Anyone know of any great analytical tools for comparing commuting costs?
#1
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Anyone know of any great analytical tools for comparing commuting costs?
Anyone run across any spreadsheet, or tool, which compares the total cost of ownership of motor vehicle vs bicycle for a commute vehicle?
I ran across one sheet that is interesting but is incomplete as written to promote cycle-commuting and not to show true cost differences.
I ran across one sheet that is interesting but is incomplete as written to promote cycle-commuting and not to show true cost differences.
#2
No one carries the DogBoy
Since everything is so rider specific, I think your best bet is to do it yourself. Excel is a good tool, but you have to do the anaylsis on your own. The number of variates is just too great to analyze in a generic format. For example, how much do you spend on the bike/car, how much does it cost to insure the car, will you need the car anyway or would you get rid of the car, What is the useful life of your car/bike, how much is maint. on your car/bike, how much cycling specific stuff will you buy (jerseys, shorts etc), how rough are your roads (leads to increased use of tires/tubes/CO2 cartridges etc.), will you ride at night...how long at night? If you get rid of hte car, how much will it cost on days when you can't/don't commute (bus/cab fare)...figuring all that out and putting it into one spreadsheet is almost guaranteed to not reflect your situation fully unless you are the one who puts it together.
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Plus the cost of the fuel for the HPV. Just hoped someone had done it already. Doesn't seem like rocket science. Just takes time to create a tool. Wonder if anyone else would be interested in having such a tool available?
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Not really, but seeing as my truck gets 20mpg i save about 5 bucks for every day i dont drive it. I dont eat out for lunch anymore either so theres another 20-25 dollars a weeks savings also. Between the two, the money saved will pay the monthly note on a upcomming motorcycle purchase which will continue the savings since i wont have to drive my truck except on the most severe days. Instead of 40+ dollars a week for gas it'll be more like $40 dollars a month. Between gas and eating lunch out, i figure the saving to be around $200 dollars a month. Thats no small amount.
In 2006, i plan to actually track all this for one year.
In 2006, i plan to actually track all this for one year.
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#5
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It's not really possible to come up with a universal definition of cost for either a bicycle or a car. Are we talking average cost, or marginal cost? Averaged over what time period? For what pattern of use? For most drivers, the biggest single cost over the life of a car is depreciation, which is substantial when a car is new and nominal when it is old -- and only modestly affected by mileage. Depreciation also happens whether you drive the car or not. Bikes cost almost nothing to run in warm dry weather, but wear out quickly under adverse conditions -- it is not inconcievable to spend a dollar a mile keeping a bike going in snowy urban conditions.
#7
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The simplest tool would just use your car's mileage per gallon, the going gas rate, and how many miles you bike per week that would have been car miles. If you want to get more into, you can start in with counting up accessories for biking versus car maintenance/depreciation/insurance (if you go carless). The biggest problem is the assumptions you'd have to make. Would you be as healthy overall without biking? How much would the medical attention have cost had you needed it? Would you have gotten into a car accident if you drove instead of biking through the winter? Depending on how you look at it, you could make the bike look like a very attractive option.
One last note, if you use your bike accessories/clothing for any riding besides commuting, then you can't technically count the full purchase price towards your cost of commuting. Same thing for the bike actually. Since we're biased against cars, these rules don't apply there
One last note, if you use your bike accessories/clothing for any riding besides commuting, then you can't technically count the full purchase price towards your cost of commuting. Same thing for the bike actually. Since we're biased against cars, these rules don't apply there
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It is a very person-specific thing.
Money spent on Bike vs Money spent on Car
Varies based on $0 Garbage-Picked to $1600 Hybrid vs $100 Curbside-Splendor vs $60,000 H2
Money spent on additional eating vs Money spent on gas
Again, varies based on how much you change your habits.
