New Commuter Choices - Narrowing it Down!?
 

I visited Proteus Bikes in College Park, MD last night http://www.proteusbicycles.com/, and rode the following bikes:

Jamis Coda ($400) http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/...es/08coda.html

Kona Dew Deluxe ($500, I think) http://www.konaworld.com/bikes/2k7/DEWDELUXE/index.html

Bianchi San Jose ($600) http://www.bianchiusa.com/06_san_jose.html

Bianchi Castro Valley ($850) http://www.bianchiusa.com/07_castro_valley.html

First, let me say Proteus Bikes rocks! It may be the coolest LBS I've ever set foot in. The owner and staff were very knowledgeable and super friendly. The place itself is like somebody's living room - complete with leather chairs, a cat, and a fireplace! Oh, and the bike selection is large, too.

Now, to the bikes....

Jamis Coda - I read great things on this board and was excited to ride it. I wanted to look at the Coda Sport, but they don't have in stock. The owner actually said she thought the Coda was a better buy, but would order the Sport if I wanted it.

Pros: I like the steel and this seems like a good choice. Comfortable setup, good feel, responsive, fairly light.

Cons: shifting was just okay. I liked the bike, but didn't love it. Seem to be between sizes, but looks like we could dial the fit in on either the 17.5 or 19.5.


Kona Dew Deluxe - really wanted to like this bike because I've been thinking hard about discs. Just okay. Harsher feel than the others, chain jumped off twice, and cockpit just didn't feel comfortable. Immediate elimination for me.


Bianchi San Jose - This was the most fun to ride!

Pros: Steel frame felt great, setup was most like a road bike, which is what I'm used to, and the single speed was just plain fun!

Cons: I have a couple of large hills to contend with on my commute and am afraid I would struggle getting uphill once I add the weight of things I might want to carry other than myself! Oh, and I have some knee problems right now. Setup is more road like, and less upright. I count this as a con, because I think for commuting in a high traffic area, I'd like to be more upright, but boy is this bike fun to ride! (Maybe I should buy two additional bikes. Hmmm.)


Bianchi Castro Valley - Same frame as the San Jose, so that's a plus.

Pros: Good feel, smoother shifting than the Jamis. Shifting and actual shifters are better than the Jamis. I like that it comes with fenders, and found the hub-powered light cool, though the output was just okay. At least as comfortable as the Jamis, and maybe a tad more so.

Cons: Has a compact crank, with a double instead of triple. (Can someone explain compact crank to me? I just know it felt a little different, but maybe that was the double when I am used to a triple.) LBS folks did the gearing calculations and said the range works out to nearly identical to that of the Jamis, but I found it a little more difficult to get up the 'test hills' on this one, and none of those hills compare to the ones near where I live. Also, don't know if the light is easily removable, and wonder how long until someone would rip it off. Most expensive of the bunch ($850), though it comes with the light, fenders, and spd/platform pedals....As a side note, the hub powered light worked well next to my Dinotte which I brought along since I was test riding after dark.


Summary: I think at the moment, it is between the Jamis Coda and the Bianchi Castro Valley. The salesperson thought the Bianchi would hold up better because of better components, but I guess you also have to expect that response given the Bianchi is double the price of the Jamis. In some ways, I want to like both bikes more than I do. I'd give the slight edge to the Bianchi because 1) I liked the frame a little better - both feel and looks (it is shaped with a flat-bottomed top tube), 2) I felt marginally more dialed in position-wise, 3) better components = smoother shifting. I could take or leave the dynamo front hub.

I intend to test ride the Trek 7.3fx again this weekend, but think I am now sold on a steel frame, especially since my training/racing bike is an aluminum frame with carbon fork and stays, and I really want something different for a commuter bike.

Any thoughts/experiences with the Jamis Coda compared to the Bianchi Castro Valley? Is the Bianchi worth the extra $450? Anybody have a hilly commute and use a Bianchi San Jose?


Thanks!

I don't have experience with any of these bikes... but here's an idea... You could ask the LBS to put a larger rear freewheel on the San Jose and take another test ride. You'll have an easier time getting up the hills with lower gearing. I loved fixed/ss bikes... so simple, elegant, low maintenance. Just my 2-cents...

I don't get the "fun" of riding a single speed. It's just as fun as keeping a geared bike always on the same gear.

A compact double has a smaller inner chainring than a standard double. It's a good compromise for those who prefer to spin their way up hills (rather than mash) but don't want the added weight of a triple. To be honest, I don't "get" the point of a compact double on a commuting bike. (On a road bike, yes.)

They've changed the shifters on the '08 Coda.

If it were me and I was willing to go up to 800-900 bucks I'd probably get a more touring oriented bike for commuting like the Jamis Aurora or Fuji Touring, or a cross bike like the Kona Jake. (The Surly and Soma frames are also popular.)

