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Helmet Camera for Evidence for Commute

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Helmet Camera for Evidence for Commute

Old 09-11-07, 02:48 PM
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Maxximum
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Helmet Camera for Evidence for Commute

Anyone here use a helmet camera, or think that it would be prudent to use one in the case of commuting and using evidence from video footage? I realize in most instances the police don't really care about crimes that happen to cyclists or don't believe cyclists. In cases such as those, video footage may be useful.

Recount times you have been harassed or even assaulted, would you have liked to have a helmet camera/mini camcorder already filming? Is it worth the added bulk and hassle of handling the camera?

Would you use a helmet camera daily on your commute if it were given to you for free?
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Old 09-11-07, 03:06 PM
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To really get the data needed for evidence a 360deg (or at least 270) view is very often needed. Addtionally a view of what the cyclist is doing.
Al
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Old 09-11-07, 03:26 PM
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If it fell out of the sky onto my doorstep I'd hook it up, but not really worth the time/hassle to hook all the gear up and start it up every commute or ride. Keep it simple for me.
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Old 09-11-07, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Maxximum View Post
Anyone here use a helmet camera, or think that it would be prudent to use one in the case of commuting and using evidence from video footage?
I've considered it. Moreover, I will do it as soon as they go down in price, and up in quality/battery life.

... Brad
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Old 09-11-07, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by jamesdenver View Post
If it fell out of the sky onto my doorstep I'd hook it up, but not really worth the time/hassle to hook all the gear up and start it up every commute or ride. Keep it simple for me.
The one I use is as easy to use as a self contained front light that clips to the handlebars.

Al
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Old 09-11-07, 03:47 PM
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Is this the cam that everyone is looking at?

http://www.heartratemonitorsusa.com/...18-camera.html
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Old 09-11-07, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
The one I use is as easy to use as a self contained front light that clips to the handlebars.

Al
Thing is, what is the video quality? Not well, I imagine, since the only current offerings are from Oregon Sci, ATC2K, and the Hero 3, by www.goprocamera.com

The Hero3 is far better in terms of quality, but the only drawback is that it is not as inconspicuous as the ATC2K.

twenty20 will have a really powerful camcorder out soon, that will be very powerful and really high quality, and it will almost be as good as a bullet cam, but the thing is all self contained as well, it is a tad bit larger than the ATC2K but will give a lot more detail:

http://www.vholdr.com/

As for the 360 / 270 degree view. I did consider it as well. It would be this:

One GoPro Hero 3 on the seat post facing out and back, with a wide angle adapter, then one on my left arm/wrist facing to the left, also with a wide angle adapter, as well as a helmet bullet camera on front, facing forward. The other thing would be to keep this all, but skip the helmet bullet camera, and instead pop on a third Hero 3 upfront:




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Old 09-11-07, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by alicestrong View Post
Is this the cam that everyone is looking at?

http://www.heartratemonitorsusa.com/...18-camera.html
Not exactly. I considered this one, but saw all the terrible footage, then I saw the footage from

Hero 3 at GoProCamera.com, and it is FAR better.

This would be combined with a bullet camera from Xtreme Recall

The Hero3 would be used either for a side view, or a side view, and a second Hero 3 for the rear seatpost.

The saddest would be if someone threw a Gatorade bottle at my head causing me to fall, and I wasn't able to get proof of this or eye witnesses who supported me, or the plate. Anyone here know of people who almost beat the snot out of cyclists, or did? There was a guy recently who got beat up, in Toronto, the cops didn't believe him. Some students nearby filmed it.

Anyone ever had their helmet tapped on by a passenger in a motor vehicle?

Cyclist Beat-up:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8H0Pb_qjj6k
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Old 09-11-07, 03:55 PM
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Btw, is there any charge for someone who doors a cyclist? Criminal Negligence? Commonlaw negligence causing bodily harm?
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Old 09-11-07, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by bac View Post
I've considered it. Moreover, I will do it as soon as they go down in price, and up in quality/battery life.

... Brad
Just so you know, there is a new one due out around Christmas this year, or slightly after wards for the 2008 cycling season that has phenomenal battery life, is self-contained, price is still pretty steep (~$350), and has great resolution and quality.
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Old 09-11-07, 04:20 PM
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You don't need it. Really, overkill. I have had crap thrown at me all the time, people spit on my bike, screw around with my gearing. One guy even threw his arm out at me pretending to hit me with his arm as I rode near. Nobody cares, and least of all the cops.

See vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bo4MpO3kBRE
Result: Cops don't give a damn, even if the cyclists happen to be victims.
Even if you have 360 degrees of footage. Even if the cyclist was in the right. Even if the motorist was in the wrong. That is the way it is.
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Old 09-11-07, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Maxximum View Post
Just so you know, there is a new one due out around Christmas this year, or slightly after wards for the 2008 cycling season that has phenomenal battery life, is self-contained, price is still pretty steep (~$350), and has great resolution and quality.
Cooooooooooooooooooool. I'll check it out for sure.

... Brad
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Old 09-11-07, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by bac View Post
Cooooooooooooooooooool. I'll check it out for sure.

... Brad
Here's the site in case you missed it in my other post: (1/5 the size of a typical small camcorder)
http://www.vholdr.com/

...Maxximum
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Old 09-11-07, 05:26 PM
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I saw a self contained one about the size of a headlight for $100. Still though, I think it's a bit over the top. Were I to do it, however, I'd mount it on the left handlebar drop facing to the rear. That way you'd have footage of the car approaching and a fair bit of their actions. If it faces forward, you'd only have video of the bike hitting the dirt, not the car that just rammed you.
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Old 09-11-07, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Maxximum View Post
Anyone here use a helmet camera
Yes

Originally Posted by Maxximum
or think that it would be prudent to use one in the case of commuting and using evidence from video footage? I realize in most instances the police don't really care about crimes that happen to cyclists or don't believe cyclists. In cases such as those, video footage may be useful.
I do think this is important, but it's not why I use a helmet camera. It's an added bonus.

Originally Posted by Maxximum
Recount times you have been harassed or even assaulted, would you have liked to have a helmet camera/mini camcorder already filming? Is it worth the added bulk and hassle of handling the camera?

Would you use a helmet camera daily on your commute if it were given to you for free?
I've thankfully never been assaulted, and harassment is different to different people I think, but this morning I had a garbage truck pull out (reversing, no less) across 3 lanes of traffic in front of me (I was doing a nice 28-30mph at the time, too), no guy at the back directing/helping with traffic - this guy just backed right out, paying no mind. I have it on video, and will be cutting it out and contacting the waste company first, then perhaps the police to ask if there's anything they can do.

I use a helmet camera mainly to chronicle my riding and see if the rides I do look as cool as other stuff I see of bike riding online. I'm also trying to gather thoughts/ideas for a PSA series of sorts, trying to use the thing as a tool to illustrate traffic problems and possible solutions/guidance.
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Old 09-11-07, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Flimflam View Post
Yes



I do think this is important, but it's not why I use a helmet camera. It's an added bonus.



I've thankfully never been assaulted, and harassment is different to different people I think, but this morning I had a garbage truck pull out (reversing, no less) across 3 lanes of traffic in front of me (I was doing a nice 28-30mph at the time, too), no guy at the back directing/helping with traffic - this guy just backed right out, paying no mind. I have it on video, and will be cutting it out and contacting the waste company first, then perhaps the police to ask if there's anything they can do.

I use a helmet camera mainly to chronicle my riding and see if the rides I do look as cool as other stuff I see of bike riding online. I'm also trying to gather thoughts/ideas for a PSA series of sorts, trying to use the thing as a tool to illustrate traffic problems and possible solutions/guidance.
Just curious what sort of set-up you are using? I don't like the situation in Toronto, or any big city. Tough, but that is the way of the road. Cyclists are seen as sub-human, worse than a pedestrian, worse than a jaywalker, and worse than a hit and run motorist by some. Sad.
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Old 09-11-07, 09:48 PM
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Here is an example of a video shot by the earlier model of the OS cam (ATC1?)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dj1Ifq9Tfas

This is the vid that made me want to get a camera
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Old 09-11-07, 09:50 PM
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I think this is sorta silly.
I like to think of my commute as the best part of my day. I ride safe, stay out of harms way if it presents itself. I don't see the point of documenting every minute and having to worry about some extraneous technology. I'd rather focus on the way to and from then be keyed up about capturing some ... event?

(by the way... the intriguing video above did capture one thing... a bicyclist filtering thru traffic)

Sorry I just don't get it. what will happen next? EVERYONE will have video cameras in cars, on foot, on bikes, motorcycles, baby buggies... stop lights... big brother? Just surveillance

get human

I'm done
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Old 09-12-07, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Sigurdd50 View Post
I think this is sorta silly.
I like to think of my commute as the best part of my day. I ride safe, stay out of harms way if it presents itself. I don't see the point of documenting every minute and having to worry about some extraneous technology. I'd rather focus on the way to and from then be keyed up about capturing some ... event?
It is very silly. I do record just about every commute (but never my recreational rides) for fun only and for bringing some visuals to BF discussion. At times it has helped communicate situations.

