Anybody look at the original post date?

Oh lawdy, 10 months later and this thing still hasn't been flogged into submission? Hep me! Hep me!!

That's the problem with these one-size-fits all stereotypes. I've gotten tremendous use out of my Schwinn Avenue (Trailway at Target). I had the same attitude you describe and began looking for an upgraded LBS bike. But, every time I test road a bike it didn't feel right. When I left the store, the first 50' on my Schwinn Trailway, I felt like "ahhh... that's the feel I like."

I still haven't found a reason to spend $400 or more on an LBS bike. But, in fairness I have spent a lot on my department store bike. Like, hardcase tires for $80. After as much as I spent on the LBS bike ($200 plus upgrades) it could have been worth it to get a Trek FX on sale for $400.

OTOH, I would have never spent $400 on the off chance that I might enjoy riding. The department-store route was "low friction." It allowed me to find out without spending a lot of money. And, as mentioned in another post, it was also an inexpensive way to learn about maintenance (and begin the process of saving money at the LBS over a lifetime).

I think the important consideration for anyone is to understand their own factors. Is it their first bike? Will high price prevent them from getting started riding? Will a cheap bike give them a bad riding experience? Will they learn maintenance with less fear of tearing up a cheap bike? Do they understand that they bike may not last long without proper (re-)assembly and ongoing maintenance? Will they depend on the bike for commuting or just running errands? Are they unusually short or tall (requiring better fit than a one-size-fits-all bike)?

There are so many factors that there simply is not a single answer for everyone. To me, the most valuable advice is "informed consent." Be aware of all the factors and make an informed choice. There's nothing inherently good or bad about a department store bike versus an LBS. They each have their positives and negatives.

Hello all,
I appreciate this thread since I have had my Wallmart Schwinn Avenue now for 5 months. I needed a cheap "decent" bike to use as my commuter for work and getting around. So far it has served me well and it is fairly comfortable. For the first 3 months I rode 10 miles each way on city streets in Miami, Fl with no problems. Then I started getting a flat every week, either on the front or the back! Like WTF???? I would go into the LBS every week for new tube. Not sure why this was happening but I thought it might be because I inflated tires closer to max range @ 60-65 psi. Before tires were @ 50 psi. Wnr to 55 psi and so far for 2 weeks no flats??? (actually LBS sold me a heavy duty tube for rear tire so no flats on that for 4 + weeks.
The stock Kendra tires are 700x38 and I want to go to 32's or 28's. I have the stock Arriv wheels. Can I go down to 28's? I already have decided on Marathon Supremes.

Az2008, your post's are great regarding your experience. Are there any other Avenue/Trailway riders on this site?

Thanks,

Kelly.

I think the Tourist from Target is kind of the same bike, and I ride one.

At 50 psi you could use Slime. I had another department-store bike (DSB) which came with Slimed tires and it stopped 3 flats in 3 weeks (we have goatshead thorns which go through the cheap tires like a knife through butter). I believe Slime increases rolling resistance, but with an inexpensive DSB it's probably not much (compared to adding Slime to a road bike). Slime can also make the ride rougher because it displaces air. (So do heavy duty tubes, for the same reason.). Slime's not good at higher pressures. It makes a mess instead of congealing and plugging the leak.

You could also use tire liners like Stop Flats or Mr. Tuffy. I haven't used them, but I've heard good things if they're properly installed (no sharp edges or right-angle corners that abrade the tube). That's an inexpensive way to get something like "hardcase" tires without spending $40 per tire.

I replaced mine with Bontrager Hardcase tires and have only had a couple flats. One was a piece of stiff wire that worked its way in (probably from a steel-belted blowout I rode over one night). Another was a piece of glass that embedded itself in a small cut in the tire and worked it's way in. In both cases, if I'd inspected the tire surface on a regular basis and removed embedded things I would have caught it before it happened.

The stock tires are very light and thin. If you really want a reliable ride, Bontrager Hardcase (or Specialized Armadillo) tires are worth the money. But, you could try Stop Flat.

You mentioned wanting narrower tires. I had the same thought. I put Bontrager H4 Hardcase tires on my Avenue. I used 700x35. Then I thought narrower, slick tires would improve my speed. I put Bontrager Race Lite Hardcase tires on my Trailway. I used 700x32. I prefer the H4 tires. They have a smooth center for low rolling resistance. I feel like they're easier for some reason. I don't know if it's the higher rotational mass which feels like I'm rolling with more inertia. Or, more air capacity which gives a smoother ride. I really like it better and I feel it has almost the same rolling resistance. I ride a combination sidewalks and bike lanes. I average around 15 mph. I don't have a bike computer to tell me exactly how fast I'm going. But, I feel like I'm going the same speed with either tire. Maybe I can get the Race Lite's a little faster if I'm really pushing like a workout.

