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Why won't the Dutch ever learn?

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Why won't the Dutch ever learn?

Old 12-08-06, 05:24 PM
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atbman
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Why won't the Dutch ever learn?

Excerpt from this week's CTC members' newsletter

"More bike-rail news
At a conference organised this week by the Waterfront Partnership on cycle-rail issues, Emily Thornberry MP, chair of the All Party Parliamentary Cycling Group, highlighted the desperate inadequacies in provision for combining cycling and rail travel, and highlighted the need for the Government’s Rail White Paper, due out next July, to address the situation. By contrast, Kees Miedema from Dutch rail operator NS rail described the phenomenal provision made at Dutch stations. A "small station" is one with less than 1,000 cycle parking spaces – by that definition, even Britain’s best stations (such as York and Cambridge) are "small stations", and the central London terminus stations such as Waterloo, Kings Cross and Paddington (with just a couple of hundred spaces each) are mere tiddlers by comparison. Meanwhile, plans for the refurbishment of the central station in the Hague include a mind-blowing 6,000 cycle parking spaces."

Bikes taking up useful car parking spaces - it's a disgrace, I tell you
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Old 12-08-06, 05:32 PM
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I think there's too many zeros in your description of cycle parking places, about 3 too many. Atleast for Cleveland that is. Many rail stops do have atleast one bike rack. Usually rusted, bent or otherwise damaged. Ofcourse they are also usually empty. Thats one reason why I just ride my bike the entire commute (that and the rail doesn't go there anyways)
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Old 12-08-06, 07:53 PM
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There's two "bike racks" at Grand Central Terminal in NYC. By bike racks, I mean two street signs with collars that allow 2 bikes to be locked per street sign. The library has more racks to lock up to.
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Old 12-08-06, 09:32 PM
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Amsterdam.
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Old 12-08-06, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by cooker

Amsterdam.
Same parking lot at main train station in Amsterdam, NL taken in 2001:


in Leiden, NL:


Main Train Station Heidelberg, Germany:


Even more telling, some of the bike parking at the German Formula 1 GrandPrix at Hockenheim:
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Old 12-09-06, 12:27 AM
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Originally Posted by atbman
Excerpt from this week's CTC members' newsletter

"More bike-rail news
At a conference or...
Bikes taking up useful car parking spaces - it's a disgrace, I tell you
It is only cool untill everyone does it. Then problems which bleed onto you. I much perfer so far the being alone in a big city with lots of motorheads. I know think of myself. Well my cycle is going on that bicycle rack for the last bus.

Last edited by wheel; 12-09-06 at 12:33 AM.
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Old 12-09-06, 03:00 AM
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ILTB, thanks for posting those pictures. If you have any more, please feel free to post them.

Its my dream to see that here in Sydney, but I doubt it'll happen in my lifetime if ever.
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Old 12-09-06, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Cyclaholic
Its my dream to see that here in Sydney, but I doubt it'll happen in my lifetime if ever.
It's my dream to see that in Sydney, too. And any other place I don't live or ride. Talk about swapping one nightmare for another ... those photos belong in a thread entitled Be Careful What You Wish For.
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Old 12-09-06, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by GCRyder
It's my dream to see that in Sydney, too. And any other place I don't live or ride. Talk about swapping one nightmare for another ... those photos belong in a thread entitled Be Careful What You Wish For.
What a nightmare? Enjoying your weekend club rides with the Real Cyclists?

Pictures of the local middle school (enrollment 362 students) bike parking lot this Oct 30th. The horror, the horror of everyday cycling done by people other than Real Cyclists, eh?
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Old 12-09-06, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Cyclaholic
ILTB, thanks for posting those pictures. If you have any more, please feel free to post them.
How 'bout this? Bike taxi parking in front of and across the street from the Reichstag Building in Berlin.

Then of course there is the actual riding of cycles in normal attire as an everyday activity (Gouda, NL sometime between 1997 and 2002); a scene to induce nightmares in some of the Real Cyclists of BF!
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Old 12-09-06, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
What a nightmare? Enjoying your weekend club rides with the Real Cyclists?
Proof that every once in a long while I actually agree with I-Like-To-Bike. Well, maybe not so much about the Real Cyclist part (GCRyder is a commuter, after all), but that it's hardly a nightmare that a lot of Dutch are utility cyclists.

