adjustable plate for hooking a pannier near the lower mount point, and this is what I usually use. The Journey rack is "taller" in this respect and may better accomodate "tall" panniers. Rack rods are 10mm diameter, this could be a problem for hooks on cheaper panniers designed for a thinner rack.
Both racks are well made, seem to hold very heavy loads, and are economical.
The Odysee is more adjustable than the Journey; the Journey has a solid splash plate that helps a little if you don't have a rear fender. Both racks have a very adjustable mounting system for the front stays. It may be more difficult to use taller panniers that have a bungee cord or strap and hook (Performance Transit Pro and Epics, Jandd Economy, and ironically, some of the Axiom panniers) on the Odysee. There is less distance on the Odysee between the top of the rack and the swoopy lower bar; depending on where you want to hook the pannier, the strap or bungee cord may be too long. The Odysee has an adjustable plate for hooking a pannier near the lower mount point, and this is what I usually use. The Journey rack is "taller" in this respect and may better accomodate "tall" panniers. Rack rods are 10mm diameter, this could be a problem for hooks on cheaper panniers designed for a thinner rack.
Both racks are well made, seem to hold very heavy loads, and are economical.
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Ok, appologies for the delay in the review, been traveling a bit.
All in all, I'm very pleased with the Axiom Journey rack and Cartier Panniers.
I definitely think that the Journey rack gives you a good bit of the length of the Jandd expedition rack, but at considerably less cost. It's not quite as long as the Jandd, but should help most of those out there with heel strike issues. Combined with the panniers, and my heel strike issues are well solved. I gained a great deal of heel clearance with this combination. On top of the sheer length and solidity of the construction, the engineering around the mounting of the rack to the frame is much more elegant, with articulating attachment points that move and adapt much better to the bike frame.
As for the panniers, I just like them better, they seem less "billowy." Not sure how to describe really. I guess in comparison the Performance Pro Panniers, which just seemed to have a lot of fabric, and not a lot of shape. Admittedly, I think that the Performance Pros are bigger for the same cost, the Axioms just seem tidier.
I would strongly encourage anyone to pursue Axiom racks and bags as a solid commuter set up.
Hope that was clear enough, if anyone has any specific questions, please feel free to write!
Regards,
Sam
All in all, I'm very pleased with the Axiom Journey rack and Cartier Panniers.
I definitely think that the Journey rack gives you a good bit of the length of the Jandd expedition rack, but at considerably less cost. It's not quite as long as the Jandd, but should help most of those out there with heel strike issues. Combined with the panniers, and my heel strike issues are well solved. I gained a great deal of heel clearance with this combination. On top of the sheer length and solidity of the construction, the engineering around the mounting of the rack to the frame is much more elegant, with articulating attachment points that move and adapt much better to the bike frame.
As for the panniers, I just like them better, they seem less "billowy." Not sure how to describe really. I guess in comparison the Performance Pro Panniers, which just seemed to have a lot of fabric, and not a lot of shape. Admittedly, I think that the Performance Pros are bigger for the same cost, the Axioms just seem tidier.
I would strongly encourage anyone to pursue Axiom racks and bags as a solid commuter set up.
Hope that was clear enough, if anyone has any specific questions, please feel free to write!
Regards,
Sam
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Originally Posted by MichaelW
You can reduce heel strike if your pannier has a heel cutout rather than a square or rectangular side profile.
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gwaereth, I was looking at picking up the Appalachian panniers from Axiom, have you had any experience with them? I believe they are part of the Transit series. www.axiomgear.com/bags_panniers/appalachian.php
Last edited by Crazy Cyclist; 06-20-05 at 05:41 PM.
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Originally Posted by Crazy Cyclist
gwaereth, I was looking at picking up the Appalachian panniers from Axiom, have you had any experience with them? I believe they are part of the Transit series. www.axiomgear.com/bags_panniers/appalachian.php
It's odd, I think that the volume measurements on the web site, for the appalachian, the volume is listed total, because they are a single unit that saddle bags over the back. For the rest though, the volume is listed per bag, because they are technically separated and usable singly. I could be wrong, but lemme know what you do and how they work for you.
Regards,
Sam
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gwaereth, what would be a good size cubic dimension? I don't do any touring or anything like that, I usually ride only only in the city and once in a while I may go outside of the city for a couple of hours. I didn't know that the Appalachian's could be used singly, if I pick them up I will let you know how they work. There is a handle of top of them, that must be so that you can carry them when you are off the bike.
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CC, to be perfectly honest, I'm just getting learned on this whole pannier/commuting thing myself. As such, I am far from the expert on panniers and optimal volume for this or that.
As point of clarification, I don't think the Appalachians can be broken apart. Rather, I think that the two bags are connected by the fabric that sits on top of the rack. In that sense, they are pure saddle bags, a single unit which straddles the rack, with a bag sitting on either side.
As for what can be carried. In the 2 Cartiers, here's what I carry:
#1, jeans (remember, I'm a big guy, so these aren't small...) , skivies, socks, undershirt, overshirt (polo, etc.), locker lock (eg, Master Lock)
#2, regular towel, shampoo, soap, deodorant, ulock, shackle.
Generally speaking, there is plenty of room, and I am not coming anywhere near "stuffing" the bags. I'm sure there is more I could get in there if I really wanted/needed to.
If you need the bags for commuting (eg, need to have a change of clothes and grooming supplies), the Cartiers give you a nice amount of space, and some overage, in case it's ever needed. If you need it for around town hauling, and carrying, then the Appalachians might do you just fine. I think that I ultimately steered away from the Appalachians because you cannot separate them. Meaning, if you ever wanted to put a bigger bag on one side, or a grocery bag on one side and a normal bag on ther other, you were out of luck.
Ok, my 2 cents... or 99
Regards,
Sam
As point of clarification, I don't think the Appalachians can be broken apart. Rather, I think that the two bags are connected by the fabric that sits on top of the rack. In that sense, they are pure saddle bags, a single unit which straddles the rack, with a bag sitting on either side.
As for what can be carried. In the 2 Cartiers, here's what I carry:
#1, jeans (remember, I'm a big guy, so these aren't small...) , skivies, socks, undershirt, overshirt (polo, etc.), locker lock (eg, Master Lock)
#2, regular towel, shampoo, soap, deodorant, ulock, shackle.
Generally speaking, there is plenty of room, and I am not coming anywhere near "stuffing" the bags. I'm sure there is more I could get in there if I really wanted/needed to.
If you need the bags for commuting (eg, need to have a change of clothes and grooming supplies), the Cartiers give you a nice amount of space, and some overage, in case it's ever needed. If you need it for around town hauling, and carrying, then the Appalachians might do you just fine. I think that I ultimately steered away from the Appalachians because you cannot separate them. Meaning, if you ever wanted to put a bigger bag on one side, or a grocery bag on one side and a normal bag on ther other, you were out of luck.
Ok, my 2 cents... or 99
Regards,
Sam
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Thanks Sam. I might still pick up the Cartier's as I am new to panniers as well. You are right about the Appalachians being a single unit they cannot come apart. I will look closely at both when it comes time to buy, thanks again for all of your help.
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Originally Posted by Crazy Cyclist
I will look closely at both when it comes time to buy, thanks again for all of your help.
Good Luck!
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Sam, when I was at the bike shop picking up my bike after having it repaired, I put the Appalachian panniers on my rack just to see how they would fit and they fit pretty good, I didn't try the Cartier's though, but I will try them out before I buy, after all you don't buy the cow without trying the milk.