No, it's not.

If you like the triple, why not get the Volpe? I believe it's the same frame with lower gears.

+ If you like the Castro Valley, the Volpe is the same frame with a granny gear. You'll have to add your own fenders, but it is the same fun ride.

I like my single-speed for commuting -- eight months of the year! I'm just about to switch to my other bike for winter.

One reason is that my SS can only take the narrowest PB Freddy fenders and with those, I could only get a 25c tire on there. And I need some snow/ice tires on those occassions.

So, make sure whatever bike you get has the flexibility for all the conditions you expect to ride it in.


I do enjoy my SS, it is different and it is fun.

One reason a SS is superior is that there are less maintenance issues. If I was starting a dedicated, ALL-weather commuter from scratch and could only have one bike, I'd go with internal gearing. Fortunately, I can have my SS and I convert my summer roadie into a winter commuter.


EDIT: My seven commute has no flat sections, all up or down 2-8% grade. SS isn't an issue... except when it's windy and cold. Just so much harder in <40*F.

I wouldn't have ruled out a bike because of shifting issues. This is something that could easily be corrected. Same with the "cockpit" for that matter. Change the stem and you're set.

If I didn't think I'd get thrown out of the condo by my girlfriend, I would buy the Jamis Coda AND the Bianchi San Jose. The SS was tons of fun, but I just don't think it could serve as my only commuter, given the hills I need to climb daily and ongoing sore knees.

I like the upright position on the Coda and Castro Valley, as opposed to the more traditional road position with drops on the Volpe. (I have a nice road bike for training and racing, so i want something different.) I guess I'm at the point of deciding whether or not the Castro Valley is worth the difference in price over the Coda, especially since I was originally hoping to stay around $400-500. And, I want to try the Trek 7.3fx again, since I originally really liked it before trying the steel-framed bikes.

Thanks for all the advice! Jurgen - thanks for the explanation of the compact crank.

Oh, I'm not going to discuss that, of course maintenance is almost nonexistant in a SS. But what shocked me was the expresion of the original post:

To me, that last part of the sentence is nonsense.

As for the "SS is different'' I say... cut your derraileur cable in any bike and there you are.

(Sorry for the off-topic BTW)

You should be posting in the SS/Fixed forum.

I used to own a Coda Comp,and now own a Coda Elite and a Dew Deluxe. For a year-round commuter,I would pick the Deluxe over the lower model Codas. Disc brakes blow rim brakes out of the water,especially in bad weather and a hilly area like DC. And Dews have clearance for wider tires than Codas(unless they've significantly changed the frame since my '05 model).They come with 37's,and I don't think anything wider than 32's will fit between the Codas' chainstays.

Shifting,etc is moot on bikes being test ridden because they're usually not dialed-in. Most bikes are slapped together to get them on the sales floor,then they are just safety checked before a demo ride. They usually don't get a proper tune-up until they've been purchased and are ready to be taken home.

I have a coda sport and it'll take bigger tires - I've got tires that measure 33 (sold as 35's) plus fenders on mine and it looks like there's room for more.

What's wrong with Jamis bikes that are named "Commuter"?
Aluminum frame? Less rust, a beater commuter bike usually has chipped paint.

Commuter 1 http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/...commuter1.html
Commuter 2 http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/...commuter2.html
Commuter 3 with Shimano Nexus http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/...commuter3.html $550
Commuter 4, this is strange: internal hub + derailleur http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/...commuter4.html

A compact double is not merely just a smaller inner ring. A standard double has a 53 tooth outer ring and a 39 tooth inner ring (53X39.) A compact double has a 50 tooth outer ring and a 34 tooth (sometimes 36 tooth) inner ring (50X34.) The cassette on the back of a standard racing road bike will usually be a 10 speed with cogs running 11-23 or 12-25. About half of the stock compact doubles that are being sold today come with a 12-27 cassette on back. With a 50X34 and a 12-27 you are approaching the gearing range that you would get on a standard triple. Two advantages to the compact double... less weight and smoother (simpler) shifting with the front derailer. If you are considering a fixie or single speed for commuting then I suspect that you are a fairly strong rider... if that's true, you should be able to get by easily with a compact double and most likely even a standard double.

I have a 2006 Bianchi San Jose for riding in town. It mostly stays in the office for use as an around town bike. I have commuted into work with it a few times, but there is a significant hill climb that is a bear on the SS. And the hill going home is too long and too steep for a SS.

It is a fun bike to ride. In Honolulu, a FG/SS is less likely to get stolen. A big reason it is my town bike, for when I have to lock it up outside for long periods of time during meetings, classes, etc.

Your idea of more than one bicycle is on that I indorse.