Money spent on maintenence
"As long as it runs" vs "A Well-Oiled Machine"
It wouldn't be too hard to make, but it would be hard to accuratly track the changes
Money spent on Bike vs Money spent on Car
Varies based on $0 Garbage-Picked to $1600 Hybrid vs $100 Curbside-Splendor vs $60,000 H2
Money spent on additional eating vs Money spent on gas
Again, varies based on how much you change your habits.
Money spent on maintenence
"As long as it runs" vs "A Well-Oiled Machine"
It wouldn't be too hard to make, but it would be hard to accuratly track the changes
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Originally Posted by HiYoSilver
Anyone run across any spreadsheet, or tool, which compares the total cost of ownership of motor vehicle vs bicycle for a commute vehicle?
I ran across one sheet that is interesting but is incomplete as written to promote cycle-commuting and not to show true cost differences.
I ran across one sheet that is interesting but is incomplete as written to promote cycle-commuting and not to show true cost differences.
https://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/advocacy/autocost.htm
or this........
https://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/commute/quadrupl.htm
#10
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Close, those are the pages that got me thinking but I lost the URL when I closed without thinking first.
Without fudging the numbers for a 10 mile round trip, I can't get bike to come out cheaper than car.
They both come about $.50 per mile. The problem is the commute is so short and the car expenses are reasonable, only if assume replace the car at much higher costs in 4 years does it look better for bike. Then the depreciation for a car kicks in and shoots the cost high. Yet the car probably has another 4 to 5 years to go before it needs to be retired or replaced.
Without fudging the numbers for a 10 mile round trip, I can't get bike to come out cheaper than car.
They both come about $.50 per mile. The problem is the commute is so short and the car expenses are reasonable, only if assume replace the car at much higher costs in 4 years does it look better for bike. Then the depreciation for a car kicks in and shoots the cost high. Yet the car probably has another 4 to 5 years to go before it needs to be retired or replaced.
#11
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Originally Posted by HiYoSilver
Close, those are the pages that got me thinking but I lost the URL when I closed without thinking first.
Without fudging the numbers for a 10 mile round trip, I can't get bike to come out cheaper than car.
They both come about $.50 per mile. The problem is the commute is so short and the car expenses are reasonable, only if assume replace the car at much higher costs in 4 years does it look better for bike. Then the depreciation for a car kicks in and shoots the cost high. Yet the car probably has another 4 to 5 years to go before it needs to be retired or replaced.
Without fudging the numbers for a 10 mile round trip, I can't get bike to come out cheaper than car.
They both come about $.50 per mile. The problem is the commute is so short and the car expenses are reasonable, only if assume replace the car at much higher costs in 4 years does it look better for bike. Then the depreciation for a car kicks in and shoots the cost high. Yet the car probably has another 4 to 5 years to go before it needs to be retired or replaced.
For a car, you must replace every 2 years:
Spark Plugs
Tires
Every 5 years or so:
Spark Plug Wires
Distributor Cap
Timing Belt
Plus mucho other stuff
For bike, you've got tires ($25 or so for a set, with tubes, if you shop around)
Chain ($20)
Cassette (every few chains, $40 or so)
Anything else, really?
Car costs rise dramatically due to mainetance, insurance. How does your bike cost $.50/mile?
#12
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I'm open to suggestions, where are costs off? Comparing ONLY commute costs.
