You can get a Dinotte 200L for just over $100 when it's on sale, for the AA version where you bring your own rechargable batteries and charger to the party. When I was looking a few months ago, I found that often the sale price was on their website at like 6AM, and went off by 7AM or so.

I don't think their sales are announced or maybe even scheduled - just watch their website.

I liked my 200L so much that 2 weeks later I bought a 140L taillight. I've gotten comments from coworkers on BOTH saying "Did you buy new lights?" Previously I had been running a TrailTech 13W HID up front, which was 3 years old and fading, and two PB SuperFlashs in the back.

I think back on the lights that were available decades ago and shake my head at their pitiful outputs, large weight and size and either high drag or short run times. We've come so far in lights in such a short period of time...but we haven't reached the promised land yet.

Modern LED flashlights are indeed inexpensive relative to the light they produce and also to bicycle specific lights. Some of the best are cheap, light, small, have spanking good run times on cheap-to-operate rechargables and produce prodigious amounts of light. Their deficiencies include simple optics that throw a round beam and the lack of any light thrown to the side.

If the OP were to head down the local MUP with a new P7, I don't doubt other trail users would be shouting "get that #*@% light out of my eyes!!!". Despite the high-tech electronics and huge amount of photons, the optics in these flashlights is embarrassingly primitive (and sad to say many bike-specific headlights aren't any better). The Berec Ever Ready Frontguard I had 30 years ago was the first bike light I had with true headlight optics: it threw a beautiful rectangular beam down in front of the bike but it cut off the main beam light from on-coming traffic (just like automobile headlights do) to prevent blinding other road users.

I have a Fenix and it's impressive, but I know it appears as a point source to traffic directly ahead and is hardly detectable to traffic off to either side at intersections. The old Berec had a big round lens - just short of 4" in diameter - and the optics spilled a controlled amount of light to either side. Despite it's whimpy output it was much, much better for being visible.

Some of the modern bike lights have very good side visibility. Take the Trek Ion Recharge as an example: the entire front ring of the light glows - but alas, glows 360degs, so it puts a bright source in the rider's eyes. I guess you can fix this with a piece of tape.

The only modern lights I've seen that combine both modern lightweight/bright/long runtime lighting with a beam shape actually designed for road use are those from Germany. The B&M Ixon IQ reminds me a lot of my old Berec, but with all the improvements modern technology affords.

HTH,
tcs

Being made in the USA is of value to me. I care about things like the strength of my local economy, worker's rights to a fair and safe workplace, environmentally responsible practices, and freedom from totalitarian government oppression. I prefer my money to go to places that care about those things and not to a country like China where it will prop up their totalitarianism, so if I find a product that is made in the 1st world, or a vaguely responsible and free developing nation, I will buy it over a made in China item even if performance is less: because overall the product is better for the world. It's not all about me.

In today's economy it may be very hard to avoid all made in China goods. They dominate many areas of manufacturing. But there are types of goods where it is possible, and just because we have to give China our money for, say, running shoes, if we can avoid doing so for products where we still have a choice, then, hey, every little bit helps.

It's irresponsible to only care about the usefulness of a product without considering the impact of its manufacture. If one has thought about it, and decided that buying Chinese goods is positive for his particular world view, then fine. That's an honest decision. But to simply not even consider anything but the price and quality of the end product is totally selfish and violates one's responsibility to care about the lives of others.

i agree

im not an avid patriot or anything (embarrassed the last 8 years actually) , but it is a fact that american made goods are 99% of the time higher quality than Chinese goods

Indeed, I'm not going to buy an unsafe product just because it's made in the US, and I'm probably not going to shoot myself in the foot by paying 3 or 4 times more for otherwise identical products just because they're made in the US, but made in the US was definitely a factor in going with the Dinotte products finally. And when products really ARE identical (in terms of quality), the prices usually aren't much different. If something made in Asia is a lot cheaper, it's probably not as good either. Not always true but I think usually true. Unfortunately, there's so little made in the US anymore that most people never get a chance to realize this these days.

One additional factor to consider: ISTM that the quality of customer service pretty much goes in this order:

Designed, made and headquartered in the USA: Absolutely unexcelled customer service
Designed and headquartered in the USA, made overseas: pretty good customer service
Designed and headquartered overseas, sold by a company with significant US distributorship: probably OK customer service
Designed and made overseas, sold into a generic distribution in the US: No customer service to speak of - if it breaks, tough luck.

Value is subjective, and I don't mean simply cash value, my definitive of value is the product's worth to the consumer, and it should be not judged on price nor the country of manufacture.

It is a complex issue to put it succinctly, but it is fallacious to say buying from your own country helps it on the long run. It is universally agreed among economist it doesn't, but somehow the public doesn't think so.

So please continue with your ill-informed protectionist purchasing behaviour and watch your country fall while everyone else in the world benefits from free trade. The Chinese doesn't need your money anyway.

Those flashlights y'all are talking about take up more room than x2.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...ashboardCC.jpg

No way. The mount might be a few millimeters wider but the light itself is narrower. You may have plenty of legitimate reasons for not wanting to use a flashlight, but room on your handlebars ain't one of them.

Free and fair trade with your allies definitely benefits all, in the long run. However, could you not see the benefit to the U.S., for example, of paying a bit more for oil from Canada, than from Hugo Chavez? Or selling corn to France for a bit less than we could get from Iran? Surely your free trade argument is valid, but so is the point of choosing your trading partners carefully, no?