I too ride safe. As I noted above I don't worry about the technology at all. I fuss more with my mulitple lights (keeping batteries maximized, ensuring they are aimed right, making sure I have backup) than I do with the camera. I just turn it on and press record before I ride, then hit stop at the end.

When I ride I don't even think about the camera.

Al
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Old 09-12-07, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by workingbike View Post
Here is an example of a video shot by the earlier model of the OS cam (ATC1?)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dj1Ifq9Tfas

This is the vid that made me want to get a camera
Wow. People have criticized me for filtering to much, but I've got nothing on that guy.
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Old 09-12-07, 08:46 AM
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I am considering getting one as well. Cagers love to terrorize cyclists with their 2000+ pound lumps of metal I think we should use these cameras to terrorize them in response.
In actuality I have occasional problems with general motorists. It is the Taxi cabs I really hate, I have problems with them almost weekly. I would love to start sending footage to the police and taxi commission and having them taken off the road. My brother is a police officer and hates them more than I do.
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Old 09-12-07, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Sigurdd50 View Post
I think this is sorta silly.

Sorry I just don't get it. what will happen next? EVERYONE will have video cameras in cars, on foot, on bikes, motorcycles, baby buggies... stop lights... big brother? Just surveillance
It's more than just sorta silly. Do we live in a society that has such a low crime rate that we now turn discourtesy into crime and report it to the police, including video footage?

Yes, sometimes cagers and cyclists both break the law while on the road. Yes, sometimes these violations put either or both, and possibly passersby, in real danger. Yes, sometimes it is much more than mere discourtesy and is actually criminal. In such cases, it should be reported, without complaint about whether or not the authorities will "do something about it." Road rage is now taken seriously by the authorities after years of anecdotal evidence and complaints. The authorities may not have "done something" about road rage complaints in the beginning, but after enough of them, now they do take it seriously.

Should we have to wait so long for the authorities to take what we consider a real threat, seriously? Probably not. Should we expect the authorities to respond to every complaint and report they receive with the same fervor they show for murder? Probably not.

We live in an imperfect society, struggling towards equality and unanimity. We've been struggling for over two-hundred years. While video evidence, certainly a technological marvel in the past two-hundred years, may not be accepted as incontrovertible proof by our courts, it seems as though some in our society have willingly embraced it as such.

I prefer a society wherein my actions, whether discourteous or criminal, are not taped by my fellow citizens and reported to the authorities.
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Old 09-12-07, 09:09 AM
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Put me down for another "silly" vote. If the intention is to document "incidents", then either your "incident" threshold is way low -- sorry, no, I don't think we should be making federal cases, complete with "evidence", of someone flipping off cyclists -- or you're going out there every day thinking that something major is going to happen, and that you might wind up in court trying to get damages for your traumatically amputated leg. I don't think it's healthy being out there with either mindset.
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Old 09-12-07, 11:01 AM
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I use a helmet-mounted video camera all the time on both my bicycle and motorcycle. A friend of mine started using a helmet cam while on his motorcycle and got involved in an accident where the other person took off making it a hit and run. If it had not been for the video the offender would have gotten away with it. That’s when I started using a video system on my motorcycle and consequently while on my bicycle as well.

Video evidence varies between states. You'll need to check your local laws concerning using video as evidence. I'm in Alabama, which passed laws approving the use of video evidence from any source. The police can even mail tickets for offenders running red lights, stop signs, and even video harassing other drivers including people on motorcycles and especially bicycles. The police love it when I come in with video of drivers buzzing me or harassing me. Alabama uses money generated by citations in the general fund. Consequently anyone providing video evidence that can lead to a citation being mailed to an offender is always received with enthusiasm. Especially when the citation is a large one like reckless driving which is what anyone gets for buzzing me on my bicycle. When I started using my camera on the bicycle it was common to get buzzed or harassed. After about a year of using it I very rarely have problems being buzzed or harassed. I always make it a point to submit video, file a complaint, and attend traffic court when necessary to be a witness.

I copied the camera project at this link as the new and smaller dedicated helmet cameras were not available then.
Wireless helmet camera

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Old 09-12-07, 12:43 PM
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I guess you are part of the problem or part of the solution.
In my mind, the solution is to lead by example and be a good citizen rider, and rise above idiocy -- either on biker's parts or auto driver's part.

It reminds me a bit of this... when I was young, they flooded the city park in winter, and we skated on it. When I fell and busted my wrist, my dad took me to the ER and they put a cast on it... it healed, and I went back to skating. today, no parks are flooded for skating because the lawyers have found a cash cow, filing suites against munincipalities. Loss of innoncence? I guess. Does it suck? yeah.

So why perpetuate the litigative mentality by video taping your actions..
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