Flickering Light Modes - Not Necessarily Safe
 

Hey everybody,

Just wanted to bring up a point that I have noticed while driving my car at night. Numorous times I've passed cyclists with their red blinkies on and I actually found the flickering bright red lights fairly distracting. A steady red light would be more than suffecient to get noticed and when driving by it's more a 'I know this cyclist is there'. When it's flickering I find myself being annoyed by it and gives the impression of being blinded and gives a worse sense of where the cyclist is. This is my personal finding ... what do you guys think?

Daniel

I think with the comments I've received from non-cyclists and former cyclists along the lines of, "Nobody can "not see you,"" and "I've seen (I saw) his (your) lights from over a mile back." I stick with my combination of flashing and steady...seems to work well. Well enough to generate feedback after the fact.

I run 3 rear flashers - a DiNotte 140 (very, very bright), plus two Planet Bike Superflash.

I also have plenty of non-flashing reflective gear on myself and the bike (red reflective conspicuity tape on the fenders, white reflective tape on the crank arms, yellow reflective leg and arm bands, and a fluorescent yellow green safety vest with 2" wide white reflective strips all the way around).

Between the active and passive systems, I'm quite sure that I can easily be seen and identified as a bike. If anyone claims they didn't see me...I'll own them in court.

it may be distracting from "comfortable groove/fast asleep" motorists but at least I know I've been noticed and, hopefully, the motorist will think about giving me the space and consideration they'd give to any other vehicle.

No, I am not saying that I can't see you, but when driving it's pretty damn distracting having blinkers in my eye sight while I am trying to focus on the road. So once again, for both pulsing or steady lights it's clear to where the biker is but if I could choose to what I would think is safer for road use for both parties, I think a steady light would work better. You're seen and the car driver can focus better on the road.

Sorry, I left out the part about; in the feedback I've received, I've never had anyone bring that up.

Blinded by a bike's taillight?
Maybe the driver shouldn't tailgate a cyclist...


The flashing taillight of a cyclist is the equivalent of a car driver stepping on the brakes at high frequency.
If drivers wake up when they see the brake light goes on, then they should also wake up if they see the flashing taillight of a bike. Once they wake up, they will leave a safe following distance.

Also, a flashing light drains the batteries slower than a steady light.

To some degree, it's distracting b/c it gets your attention. And that's the point. Our brains notice blinking better than steady, so slight nuisance = much greater safety. Think turn signals on a car or stop signs on a bus. Sorry if it's a bit annoying, but the physics of bike on car action give the bike a little extra visibility imperative.

Would you notice a solid light or a flashing light first.

For most of us, that's the end of the discussion.

---------

Personally, I'm riding on a 4-lane road with heavy traffic with a decent amount of ambient light. Most of the time, drivers aren't looking any further than the taillights of the car in front of them. A flashing light might stand out from the other lights before they get to me. A solid light never would.

The number of reports I've heard of on here from cyclists that almost get hit despite rear lights tend to indicate that blinkies are absolutely necessary.

Additionally, let's say it annoyed you, but you're an average or above motorist from an attention standpoint. We need something to get the attention of the least attentive drivers. That's a blinkie, for sure.

And I think the general response to "hey, there's a bright blinking light in my face" is supposed to be getting away from the light. Which would involve not tailgaiting the guy, passing close, etc.

I use just a Superflash, which is pretty bright for a small blinkie, but I've gotten no screams of complaint from motorists. I have gotten a single complaint from a driver who didn't like getting a Dinotte headlight in the face, but oh well.

I run two lights, one blinks to wake 'em up and the other helps them track my position. No way would I run no blinking.

"this is my personal finding ... what do you guys think?"


I think this is proof that everything, no matter how petty and insignificant it
might be, angers car drivers.

Obviously a flashing light is more 'noticeable'. That's why I said a steady light would be more than sufficient. (Not saying a steady light is more visible than blinking).
I also didn't say blinded by the tail light, I said the impressions of getting blinded. So, get your passive thinking but further than your nose is long and think ... for passing cars, I rather have them being able to focus better on the road, making it safer for you and a driver. Even then when the car hits you, SSP, you had your steady light on and you owe them in court anyhow.
Don't take this offensive guys.

I am a very experienced cyclist from the Netherlands and know what I am talking about ... this is what I've seen, it's something I want to show you as a driver as well. I am hoping for a more informative response other than 'I own them in court' this and that.

I couldn't disagree more. I tend to notice the flashing blinky but the steady red light just blends in with the sea of red car tail lights. If you want to be invisible then go with the always on light, if you want to be seen go with the blinky.

