ItsJustMe

My post yesterday got eaten by the DB monster.

Anyway, I've been thinking about going to disc brakes; the rim brakes are not that effective in the slush and rain and crap, plus they're tearing the hell out of my rims.

But while wandering the web looking for deals, I came across drum brakes at Sheldon Brown's site. Seems they're used by tandems, and they're sealed. Seems like they'd be a good deal, especially when combined with a Nexus/roller brake rear hub to make a foul-weather commuter.

Anyone have experience or anecdotes about front-wheel drum brakes?

huhenio

one gear and coaster brake would not be that irrational

ItsJustMe

Not looking for single speed solutions. My ride varies from flat paved road to hills and gravel. I like gears. Nexus gives me gears and coaster brakes, which is also an option.

huhenio

I have not experienced the nexus, but they seem to be as trouble free as they come.

I would not hesitate to try that route ... less stuff to mess with and bang around with a geared hub with a coaster brake.

max-a-mill

i heard the extra resistance is the reason everyone is not riding with an internally geared hub.

does your bike have disc mounts? new bike? if your shopping for a new bike you might as well just be assimilated and get discs. they seem to be the hot new thing on bikes of all types!

BananaMan

I was having the same thought the other day and it seems like a good way to go. If a drum brake is good enough for a tandem it's good enough for a solo.

I dream of a commuter bike which can be ridden though the winter (with sloppy maintenance) and dosn't end up with worn rims and crudded up gears.

PaulH

I've got over four years and 10,000 miles on a bike with front and rear Nexus drum brakes and a geared hub. Works fine in rain, snow, sand, and salt, does not wear out rims in winter, only maintenance is a grease change once a year. The drawback is that it takes more force to lock the front wheel. I've also ridden four years with a derailleur-equipped bike with the usual naked chain and rim brakes. The maintenance and cleaning workload was a tremendous hassle. There is no way I would go back, unless I lived in some place like Arizona.

When I was in my early teens, I used to ride to school every winter day with no studs and a coaster brake. It worked very well, althogh I can't remember how I managed to slide one foot tor stability while backpedeling with the other foot for braking. The lack of brake cables to freeze does make this an attractive winter option with studded tires, however.

Paul

michaelnel

I had an Electra cruiser that had Nexus roller brakes front and rear with a 7 speed internally geared rear hub. They work just as well in the wet as in the dry... meaning they give mediocre braking performance with high lever effort regardless of weather.

They're OK, but nothing to write home about. The major saving grace is that your rims don't get worn.

ItsJustMe

I was looking at a new bike such as the Kona Dr. Dew, but realized that I could work on my existing bike for a lot less $$. I'm looking at about $400 to fully refit my existing hybrid with front disc or drum brakes and a Nexus hub on the back. I do have disc lugs on the front forks. It's kind of hard to find an existing bike with a Nexus hub, so I'd probably build one anyway (probably around a Long Haul Trucker frame or something) if I went the new bike route.

It seems like a drum up front is cheaper; I can buy the front brake hub for $99 and all I need is some new spokes, build the wheel, hook it up and go. If I go with discs, I'll need to buy a new hub to mount the disc, then the caliper in addition. I might get away with around $100 or so if I get lucky on eBay, but so far almost all of the disc compatible hubs I'm finding up there are 32 or 28 spoke (I suspect they're all intended for 26" wheels).

For that matter, I wonder if going with a 26" wheel up front would be a bad thing? With a hub brake it would work, it wouldn't hurt to drop the front by 3/4 inch or so, and the wheel would be tougher. Also it might help with my toes hitting on turns. If I go to 26" 32 spoke, I get a lot more hubs to choose from.

But since drum brakes seem made for tandems, they're going to be 36 spoke.

Good info on slightly less braking power up front. That's not necessarily a bad thing; you never want to actually lock the front anyway.

Is there much adjustment to drum brakes, or do they just sit there and work?

max-a-mill

there are definitely 36 spoke disc hubs out there!

and if you are going through the trouble of rebuilding wheels why not just get a whole new wheelset....

IMHO, the 50 bucks you save re-using yor rims might not be as worthwhile as having a brand new wheelset.

and while your at it and i am adding my 2cents worth.... i am 230 and commute fairly roughly on 32 spoke wheels. i think you can get away with them too if you don't weigh too much more than me. i think the key is a nice handbuilt wheel (for the back anyway).

a new nice handbuilt wheelset will run ya like 400 probably, but it will last you (especially with dics brakes since you wont chew up the rim).

i will cheap out on just about everything, except my wheels....

ItsJustMe

Yes, but I'm trying to get them for $10 on ebay. That's a little tougher.

Because I like building wheels.

I'm 175, I'm not worried about breaking the wheel really. My original rear when through spokes like they were dry spaghetti, but I think they were crap spokes (Giant Cypress machine built wheels). Once I bought some good DT spokes and rebuilt the wheel myself, I've never broken another spoke or had it go out of true in a year.

Yow, I can certainly beat that. I've been very happy with the wheels I have built, and they only take a couple of hours of sitting in the living room watching TV. I'll do that for the $200 difference, especially since I like doing it anyway. Also I'm a cheapskate.