I could only get numbers to come out "good" with adding in cost of financing car and not bike and in adding health club membership costs and exercise times to match cycling time
Assumptions:
Commute: 10 miles round trip
vacation and holidays: 20 days/year
Cycle-commuter: 4/5 days
Annual commute distance: 2,064 miles
AutoCommuter A- auto
=================
Purchase price: 23,000
Annual mileage: 11,000
Fuel: $3.00 / gallon
Maintenance/yr: $600
Avg speed: 23 mph
Summary
~~~~~
Dollars: $1,919 /yr
Road time: 90 hrs/yr
Labor time: 53 hrs/yr
exercise time: 192 hrs/yr [ 4 days a week ]
TIME PER YEAR: 335 hrs
PER COMMUTE MILE: $0.93
CycloCommuter B- moderate bike
==============================
Purchase price: $1,100
Bike stuff: $550
Fuel: not calculated, but probably should be about $1.00/day
Maintenance/yr: $100 [[ probably low ]]
Avg speed: 14 mph
Summary
~~~~~~~
Dollars: $925 /yr [ 2 year life ]
Road time: 147 hrs/yr
Labor time: 40 hrs/yr
exercise time: 0 hrs/yr [ 4 days a week ]
TIME PER YEAR: 188
PER COMMUTE MILE: $0.45
Annual cost savings over motor commute: $994
Monthly time savings: 12.23 hrs
CycloCommuter C- excellent bike
==============================
Purchase price: $4,000
Bike stuff: $0 [not calculated, probably $300/yr ]
Fuel: not calculated, but probably should be about $1.50/day
Maintenance/yr: $100 [[ probably low ]]
Avg speed: 17 mph
Summary
~~~~~~~
Dollars: $1,100 /yr [ 4 year life ]
Road time: 121 hrs/yr
Labor time: 45 hrs/yr
exercise time: 0 hrs/yr [ 4 days a week ]
TIME PER YEAR: 166 hrs
PER COMMUTE MILE: $0.53
Annual cost savings over motor commute: $819
Monthly time savings: 14.03 hrs
I could only get numbers to come out "good" with adding in cost of financing car and not bike and in adding health club membership costs and exercise times to match cycling time
Assumptions:
Commute: 10 miles round trip
vacation and holidays: 20 days/year
Cycle-commuter: 4/5 days
Annual commute distance: 2,064 miles
AutoCommuter A- auto
=================
Purchase price: 23,000
Annual mileage: 11,000
Fuel: $3.00 / gallon
Maintenance/yr: $600
Avg speed: 23 mph
Summary
~~~~~
Dollars: $1,919 /yr
Road time: 90 hrs/yr
Labor time: 53 hrs/yr
exercise time: 192 hrs/yr [ 4 days a week ]
TIME PER YEAR: 335 hrs
PER COMMUTE MILE: $0.93
CycloCommuter B- moderate bike
==============================
Purchase price: $1,100
Bike stuff: $550
Fuel: not calculated, but probably should be about $1.00/day
Maintenance/yr: $100 [[ probably low ]]
Avg speed: 14 mph
Summary
~~~~~~~
Dollars: $925 /yr [ 2 year life ]
Road time: 147 hrs/yr
Labor time: 40 hrs/yr
exercise time: 0 hrs/yr [ 4 days a week ]
TIME PER YEAR: 188
PER COMMUTE MILE: $0.45
Annual cost savings over motor commute: $994
Monthly time savings: 12.23 hrs
CycloCommuter C- excellent bike
==============================
Purchase price: $4,000
Bike stuff: $0 [not calculated, probably $300/yr ]
Fuel: not calculated, but probably should be about $1.50/day
Maintenance/yr: $100 [[ probably low ]]
Avg speed: 17 mph
Summary
~~~~~~~
Dollars: $1,100 /yr [ 4 year life ]
Road time: 121 hrs/yr
Labor time: 45 hrs/yr
exercise time: 0 hrs/yr [ 4 days a week ]
TIME PER YEAR: 166 hrs
PER COMMUTE MILE: $0.53
Annual cost savings over motor commute: $819
Monthly time savings: 14.03 hrs
#13
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Interesting. The commute may be too short. If increase commute to 20 mile round trip it looks great for a cyclo-commuter.
Dollar costs:
Auto: $.81/mile.
Cyclo-commuter B- $.22/mile
Cyclo-commuterC- $27/mile.
Time costs:
Auto: 466 hrs/yr
cyclo.commuter B : 336 hrs
cyclo.commuter C: 287 hrs
Dollar costs:
Auto: $.81/mile.