A routine compact setup of 34/50 mated to a 12-27 10spd cassette would give you a gear range of 33.7 to 111.5 inches.
A standard triple has a 20 tooth differential (30/39/50 for most road triples) so at the low end you would gain 4 gear inches of advantage over a compact double mated to the same cassette.

Is 4 gear inches (29.7 vs. 33.7) at the low end, and a range of gearing on the 39t ring which can be accomplished by variable crossing on a compact double really worth the extra weight, maintenance problems, and added Q-factor of a triple crank? If you really need the extra-low ability of a triple, and you're going with a trekking/touring setup (26/36/46 or better in the case of 22t capacity derailleurs) then a triple makes sense. If you're not carrying the monster touring loads around, then the difference between a road triple and a compact double is negligible, even for large hills.

I'm partly biased because I'm building a compact double equipped bike, but I've based that decision on having a 26t granny ring on my current bike (and I never use it) and a 39-26 low gear on my road rig (which isn't quite low enough) so something in between will work fine.

I went back on Sunday and rode the Jamis Coda and the Bianchi Castro Valley again. Also stopped at another place and rode the Trek 7.3fx. Bottom line on the Trek is the LBS nearest to me that is a Trek dealer has consistently fair to poor service. For me, that's enough to look elsewhere, even if it means another brand.

I still think the Castro Valley is a better frame than the Coda, and feels a bit better, subjectively. The components are better and the shifting is definitely smoother. However, I don't have need for a hub-driven light (though it is cool!), and the compact double still doesn't feel like it has the range of the triple. There is also toe overlap with the Castro Valley. I want to like that bike because it is probably a "better" bike. Of course, it costs more.

Am leaning towards the Coda, though I still think I'd like the Coda Sport - it has the same or similar shifters, front and rear derailleurs as the Castro Valley. Unfortunately, the LBS I am impressed with does not carry the Coda Sport in stock, though I am sure they could order it.

One more wrinkle: all 2007 bicycles are 20% off this weekend, and in-stock 2008s are 10% off. That makes the Castro Valley about $680, the Coda about $436 and the San Jose $480. I think the 2008 Jamis Coda Sports are $600 MSRP. The question becomes, do I go with the Coda for $436 and accept the lower-graded components, or bite the bullet and ask them to order the Coda Sport at around $600?

Ughhhhh....decisions!....Thanks for all the advice and input so far!

I just looked at the specs, and there's a huge reason why the triple feels like there's a wider range than the compact double: There is.

The Coda triple is a 28/38/48 mated to an 11-32 cassette.
The Castro Valley is a 34/50 mated to a 12-26 cassette.

That's 23.4 inches on the Coda and 35 inches on the Castro Valley. A 11.6 inch difference in the low end gearing. That's huge!

I'm wondering about this too. What specifically is more "fun" about singlespeed vs. keeping your derailleur bike in the same gear all the time. I don't get it. I'm not criticizing, I'm just asking. I take it the bike is just a singlespeed with brakes. So how is it any different than riding a geared bike in that same gear all the time?

I guess I don't really understand the differences between various gear combinations and the total inches, and how all that translates into ease of pedaling up a hill. Can someone give me a primer? Thanks!

I really don't want to start a flame war or hijack my own thread! over SS/fixed as I am just trying to get help choosing a bike.

All I can tell you is the San Jose was a fun bike to test ride. I like the frame, and I like the challenge of only having one gear - you see a hill, and have to rely on your own skill and strength to climb it. I've always looked at bike messengers and others riding SS or fixed gear and thought, "what's the big deal about that?" I got a taste of it is all, and I kinda understand. Yes, I suppose you could simply leave your derailleur on the same gear all the time, but the temptation is there. Again, this would not fit my needs as an all-purpose commuter bike, but I did like it.

Sorry for derailing the thread. I wasn't criticizing what you said, I was just curious about it. I suppose the simplicity of it and never having the option of switching to an easier gear would make it challenging and different (of course you could do the same thing with a derailleur bike).

Good luck finding the perfect commuter bike. :)

No worries. I didn't think it was personal criticism, and I'm certainly not ready to move over to the SS/Fixed forum, but it DID surprise me that I thought the San Jose was so much fun. In thinking about it some more, it is kind of like the difference between running 26 miles and finishing a marathon. Sure, you can go out and run the 26 miles on your own, but it somehow feels very different when you do it as part of a race. Dunno really. You might go test ride a singlespeed when you get a chance and see what you think. Maybe I'm crazy.....

The simplicity of it. After a while, you instinctively know that you can't shift, so you stop using that part of your brain for shifting. I'm kinda dumb, so not thinking is really nice :D Plus, it's different from my weekend rides, so it's a sort of x-training and that keeps it interesting.