One of the best things I did to improve speed was to replace the shock-absorbing seat post with the rigid M-Wave sold by Walmart for $8. I feel like I get more consistent pedaling, position, etc. The suspension post seemed to soak up some pedaling energy. The next best thing was replacing the large, comfy seat with something more streamlined and firm. Like this inexpensive Ventura ASA MTB. It took a couple weeks for the nerves in my bum to die off. But, now I love it. The lower friction improved my speed and distance. Like the seat post, it made me feel like I had a more solid platform to pedal from. And, it's amazing how much friction those larger/cushioned seats have. I feel like I glide on this seat.

The only other thing I'd strongly recommend is overhauling the front/rear axle, the bottom bracket and the headset bearings. Factory assembly doesn't put a lot of grease in those places. My BB had metal shavings in it. Everything was overtightened. You've ridden so far now that any overtightening has probably worn into a better fit. But, that's also a reason to overhaul (fresh grease). The headset isn't as important. www.bicycletutor.com has videos showing how. You just need to invest $30 in tools and some time in learning. You'll save a fortune on LBS repairs.

Another thing to do is inspect your rim's inner surface. Mine had some rough spots that could abrade the tubes. I used a polishing stone and/or fine wet sand paper to to smooth it down. Mostly it was the seam where the rim joins together to form a circle. But, the spoke holes were rough too. I smoothed mine down and replaced the flimsy rubber liner with Velox. I used the narrowest size. It fits within the inner channel and just barely covers the spoke holes. If I didn't smooth each spoke hole I would use the wide size because the narrow cuts it a little too close (barely covering the holes). The wide size will ride up the sides of the channel a little. That's not bad.

Your LBS should have detected if your flats were due to an inner imperfection, low pressure (snake-bite flat), or external puncture. It's easy to determine.

EDIT: Another thing you'll want to plan on doing is replacing the kickstand. The stock stand is flimsy. I got one of these Greenfields for $7. You don't have to cut the leg to size. It's the perfect size out of the bag. You don't need to use the top clamp thing. The Avenue/Trailway have a plate on the frame for the kickstand to bolt to. You'll bolt the Greenfield the same way (without the top clamp plate). You just need a new bolt that's shorter so you don't look dorky with a long bolt extending below your bike. I cut mine down with a hacksaw. But, I'd like to replace the bolt with a hex-cap bolt so I can Super-Glue a ball bearing into the socket to reduce the potential for someone to steal my kickstand. If you do that, you'll want to get a split lockwasher to have a better fit between the bolt surface and the frame's mounting plate (hole).

EDIT 2: Another thing to consider is replacing the handlebars. The Avenue's bars have a pull-back design. They're more "comfort" style than aggressive "cafe" (flat bar) style. (The Trailway has straighter bars. About 12 degrees less pull-back angle. I like the Trailway's bars better.). I replaced my bars with Origin 8 MTB Pro-Urban Riser. I used the polished silver bar. It looks good. This bar has the same angles/rise/pullback as the bar which comes with the Trailway. But, it's about 2" shorter (narrower). I like the more aggressive compact/narrow riding position with the hands in line with the shoulders, not spread out like an ape. (If you had the Trailway bars, you could just cut off 3/4" from each side of the bar and essentially have the same bar. But, the Avenue's swept-back bars aren't the same.).

I intend to try some bar-ends to give me some flexibility with hand placement. In that case, I would prefer the wider Trailway bar. The bar ends would consume some space on each end, pushing the grips toward the center to give the same narrower riding position. I have my original Trailway bars, I didn't cut them down. I replaced them with Origin 8. I would just go back to them. If I cut them down, I'd look for bars that are about 1-1/2" longer than the Origin 8 (which are 560mm long).

Target's Schwinn Tourist is not the same bike. The Trailway is. The Tourist seems to be the same bike as a bike sold at Walmart called the Varsity Flat Bar (or Hybrid series, or atheletic series, or hybrid series. I've seen a couple names for it.). It seems to be the Schwinn Varsity road-bike frame with straight handlebars instead of the drop-down ram's horn bars. It's much smaller and compact than the Avenue/Trailway frame. (I saw one at my local Walmart, and I've seen the Tourist a number of times.). The product photos appear to show the Tourist with more top-tube angle. It may not be exactly the same as the Varsity. But, size wise, it's the same. It's much more compact than the Trailway. (I've seen both side-by-side at Target. Huge difference in size.).