Not when you take the battery pack into consideration

I wasted money on one of those too before I discovered the P7's. They absolutely put this light to shame. You need to invest in a charger is the only problem but you can still beat $80. :)

This applies to pre-1980 China before it opens up its economy, but not now. See the massive amount of Chinese workers being laid off because of decreased demand from the US consumers? What are those millions of workers going to do sitting in their villages if we do not buy their products?

And for the whole sweatshop argument: for us it seems though to have a monthly income of USD$300, but remember a meal in those villages cost less than USD$1.

Anyway I have a UltraFire WF-606A, good stuff, $20 Shipped from dealextreme.com.

I use one of those as my supplemental helmet light and you are right, it is a nice little light. My P7 was $40.

By avoiding trade with a specific country (such as an embargo), you limit that country's GDP growth and standard of living, it is counterproductive as you gain more resentment and the people of that country aren't better off.

Chavez got into power democratically and fairly, because he had the support of the poor majority who's standard of living is so dismay and resented the rich. If they were better off, maybe they wouldn't have voted such demagogue into power. However, this issue is far too difficult to sum up without writing an essay about political economy, so I won't get into it.

There's plenty of room, but make sure you get a 31.8mm clamp. On the plus for using a flashlight, you won't have wires and external battery to deal with.

Hit and miss. I have an UltraFire $20 flashlight, and after 2 weeks the switch got so bad I can't even use it as a flashlight. I have to whack it against something every 15 seconds to make it come back on again.

Also the beam pattern was pretty lousy, and the battery life is horrible. I really need at least 90 minutes to make it to work and back, and I'd like to have a little safety on that, and it's nice with my Dinotte to not HAVE to charge every day.

Not being 'sold' on LED lighting for a headlight system yet, my recommendation would be a 10w Halogen Niterider Trail Rat available @ pricepoint for 99.98. I've got 3 of these and have found them to be consistant and plenty bright enough for my 40 mi rt rural commute. Brandscycle used to have them @ the same price w/no shipping, but it appears they've gone over to the Minewt system for all their NR HL products.

"Chávez assumed power as President in 1998." His later "elections" were frauds. "While exit polls...showed Chavez losing by a large margin (59 – 41), the official results put Chavez free and clear by a vote of 58 to 41 percent."

Sorry I could not let that bit pass, Mr. B. I want to say much more, especially about Chavez, but it's not the place. You can pm me, or we can argue on the politics forum. It is an interesting argument that defies certainty, and much of what you said made sense. But we are here to talk bikes and commuting, and we've drifted pretty far from that discussion.

+1 for Minewt USB!

The only LED I've had a problem with was a Fenix. Their customer service was excellent and the problem was solved. While that is nice, I've yet to have a problem with any DealExtreme merchandise.

Just thought I would relay my experience with LED's. :)

Of course Chavez assumed power as President; that's what happens when someone elected to the office. And not surprisingly, Barack Obama will assume power on Jan 20, join the past 43 US presidents that have assumed power. But, as you said, this is not the right forum for this discussion.

Back to the OP's question, I would get a P7 flashlight powered by 18650 batteries. Total cost is under 80 including spare batteries and charger. They're bright enough for most roads and you have enough left over for a TR-801 to use as a helmet light.

What part of the Chavez/China thing is going to be on the final exam?

I have a Fenix LD20 and a Minewt USB. I really like them both but I always reach for the Minewt because it is convenient to charge (USB), it is on and off of my bike very quickly (I have to take it off whenever I lock up) and finally, I am slow and cautious so I don't need a 200+ lumen light. How fast you ride has almost as much to do with your light selection as where you are riding.

That said, there is something really fun about insanely powerful lights.

The whole sweatshop argument shows a clear ignorance and lack of experience with foreign travel, exchange-rates and cultures. It's like the Germans looking at the U.S. and saying, "What a bunch of barbarians, not offering their workers subsidized university education. We get 6-weeks paid vacation every year and free national healthcare. Don't buy any American goods because they are using illegal employment practices and taking advantage of their workers."

Aside from that, the P7 is the best value in lighting right now. Anywhere from 500-700 lumens (depending upon who's "official" rating you look at) for $40-60. Just bought two with charger and extra batteries for $120. That's over 10-lumens/dollar, nothing comes close!

Don't be ridiculous. I think you'll find many of us here are quite international, have lived in several countries, are multi-lingual and so on. That's what's given us a "big picture" view of these issues.

It's not about wages and standard of living. It's about the political situation and all the exploitation there. All you have to do is ask yourself if you'd be happy living under their government, economic system, and work place "culture". If not, then there is clearly something deficient about it. Next you ask yourself if sending your dollars into that system is going to help keep it in place or replace it with something more fair. I believe the former, as the majority of the money always goes to the bosses. I'm not comfortable using a less-than-free people as my cheap labor force just to save me a few bucks.

Since the thread seems to be eroding without me, I'll just jump back in to give annc credit. There was a 'free and fair' election, in between his failed coup, and his rigged re-elections. I hope I did not mislead anyone about this champion of human rights. Apologies again, and back to lights, hopefully.

I've cheated on my cygolite. It's fine out of the box but I installed 2 10 watt bulbs and am running a RC 8.4v battery that hikes the output. It's also my generic helmet light.
On my Fuji I have a computer controlled DIY dual halogen system. I have multiple 20w and 35w high intensity halogen light units to mix & match and a 6 amp hour 18v battery. It's not within the budget - the battery was $160.
I also have a 2 battery $40 P7 that seems incredibly bright but bulky. It's fastened to my quick release on the front wheel of my winter/cross bike. The Lithium batteries last 1 hour approx and are a bit of a hassle to recharge.