Mr_Super_Socks

On tandems, the drum brakes are typically in addition to a pair of rim brakes. They are used as a drag brake for long descents where there is a risk of overheating the rims from appling the rim brakes.
. . . but . . .
Today, my 8 spd commuter became a single-speed with only front brakes because all my cables were frozen. I only got the front brakes after massaging the cable a bit. Think I may try the OP's idea! Even if the braking power isn't quite as great in optimal conditions, it will be more reliable in bad weather. and I am done, done, done with derailleurs in the winter.

bbaker22

I just bought the premium Nexus Inter-8 hub, the twist shifter, and the more expensive roller brake.
I haven't built the wheel yet, so no ride experience to relate. The one thing I noticed though, is that
the roller brake is super heavy. About 22oz or something crazy like that.

I plan to use the hub/brake on a snow bike w/ heavy studded tires. The combo should make a great
winter bike that is guaranteed to give me a good workout.

baker

squeakywheel

I'm thinking of doing something like this too. I'll probably use a drum hub for the front wheel. I need a new front wheel anyway. I'll use the existing V-brake for the rear.

A drum brake seems to be a good fowl weather substitute for a disc brake for older bikes without the mounting hardware on the forks.

What brake levers do you use for drum brakes? Do you use high leverage ones like are used for calliper brakes? Or, do you use the new lower leverage ones like are used on V-brakes or disk brakes?

Edit: Oh and regarding number of spokes, I would think 36 spokes is good for a drum brake since the stopping force is applied through the spokes. This has to put alot more stress on the spokes than rim brakes do.

DCCommuter

I've been thinking about doing something similar, a 7-speed nexus with coaster brake on the rear, a disc brake on the front. I've been commuting with disc brakes for over a year now, I find them very trouble-free.

The problem I'm running into is that to use the nexus rear hub you need a frame with horizontal drop-outs to tension the chain. Since I'm trying to do this on the cheap this is an issue; it either means a new single-speed frame (more $ than I'm willing to spend) or a 70's road bike frame (incompatible with my existing stock of parts, so many $ to get it rolling).

There was a Van Dessel SuperFly on Ebay last week for $350 that may have been my best bet.

squeakywheel

One more option. Some 1980's Specialized MTB's have horizontal dropouts. I converted one to single speed. The horizontal dropouts are a little short. That means chainlength and the exact sizes of the chainring and freewheel have to be determined by experiment. Mine works best with 35x16, 35x20, or some other total tooth count that results in a modulo 4 answer of 3.

Yet another option. You can use a chain tensioner on your existing bike if you use a hand lever operated drum brake for the rear instead of the coaster brake.

dynaryder

I just did this with my Surly 1x1,'cept I used a drum rear. If you do the conversion,use one of the modern 7 or 8 speeds;mine has an older 7 and it's a little clunky.

Horizontal(track ends) or semi-vertical will work:
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/nexus8/pages/27.htm

It's not just the chain tension,you also have to be able to keep the hub from turning. Lots of 90's era frames out there that will fit the bill(my old Raleigh will prolly go on the block this spring if you're interested).

Personally,I wouldn't go with a drum front or coaster rear. My motorcycle experience has turned me off to drums,and coaster brakes can't be modulated like regular brakes. They also can't really be used to scrub speed down hills or hold the bike in place. Drums do fine on the rear because they can be dragged and most of the braking is handled by the front.

marqueemoon

LOTS of old MTBs have horizontal dropouts. Those might be ok gear ratios for off road with mountain tires but they seem pretty low for commuting on the street. As for picking a gear ratio, it does not need to be totally trial and error. I would read up on Sheldon Brown's site and use his gear calculator to pick a freewheel or fixed cog that will give you a gear ratio in the ballpark you're looking for using one of your existing chainrings.

Running fixed gear in the back (allowing you to slow down my resisting on the pedals) is the only way you can really get out of rim wear in the rear if you're using an old MTB frame though, since it will not have disc tabs. A disc in front/fixed in back combo seems good for commuting. It might end up being a money pit to convert an old MTB though, since you're talking 2 new wheels, a new threadless fork (and headset, stem, etc...), not to mention the cost of the disc brake itself.

squeakywheel

I like the 35x16 gear ratio. I have some big hills on my commute. I don't ride really fast. The longest part of my commute is on a gravel shoulder. Riding through a couple inches of snow will really increase the rolling resistance of a tire.

The trial and error part of gear selection for me was due to the short horizontal dropouts. Adding or removing a chainlink moves the rear axel 1/2 inch. There are some gear configurations where you can't get the axel position to be in the dropouts and have any tension on the chain. That's when you measure how much you are off and go buy either a second chainring or second freewheel. Adding or removing a tooth is worth 1/8 inch.

My old MTB SS conversion may well be a money pit. Just call it a hobby and no more justification is required.

marqueemoon

For snow, I think all bets are off on gear ratios

Yeah. I hear you. In some ways I regret spending so much effort and money on my commuting bike, but hey... It's a bike that gets ridden 5 days a week. I had better like it.

squeakywheel

The guy in the office next door was just harrassing me (again) about my SS conversion.

"You don't need to lock up that piece of junk."
"It looks like a hodge podge of bike parts."
"You spent $240 to turn a worn-out 20 year old steel bike into a single speed?"

I under quoted the cost to avoid severe embarasment. I don't care. Oh yeah, and I didn't tell him how much money I spent on tools to do the work myself. In fact I don't know. Actually, I don't want to know.

For pure economy and function, I would have been better off throwing my bike in the trash and buying a KHS Solo-One.

I like my bike, though. The work was fun. Actually, I'm not done yet. I don't ever plan to be done. I'll always be tweaking something.