The Tourist is a nice bike. I really like it. But, compact and short. I think it's good for someone in the 5-2 to 5-6 range. I'm 6-0 and it's not large enough for me. The Avenue/Trailway's beauty is it's steep angle top-tube which makes it adaptable to a large range of heights. And, the adjustable steering stem which adds some height adjustment on the front (but not enough for me, I had to add a threadless stem extender, which is perfect.). It's larger/longer which makes it good for up to 6-2. (It's hard for me to believe 6-2 would work ok, but I've seen some 6-2 riders say it works for them.). But, the seat can go down so low due to the steep top-tube that a 5-2 rider can use it (although it will continue to feel like a large bike because it's tall in the front). The steep seat-tube angle also creates the illusion of more length. (The higher the seat, the further back it goes.).

BTW: Sears sells a Schwinn Midmoor. It seems to be the Avenue/Trailway too.

az2008 thanks for the insight regarding this bike...I will be going for the 32 Schalbe supremes for the tires...I will be checking the rim tape too. A new seat and maybe look into the bars and bar ends you spoke of. Funny enough...my kickstand bit the dust...it was flimsy..I tried to bend it but broke it :( So new kickstand for sure!

Best regards,'
Kelly.

Why does it matter?

Given that she posted the question in July of 2008, it's probable that she already has bought it. And since she hasn't posted much since, it probably ended up buried at the back of the garage or abandoned in a rack somewhere, like so many cheap discount store bikes.

Could also be that she is busy doing something else, including riding her bike, instead of posting speculative drivel about bikes with impure lineage on BF.

Touche' :)

Would it have been any different if it were a LBS bike?

Where do you think a lot of those neat used deals from CraigsList pop up from ;)? Yup - the multitudes of people who bought an expensive bike thinking they were going to love cycling, or wanting to emulate TdF racers and ended up not liking the sport. Nothing wrong with that... just a fact of finding a hobby.

Basically, there's two schools of thought that you'll hear about any sport, or musical instrument:

1. Spend the money and get a good piece of equipment, because otherwise your time will be so unenjoyable you'll probably never pick it up anyway, and this way you don't have to upgrade for quite some time.
2. Get a cheap piece of equipment so you can see if you like it, that way you aren't wasting a huge investment if you end up not liking it.

Personally, I think that if you have a lot of disposable income, you may as well go with 1, but a lack of disposable income shouldn't stop you from just going with 2. It's silly to keep yourself from trying the sport/activity until you can afford a good quality piece of equipment, and then risk that rare capital on it. And even then, some people (such as myself), just aren't in a position to spend more than a few hundred dollars on a bike. Less stressful to just get a cheap-o until you're sure you like it. $.02

While you can theoretically get a good quality used bike for the same price as a dept store bike, I wouldn't recommend someone wanting to try the sport/activity do this unless they have a friend that knows a thing or two about bikes, or they are very committed to learning. I bought my first adult bike this way, and while it was a great way of learning (I was committed), it was terribly frustrating getting it in good working order, and I wanted to just give it up more than once, even with me being committed. Now my opinion on used bikes makes that $.04. :p

Excellent point. I don't post often. I rode my 18-month old Schwinn Avenue 40 miles four nights ago.

That was the position I was in. I thought I'd make good use of a bike, but wasn't sure enough to spend $400-$500 on a Trek FX.

I also wanted to learn to do my own maintenance. I was afraid to "experiment" with an expensive bike.

Finally, I was nervous about how to secure a bike. It was a lot easier to put a $200 bike at risk than a $500 bike. In other words, I was more willing to ride to a store in a bad area. More willing to enjoy myself and not sweat protecting my investment.

That last point cuts both ways. A thief will be less inclined to spend time breaking my u-lock to get my department-store bike (compared to a Trek FX 7.3). Less inclined to strip my "Tourney-grade" components.

Now that I'm into it, and feel more confident about assessing security and how to protect my bike, I wouldn't have a problem spending $500 on a bike. It would be a worthwhile investment. But, I really like what I have. I haven't found an LBS bike that feels better than my department-store bike. So, I'd be glad to upgrade. But, in reality, I don't have any reason to. I've upgraded my $200 bike with $80 worth of tires, new handlebars, kickstand, quick-release rear axle.

The main thing is, I've ridden about 5,000 miles in 18 months. I lost 30 pounds. I'm healthy. I know how to do my own maintenance. I'm perfectly happy with my choice. (But, I realize some people may need a better fitting bike than a one-size-fits-all department store bike. And, some people may not be inclined to do their own maintenance. My choice isn't necessarily the right one for everyone.).

Really glad to hear you're enjoying your bike.

az2008,
I am still looking to put new ties on. Either 28"s or 32's. Will the 28's fit on the Arriv rims? My riding consists of mostly Miami city streets, occasional sidewalks and a few gravelly sections now and then. I am still looking at marathon Supremes but saw these http://www.performancebike.com/bikes...__?PID=4003003 Forté Strada K Road Tire" in another thread. Price looks better :D

I suspect this thread will remain viable and I am glad I bought the "Walmart Bike" It is my "transportation vehicle" for now. I may upgrade to a Trek at some point but I sure don't regret my choice.

