I always get in position B in the left tire track. I don't think there is anything dangerous about being courteous and letting right turners get by. I've never had a motorist try to pull up alongside and go straight and I don't see why they would.

Also to the OP, I would only take position C or D at an intersection where it's not possible for vehicles to turn right.

Does anyone else think that it's often too difficult/dangerous to get into position B to begin with? Yeah, it's the best place to be, but I find that motorists are usually usually too aggressive to allow me to go across the lane (they won't let me in if I'm on the right), and traffic is too thick to just take it without waiting for an opening.

Maybe because I almost always ride on busy city streets? I'm surprised that more people haven't brought up the fact that getting to point B might not even be possible given the traffic conditions.

Most the time when I come to an intersection where the right lane can either turn right or go straight, I filter through on the right as much as I feel is reasonable given the space to ride in, density of traffic, number of cars with turn signals on, etc. So more often I wind up at points C and D.

I'd prefer to be at B, but if it's not doable, C and D are not terrible solutions. They are certainly not the "deathtraps" some made them out to be, as long as you are aware of your surrounding, know what to look out for, and are as assertive as the motorists around you. Proof? I'm still alive after countless intersections at points C and D :)

C is the correct answer. B will get you rear ended or mowed over by the cars going straight as you slowly pick up speed and they are looking at the cars turning in front of them not at all expecting a bicycle to their left crossing in front of them left to right.
Your C position should keep you far enough into the lane to indicate your intent to go straight ahead. It's ok for the cars turning right to wait for you.
All these folks indicating B are just future accident statistics waiting to happen.

You couldn't be more wrong.. C and D are excellent ways to get right hooked while trying to cross the intersection. The most common types of bicycle-vehicle collisions are right hooks and left hooks, which B puts you in the best position to avoid. Collisions from the rear are relatively rare.

If I can't get to B, I would stay in line with the cars at the light while taking the lane slightly to the left of C and D. Do you use your left arm to signal and turn your head around? When I do that, I usually find someone who is willing to accommodate me but I don't really ride in the city, I live in suburbia.

Speaking from experience, I used to often line up in position B in order to allow me to waive right turners through. However, I now line up at C or between C and B. The reason: I was in position B, waving right turners through, assuming only right turners would slip by. However, the light changed from red to green, the straight though traffic took my waive to mean I was waiving them through. After 10 or so cars slid by on my right, picking up speed with each car, with me sitting there like a sitting duck between lines of moving traffic, I made the decision that B is about the worst place I could B. If its not too busy, B may be fine but with heavy traffic, I will take C or between B and C.

If a couple of cars are already at the light, i might sit in the middle of the lane behind the car or two in front of me, and when the light turns I go forward, through the intersection, then move to the right once through.

If there are half a dozen cars, i'll filter up the side and sit off the rear bumper of the first car in line, so between c and d in your pic. This way I wont get right hooked by the driver as he'd have to go over the curb in order to hit me, and I can see the driver of the second car, and he can see me.

If there are no cars when i pull up, i'd go for B.

Why would you guys ever wait in line with the cars? That's a sure way to get rear ended! I've actually had a CHP officer tell my class that when on a motorcycle to actually pull up between at least a couple of cars at a red light to avoid getting smacked from behind. I don't know why a bike would be any different. Now, I say this from the persepctive that I'm usually in position C and would be impeding the cars behind as I cross the intersection. And as I said before, I'm never the first one through the intersection. I really can't see a cop writing a citation for a cyclist pulling up to the crosswalk...

I stick to C--as close to the right fork as possible. I can't imagine making my way to B unless I were far ahead of any cars as I rolled to a stop at the light. And upon the green, I wouldn't feel comfortable having cars try to pass me on the right while sandwiched between cars heading opposite on my left. In general, I prefer the right half of the rightmost lane, as it offers the best chance of escape onto grass, sidewalk, etc, in an emergency.

what is the safe way to get over to the shoulder and onto the sidewalk to just use the pedestrian crossway? I still get to nervous in mid day traffic to act like a car on a bicycle when it comes to major intersections and roads.