Cyclo-commuter B- $.22/mile
Cyclo-commuterC- $27/mile.
Time costs:
Auto: 466 hrs/yr
cyclo.commuter B : 336 hrs
cyclo.commuter C: 287 hrs
#14
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My wife and I did a similar calculation. We didn't even ditch the car for the whole year in our calculation. And, we didn't even use a bike! We used a scooter instead.
Our calculation went something like this:
- The car would be garaged for 8 months per year, and taken off insurance
- The scooter would be taken off insurance for the 4 months the car is being used (winter)
- The car would be driven 75km/week in the four months it is used
- The scooter would be driven 75km/week in the two months when it is too cold to bike, but warm enough to use the scooter
- The scooter would be driven 20km/week in the six months when I can commute by bike as well
- The car gets about 23 mpg, or 10km/L
- The scooter gets 66 mpg, or about 28km/L (this is a low-ball figure, I've read claims of 70+ mpg)
- Gas prices are an average $1.10/L (gas isn't this expensive yet, but looking forward a year, it will probably be more)
- We would save about $250 a year in depreciation on the car, based on reduced mileage and wear&tear
- Insurance on the scooter is about $90/month less than the car
- We did not factor in mainentance costs on the car, since most of the damage would be done to it during the winter, when it will be driven regardless.
We combined all that and figures we'd save over $1000 a year by switching to a scooter. Oddly enough, it's cheaper to ride a scooter for eight months (at the above stated 20km/week) than it is to drive the car for six months, and ride a bike exclusively for the other six!!
It's funny because the scooter would only use $140 in gas for those six months. That's the price of a helmet and some new tires...
Our calculation went something like this:
- The car would be garaged for 8 months per year, and taken off insurance
- The scooter would be taken off insurance for the 4 months the car is being used (winter)
- The car would be driven 75km/week in the four months it is used
- The scooter would be driven 75km/week in the two months when it is too cold to bike, but warm enough to use the scooter
- The scooter would be driven 20km/week in the six months when I can commute by bike as well
- The car gets about 23 mpg, or 10km/L
- The scooter gets 66 mpg, or about 28km/L (this is a low-ball figure, I've read claims of 70+ mpg)
- Gas prices are an average $1.10/L (gas isn't this expensive yet, but looking forward a year, it will probably be more)
- We would save about $250 a year in depreciation on the car, based on reduced mileage and wear&tear
- Insurance on the scooter is about $90/month less than the car
- We did not factor in mainentance costs on the car, since most of the damage would be done to it during the winter, when it will be driven regardless.
We combined all that and figures we'd save over $1000 a year by switching to a scooter. Oddly enough, it's cheaper to ride a scooter for eight months (at the above stated 20km/week) than it is to drive the car for six months, and ride a bike exclusively for the other six!!
It's funny because the scooter would only use $140 in gas for those six months. That's the price of a helmet and some new tires...
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What does this hypothetical cyclocommuter do on the fifth day?
Why such a high labor time on the car? For $600/yr on my car, someone else is doing the work.
What about a 'moderate car' option? E.g. 2nd hand, 2-4 year old, under $10K with associated lower depreciation, bump up the maintenance budget a little bit.
Why such a high labor time on the car? For $600/yr on my car, someone else is doing the work.
What about a 'moderate car' option? E.g. 2nd hand, 2-4 year old, under $10K with associated lower depreciation, bump up the maintenance budget a little bit.
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Originally Posted by HiYoSilver
Interesting. The commute may be too short. If increase commute to 20 mile round trip it looks great for a cyclo-commuter.
Dollar costs:
Auto: $.81/mile.
Cyclo-commuter B- $.22/mile
Cyclo-commuterC- $27/mile.
Time costs:
Auto: 466 hrs/yr
cyclo.commuter B : 336 hrs
cyclo.commuter C: 287 hrs
Dollar costs:
Auto: $.81/mile.