Best regards,

Kelly.

The rims which came with my Avenue and Trailway are 14mm wide. I've read that tires should be 1.45 to 2.0 times the width of the rim. That means 20mm to 28mm. That sounds awfully narrow considering how the bike comes with 35 or 38mm tires.

When I switched from a 35mm (Bontrager H4 Hardcase) to a 32mm (Bontrager Race Lite Hardcase) I thought the reduced width would improve my rolling resistance. But, I didn't feel it much. I don't understand rolling resistance. I thought narrower would be better. But, when the center of both tires is smooth/slick maybe a 3-5 mm difference doesn't make much difference. (Also, keep in mind that the Avenue's rims are so narrow that it pulls a 35 mm tire in, making it a little narrower than if it was on the ideal rim. The factory 38mm isn't anywhere near 38mm when mounted on that rim. It's more like a 35. A 35mm is pulled in a little too, making it a little narrower like a 32mm would be.).

I tend to prefer the 35mm's ride. It feels a little softer (more air acts like suspension). That's noticeable because I ride in bake lanes and sidewalks. Bike lanes can have a lot of road debris. Transitions between sidewalks and streets can be jolting. If I rode in traffic, on a road bike, maybe narrower would be more noticeable than pumping a hybrid which isn't too efficient.

I think this is one of those things where you'll have to develop your own "feel." At $12, you could buy a pair at both sizes. If you're really motivated to improve speed/efficiency, you might keep an eye open for a quality road bike (or maybe a single-speed "fixie" bike). For me, I'm good with the 15-16 mph ride I get, and the feel of the H4 tires. You might prefer 20-25 mph and a rougher ride (or the "thrill" of riding in traffic). Experiment. Keep your mind open. You can sell your failed experiments (tires and bikes) on Craigslist.

I can't say much about the tires you're considering (Marathon or Schwalb). I like Bontrager Hardcase tires because I want more security against flats. I've heard that some stiffer tires are almost as effective. For example, a guy at a store that sells Bontrager told me he likes Vittoria Randonneur. He said any tire that's stiff like that will resist punctures like Hardcase tires. (I'd like to try a pair. But, they're only $10 less than the Hardcase tires. I'm also not convinced they'd be low-rolling resistance because they have some center tread. I like a smooth center.).

All I can say is that the H4 Hardcase's feel transitioning between street and sidewalk (ramps) is good for a moderate 12-16 mph ride. Its smooth center gives it low rolling resistance. The aggressive edge tread comes in handy when I have to ride off the sidewalk into grass or dirt. I really like that tire. (And then the hardcase makes it almost flat proof.).

One thing to consider is that the narrower tires have higher air pressure. When I put the 32mm Race Lites on my Avenue, the 100 PSI compressed the rim and caused the spokes to be loose. My wheels are 24-spoke (paired spoke). I think later Trailway and Avenues use 32-spoke wheels with spokes grouped in 4s. Maybe it's not a problem with that wheel. But, it's something to keep an eye on. (For me it wasn't a problem. Just an opportunity to learn wheel straightening, spoke tensioning, dishing, etc. I bought a "Spin Doctor" wheel truing stand on Craigslist for about $30.).

That could be another reason to go with H4s. They have about 80 PSI. Less chance to affect the rims which were factory tensioned for tires running 45 PSI.

Just bought this bike today from Wal-Mart. I am going to post each week about how this bike is doing.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/26-Men-s-S...i_sku=13398151

Happy Trails.

Just go to the town dump and ul have your pick of cheap walmart bikes for free..im sure there loaded with *NEXT* mtb bikes!!! cheap crap that wont last long......

I know I'll have to take it apart and put it back together when I get home and then I'll let you know how it rides.

Hey! This is a great idea!

I'm not worried about the components. Everybody knows that they are solid sewage.

What I'm concerned about is the frame! Ideally, anybody should feel relatively confident in bicycle frame construction and technology in these modern times (2011).

If you get a good frame, just upgrade the components, and within a couple of years, you should have a good bike. No?

- Slim :)

The year doesn't matter!

This question never seems to get answered with any degree of certainty...

- Slim :)

"Anyone who has recently purchased a $100 bike at Walmart wants to pay attention to a bicycle recall issued this week.

Bridgeway International of Naples, Florida has recalled 91,000 "NEXT"-branded men's 26-inch hybrid bicycles. The products have a defective bicycle chain that can break and cause the bicyclist to lose control and fall in a bicycle accident."

http://www.massachusettsinjurylawyer...ly-bought.html

Heh. I'll tell you what.