No wonder drivers freak out when they see cyclists. Since we have so many different opinions on where we are supposed to place ourselves at an intersection, the drivers behind us get frustrated. :rolleyes:

"OK, what is this biker gonna do here?" :twitchy:




For the record, I have a couple of intersections on my ride like the OP describes, except no bike lanes.
I take the lane at the intersection no matter if I am first, second, or last in line. When the light turns green
I proceed through the intersection and move over to the right once up and running. So I guess my
answer to the OP's question would be between B and C.

any one may be best depending on traffic dynamics at the time.

Most of the intersections where I am in this situation have a gore where right turners will be behind me if I am the first vehicle. I will not be mixing with the right turners. I am also on roads with a 40+mph speed limit most of the time.

Most instance I am in C. Right turn on red is only if it is clear. If a car going straight was there then they would have to stop anyway. I feel C gives me visibility to the first car. If they are turning right they will be looking right at me. I do concede that if somebody is coming up behind me after I have stopped and they are looking for a gap there is a good chance they will rear end me but I don't see position B much of an improvement. Probably still get clipped there for drivers that self absorbed.

I am not opposed to B but the likely hood of me being in that position is slim. B is not an option all that often. I ride the white line if I am not making a left. 95% of the time there is already a car at the intersection and I am pulling up next to them and they are already stopped and if they have on a turn signal I line up behind them on the right side of the lane but out far enough that the car behind has to stay behind me till I move back over.

D=Dead. You are in the cars blind spot if you are behind the passenger door and even at the passenger door some people have blinders to anything not visible out the windshield.

I pick C, but it's actually an assertive C+. I've been in B, and had cars pass me on the right as I started forward and drifted right. I also feel like B is like you're deliberately provoking motorists. I sit far forward into the crosswalk, and I repeatedly glance at the car off my left hip and make sure I am noticed. just before the light changes I stand up on the pedals and start to inch forwards, knowing that my movement makes me more visible, but I am always on guard for cross traffic coming through late after the light has changed.

It depends on the circumstances - how much traffic there is, how fast, how wide the intersection, etc. Not to mention your own level of comfort in such traffic.

You have a valid strategy with B, as long as you know what you're gonna do when someone going straight lines up next to you. Because when the light changes, you might find yourself having to cross through a line of cars going straight. If you're OK with that, there's no problem. Otherwise you might want to think about getting in front of (or behind) such a straight going car, before the light changes and hugging the lane.

Others may know more though.

Yeah, I haven't known how to reply since I might use B, C, or D, depending on whether I'm in nyc or jersey and whether there's right on red. Going east to west: New york drivers treat me like I have a separate bike lane whether it's painted or not and I filter up the right to get to the front, asserting myself just as the light changes (position C). I'll only claim a lane if I need it for a left turn. In genteel jersey drivers treat me like I'm in the line-up even if I remain on the shoulder so I stay there and take my turn when it comes (position D, however far back that is when I arrive). In parts of jersey where they are less clear on a. how to treat bikes and b. how to drive in general, I'll take B if there's right on red or the lane if there's not.

Even though there's no official hand signal for "going straight" there are some times when I catch the eye of the driver next to me to indicate this by pointing ahead, which takes care of the problem of drivers not knowing whether I'm a cyclist who would signal a turn or not.

Agree. Center of the lane at this stop.

So we all agree at this point, C is the correct answer!........LOL......LOL........

B is the correct answer.
You don't have to switch positions after the intersection, you continue on in your lane and if there's someone behind you... sucks that they don't have a bike. You're gonna be through the intersection and moved over before the cars start moving anyhow.

C is an ok spot if right hand turns are not permitted on the red, but if they are then you're just holding up traffic for no good reason. C is just asking for someone to take your lane anyhow, so if right turns are not permitted then somewhere between B and C is the best spot.

B is correct.
Why use C and invite right hooks. Even with D you can get right hooked from the car behind.

I paid extra attention to my similar intersection the other day. For me, I wouldn't take B. It won't help people turning right because the lane would not be wide enough. I take C because if necessary I can squeeze all the way up against the curb and let the right-turning folks by, but if I don't make an effort, the lane isn't wide enough for them to squeeze around me. If I went with B, I would not be able to let people make their right turn unless I cozied right up next to the car in the left lane, which doesn't sound safe, plus people going straight might be tempted to pass on the right once the light changed.

I keep an eye in my mirror to see if there's someone behind me that wants to turn right, and if we're early enough in the light cycle, I make room for them to pass and wave them by. I have noticed, though, that many people never put on their turn signal, so they end up waiting.