I also have a Dinotte front light and use that in flash mode. I've had vehicles pull over after passing me with that sucker on in blink mode. :D

You don't have to keep restating. It's pretty clear what you're trying to say.

You can trust your life with good enough. I'm shooting a little higher for myself.

I have only seen one place where a flashing taillight would blend in with the background. That was during my stints in Japan where the road department seems to mark every potential obstacle and construction zones with little red flashing lights. This is when I started running steady on red taillights.

In any traffic situation where the cars are running two or more taillights a steady red light would be lost against the background and a flashing taillight is needed.

A flashing light is a better attention gainer, a steady light gives better spatial awareness.

Best to run both, better to run two or more of each.

Two things come to mind...1) you saw the blinky! that is better than a lot of drivers...like the one in my area that just recently plowed into a state trooper parked on the side of the road with his ALL of his lights on! 2) a combination of flashers and solid is the best. Flashers only are hard to focus on and determine distance to, so IMHO a bright flasher and bright solid are the best bet backed up with plenty of reflective gear. There are too many drivers on the road that are so inattentive I am not sure that the flash from a small nuclear device would even get their attention. FWIW my normal tail light protocol is a couple of PB SuperFlashes.

Another thought you are from THE NETHERLANDS where people actually can drive AND know that a bicycle belongs in the road!

Aaron:)

Which means you're experienced with riding around Dutch drivers. Negotiating cars while on a bike is entirely different and, from what I'm told, much more challenging in North America. We need absolutely every tool available to not get hit.

Also, I'm not sure what 'the impressions of getting blinded' means. Can you see? Can you pilot your car in a straight line? Good. Then don't hit the blinking thing.

Again, the number of cyclists that have gotten the "but I didn't see you!" response from cars that almost hit them, despite using steady lights, implies that blinkies are of benefit.

Don't confuse people disagreeing with you for not getting 'a more informative response.' We hear you. I think most people disagree.

With enough power and the right frequency the blinkie might trigger an epileptic seizure. I've never had a motorist stop and say they saw a steady light but a car and a bus stopped and said they saw my strobe.

Flashing gets noticed better from the surroundings. That's why emergency lights, turn signals on cars etc are blinking. You notice it.

I think Mr. Underbridge has summarized best. All I would add is that part of the differing views is likely to be social rather than sensory.

In very broad strokes, Europe tends to be more socially and cooperatively minded where in the US we're generally more individualistic. In the UK, the ASBO has made it criminal to be anti-social.

Blinking lights can be annoying. I think they're annoying. I can't stand the things. In Germany, at least, this annoyance is legislated away with the requirement that bike lights be steady, not blinking. They also have laws limiting the brightness.

In the US, it's almost a right to be annoying. The sheer numbers of annoying people doing annoying things demonstrates this.

And I think that using an annoyingly bright blinkie (a DiNotte) helps keep me alive on the roads here. As long as it does that, I don't care that I or anyone else thinks it's annoying. It's doing its job.

[QUOTE=AmsterDan;6024977]...I am a very experienced cyclist from the Netherlands and know what I am talking about ...[QUOTE]

Cycling in the Netherlands may actually make you woefully unqualified to cycle in North America. There you have fantastic bike lane infrastructure, a high percentage of cyclists, and actual legal protection. You won't have any of that here; which is why many a cyclist here will gladly annoy a driver if it means they get noticed. I will lend my voice to the chorus stating i run both solid and flashing blinkies, and i run mine whenever i ride.

Well, I must agree on what has been said in the last couple of posts. It frustrates me how drivers and cyclists just do not get along. For instance, me driving and wanting to turn right into a street, seeing the cyclist in my right mirror wanting to go straight through, I have to yield the cyclist and then proceed with my turn. What does the cyclist do ... stops! I didn't blame him since he knows drivers, most don't stop and will cut you off, putting the cyclist's safety first.

Anyhow, I wish my idea would work for everyone. I realize I definately look at it from a different perspective that apperantly doesn't work here. SO! Now ... knowing this and having looked at the different opinions I start thinking that everybody should get drivers lessons at an affordable cost, non of the 'L'earners and 'N'ovice bussiness but straight up driving lessons so that proper rules, under which the rights/rules cyclists get, are being thought properly instead of a parent who ... as we as cyclists know ... often don't get it. Or is this another rediculous idea from mister Dutch.

Any driver with that kind of reaction to a blinkie has hopefully figured things out after crashing into their first few emergency vehicles :)

And thanks Ths for explaining a little more in depth. It is exactly what I mean, just don't have the higher end words for it yet ... still getting the language down.