Cyclo-commuter B- $.22/mile
Cyclo-commuterC- $27/mile.
Time costs:
Auto: 466 hrs/yr
cyclo.commuter B : 336 hrs
cyclo.commuter C: 287 hrs
Ha, I just calculated the $/mile for gas alone on a scooter, it comes to 3.8 cents. Of course, you have to buy the $2000 scooter first....
#17
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Originally Posted by Stubacca
What does this hypothetical cyclocommuter do on the fifth day?
Why such a high labor time on the car? For $600/yr on my car, someone else is doing the work.
What about a 'moderate car' option? E.g. 2nd hand, 2-4 year old, under $10K with associated lower depreciation, bump up the maintenance budget a little bit.
Last edited by HiYoSilver; 08-25-05 at 04:25 PM.
#18
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Originally Posted by jeff-o
Ha, I just calculated the $/mile for gas alone on a scooter, it comes to 3.8 cents. Of course, you have to buy the $2000 scooter first....
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Originally Posted by HiYoSilver
auto commute. Assuming not commuting on snow and meeting days. I've been hitting about every day in last 2 months, but come sept I have to start driving one day a week to meet morning commitments.
2 factors: time cost to you to earn $600 for paying others to fix the beast and maintenance time costs. Probably too low only 30 minutes for cleaning, and driving to repair shops time
Depreciation is not lower, just the total.
I think I'm not understanding how you're coming up with your yearly cost e.g. the $1919 for the car. For the bike, you're including the purchase price of the bike and estimating it depreciates to nothing over 2 years, right? How are you factoring in the purchase price/depreciation for the car to get the $1919 per year?
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Not sure of the total amount of money I am saving by commuting three days a week. The other two days, I drive my Corolla. But, I haven't even started my Suburban in two weeks, so today I drove it down the road and back, just to make sure it still runs. I must be saving something. I do eat alot more though.
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Originally Posted by ivan_yulaev
For bike, you've got tires ($25 or so for a set, with tubes, if you shop around)
Chain ($20)
Cassette (every few chains, $40 or so)
Anything else, really?
Car costs rise dramatically due to mainetance, insurance. How does your bike cost $.50/mile?
Chain ($20)
Cassette (every few chains, $40 or so)
Anything else, really?
Car costs rise dramatically due to mainetance, insurance. How does your bike cost $.50/mile?
Plus there are the health benefits that are so variable and hard to quantify in a monetary cost/benefit analysis.
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I stole this from the advocacy forum. https://www.humantransport.org/bicycl...cyclinguse.htm There is a general table about halfway down, but I found the entire article to be quite interseting and informational. It should probably have it's own thread so more people might see it
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Yeah, I posted the thread.
Stu, I'll have to get back to you later. As I said at the beginning this is a work in progress. I don't have the spreadsheet here and I have to drop this item until after labor day.
I really have to agree wholeheartedly with treespeed. My $500 in bike stuff is probably on the low side. I feel like it's actually been closer to $1,500. I just don't know how much is first time and how much is reoccuring.
Well have fun with the thread. I pick up later.
Stu, I'll have to get back to you later. As I said at the beginning this is a work in progress. I don't have the spreadsheet here and I have to drop this item until after labor day.
I really have to agree wholeheartedly with treespeed. My $500 in bike stuff is probably on the low side. I feel like it's actually been closer to $1,500. I just don't know how much is first time and how much is reoccuring.
Well have fun with the thread. I pick up later.
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It's actually pretty simple, but you can't add in any riding clothes, as that is a personal expense/taste not required for the operation of the bike. other than a helmet clothes belong in a different catagory.
Ken.
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I also am in agreeus with Treespeed, I can spend $500 on gloves alone. I like to keep my bikes well maintained but I hate to do any of the maintence other than cleaning and maintaining the drive train, so I spend a LOT at the LBS. $25 for tires??? Are you kidding?