You really seem to have misapplied a lot of your safety lessons. Cars and motorcycles and bikes all have different safety strengths and weaknesses.

Bike has more visibility than a car, so looking both ways before an intersection is fine.

Bike is often right hooked, so waiting on the right is a less safe method for handling red-light runers.

Cars get rear ended. When it happens at a red light, it's usually a pain because the front car can't get out of the way. A bike can. It's maneuverable. More so than a motorcycle.

Instead, your solution is to place yourself in a less safe spot.

If your lane is too narrow for cars to pass you comfortably, what do right turners do when the car ahead of them isn't turning?

Everyone has to do their own thing...
I, for one, will never be the first through a straight intersection.
As far as getting rear ended and a bike being more manurable than a motorcycle, maybe but unless you are looking behind every second, you may never see that car that is about to hit you....
I'd much rather pull up past the cars already there and have a safety cushion...
I've been riding in San Diego for a while now and never even had a close call getting right hooked, why? I think it's because I pull all the forward and make sure the cars see me. Also, if there is a right turn lane (or room to make a turn lane i.e. bike lane), I sit to the left side of the turn lane.
to each their own though...

B if there's room and visibility.

Keep in mind though, you're on a bicycle, not in a car or on a big heavy motorbike, so you also have an option E: hauling your bike up onto the footpath while you're stopped at the light, jazzing the pedestrian crossing button, and switching back over to the bike lane as you cross. If it's a tight or particularly hairy intersection I'll take E every time. It's also a good way to get a green light when there's no traffic around to activate the sensor...

I opt for pos'n C. I always feel most secure on the right. Out in the lane, with cars on my right - as in pos'n A or B, I feel awfully exposed.
But this thread points out one thing - when you're on a bike in traffic, you're in a dangerous situation no matter where you are. At A or B you can get rear-ended - or right hooked for that matter. At C and D you can get left hooked. No matter where you are, you are in danger of being run down if you are not extremely alert at ALL TIMES!
But I'll take C, as it's closest to the sidewalk where I can leap to safety if I have to.

My answer is "B". This nonsense about letting other people go first makes great sense as long as there's a steady supply of the ignorant who aren't waiting for YOU to go first. It's this kind of let everyone else take the risk mentality that has 4-way stops becoming the greatest impediment to traffic we've ever created. Not to mention that in the middle of the day when the roads are full of cotton-tops and blue-hairs who are full of unpredictable acts of kindness, usually in the form of "let the fat guy on the bike go ahead" I'd be there forever waiting for them to go first.

I prefer to look instead. If the cross lanes are full of stopped cars the risk is pretty easy to gauge.

Getting passed on the right by someone who blows off a right turn only lane has happened, but they're in a hurry and are long gone by the time I'm even through the intersection.

Regardless, I thought I'd share an interesting viewpoint:

So my neighbor is an EMT, who works predominantly on the north side of town in sketchier neighborhoods. I asked him once if he dealt with a lot of accidents involving cyclists. "All the time." I asked if it was mostly kids, or adults. "Adults, by far. Almost never kids." I asked what sage advice he had for cyclists. "When you get to the corner, walk your bike across." 8-)

What would happen if everybody took this "driver improvment class" that says they should never be the first one to enter an intersection?

Everyone would think it through and realise that there'll never be anyone in the intersection, so they can run reds whenever they want, and it'd rapidly descend in to chaos! :D

Positioning to ride to B,


if there's already a car or two occupying B and the line up with right hand signals on before you reach the intersection, and you are filtering up on the line with more space on the other side of the stripe,

"A" IS the most appropriate, most expeditious positioning.

Using a quick directional hand signal to quell any uncertainty as the cross signal turns yellow - you are at the head of the line, moving straight as the motorist lineup turns right.

if a semi truck was in both lanes, prepping up to turn left, or right, I'd be in different road positions at the intersection. if the semi was turning left or the lead motorist in the straight/right lane was signalling they actually wanted to be turning left, I'm in position "C."

Position "D" is often best when a semi truck is turning right. STAY BEHIND THE TRUCK.

D is commonly also the default 'rolling' position as traffic starts up while you are riding up on traffic to a congested intersection...... positioning not directly beside any car, behind one and in front of another, not able to get to position "B" before reaching the intersection.

Lane positioning is VERY traffic dependant. Use of A,B,C, or D are all best.