GCRyder: think about which you prefer, the above, or this:

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Old 12-09-06, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by cooker
Proof that every once in a long while I actually agree with I-Like-To-Bike. Well, maybe not so much about the Real Cyclist part (GCRyder is a commuter, after all), but that it's hardly a nightmare that a lot of Dutch are utility cyclists.
Yeah, a commuter with an attitude; an attitude that cycling should be reserved for those Real Cyclists who think they are something special and superior to the Untermensch.
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Old 12-09-06, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by GCRyder
It's my dream to see that in Sydney, too. And any other place I don't live or ride. Talk about swapping one nightmare for another ... those photos belong in a thread entitled Be Careful What You Wish For.
Sorry, but I think you're all wrong on this one...

You'd rather all those people be in cars? I'd absolutely love to have that many cyclists in my city.

Hell, I'd be happy have 1/100th that many commuters, or a bike rack outside the train station, or a train station that was worth going to.
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Old 12-09-06, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by cooker
Proof that every once in a long while I actually agree with I-Like-To-Bike. Well, maybe not so much about the Real Cyclist part (GCRyder is a commuter, after all), but that it's hardly a nightmare that a lot of Dutch are utility cyclists.

GCRyder: think about which you prefer, the above, or this:

Given that the vehicles in both photos are parked, I prefer seeing the cars that way. And I haven't been on a weekend club ride in quite a few years. I do not enjoy crowds.
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Old 12-09-06, 11:08 AM
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Wow. That would be great if that many people rode bikes around here. It's hard to find a bike rack around here, let alone bike-parking lots.
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Old 12-09-06, 11:24 AM
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a scene to induce nightmares in some of the Real Cyclists of BF!
Yep, not one wearing a bike helmet. And no logo wear. And worst of all... bells on the handle bars. Ewww! It activated the V-chip in my computer.
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Old 12-09-06, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by GCRyder
It's my dream to see that in Sydney, too. And any other place I don't live or ride. Talk about swapping one nightmare for another ... those photos belong in a thread entitled Be Careful What You Wish For.
I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, can you explain it? How is being surrounded by people on bicycles as opposed to driving poisonous exhaust belching tonnes of steel a nightmare?
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Old 12-09-06, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by GCRyder
Given that the vehicles in both photos are parked, I prefer seeing the cars that way. And I haven't been on a weekend club ride in quite a few years. I do not enjoy crowds.
Enjoy your solitude. Many people, not blessed with your circumstances, live, work, play and commute to their various destinations, in a crowded environment.
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Old 12-09-06, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by unkchunk
Yep, not one wearing a bike helmet. And no logo wear. And worst of all... bells on the handle bars. Ewww! It activated the V-chip in my computer.
No dropped handlebars or special whoop-de-doo pedal/shoe combinations either, Yikes! Oh the Horror, the Horror! That can't be Real Bike Commuting! Worse than Halloween and Friday the 13th nightmares combined. Who are those mutant freaks, eh?
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Old 12-09-06, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by cooker

GCRyder: think about which you prefer, the above, or this:

Isn't it great how around airports and city-centers all around the USA, millions of dollars of real estate is devoted to making room for a sea of automobiles? I wonder how much it costs, in the middle of a major Dutch city, to make room to park 10,000 bikes. And how much for 1000 cars?
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Old 12-09-06, 02:45 PM
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OMG so many bikes, I could never put my bike among so many.
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Old 12-09-06, 03:29 PM
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man, just imagine trying to find your bike among the seas of bikes
now, did i leave it on the third floor or the second floor? they all look the same to me
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Old 12-09-06, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by mastershake916
OMG so many bikes, I could never put my bike among so many.
Yeah, that's right you might get cooties.
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Old 12-09-06, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by mrbubbles
man, just imagine trying to find your bike among the seas of bikes
now, did i leave it on the third floor or the second floor? they all look the same to me
Might be easier than finding an expensive Real Bicycle where you left it after its being parked for any amount of time all by its lonesome in many city/suburban locations.
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Old 12-09-06, 04:52 PM
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In my last job as a city council cycling officer, we reckoned on 10 bikes per car space
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