Do we have an operational definition for "hybrid"?
 

Hey all, in a lot of recent threads, the term "hybrid" is being used but the bikes being shown range all over the board. It leads me to really question my definition of "hybrid". My old-school definition alluded to a rather slow but comfortable bike that was about 30 lbs unloaded, with crappy front suspension and maybe a very inefficient frame that boarded on cruiser geometry. Oh, and don't forget the olds school open cell foam grips :)

The bikes I am seeing referenced in that category now include such efficient looking machines as the gary fisher wingra http://www.fisherbikes.com/bike/model/wingra and the kona dew drop Kona Dew Drop http://www.konaworld.com/09_dewdrop_u.cfm .

In my mind, these are not hybrids. Aside from tire size and maybe a sexy fork, I don't see much functional difference between the wingra and the Sirrus (and I am sure that specialized does not market the sirrus as a hybrid).

Moreover, the Kona Dew Drop seems to be very functionally aligned with the Schwinn DBX or even the Trek Portland. And these are definitely not hybrids, in my mind.

So, what is the definition of a hybrid?

It's varied over time. 15 years ago, it was a bike with geometry like a cyclocross bike and fork clearance of a mountain bike. I've got one, I love it, had it since I was a kid.

These days, a hybrid can be nothing more than a road bike with a flat bar, slightly lower gearing, and clearance for 32mm tires. Usually you'll at least get V-brakes and a slightly more forgiving frame as well, but not always. Until the last few years, "hybrids" were marketed as low-end bikes for people who weren't doing any real off-road riding but weren't going to be able to handle a standard road bike.

That said, as you've observed, there are a lot of blurred lines these days, like that Kona with the beefy tires and discs. But, on the other hand, it has drops and more road-oriented gearing, and those seem to be the determining factors in the definition, from what I've seen. So it's a road bike...sort of. For very loose definitions of what constitutes a "road."

I'd not seen that Kona before, looks like a very nice all around bike. Maybe now people won't have to buy cyclocross bikes just to get a commuter with drop bars and wide tires. Discs are a nice touch too.

To me, the definition doesn't have a useful purpose. If it is to be used, the flat bar shouldn't be the deciding factor anymore. I think the best definition would be discs or V-brakes, wide tire clearance, but no suspension. That would include either of your bikes as hybrids. Basically, to me a hybrid is a bike that you can ride off-road on some reasonably rough trails without wetting yourself, and ride on-road without hating the bike.

I thought it was basically a mountain bike frame (and riding position) with road tires (700c usually). At least that's how I would describe most hybrids. Different models have different handlebar options, different fork options, etc. but they all have essentially a MTB frame and 700c road wheels/tires.

It's a bike you can commute to work in without wearing lycra.

So all bikes are hybrids? You're a LOT of help. :crash:


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Flat bar (not swept back)
non-knobby tires
Seat and handlebar height relatively the same (to eliminate bikes I would classify as comfort)

And yes, that includes a huge range of bikes. I'm fine with that though, because the specialization of bikes has gotten out of hand. It's confusing consumers and making it difficult for retailers. For example, even the branded Trek stores are doing good to have a third of the Trek models on the floor at one time. That's probably being conservative, and assuming they only have one size of each out.

Customer go to the website, spend all this time stressing over which of eight different bikes they like the best, and then can't find one in a store. I'm ranting now, but this is the #1 reason I don't buy new bikes.

I think the wingra is close...

It's a bike that uses wide road bike tires (700X25+) and a flat bar...

[QUOTE=Mr. Underbridge;8269082]Until the last few years, "hybrids" were marketed as low-end bikes for people who weren't doing any real off-road riding but weren't going to be able to handle a standard road bike.
QUOTE]

I agree with that.....and I think that is the kind of bike that pops into my head and the heads of a lot of the "hybrid haters" on the forum (hated because those kinds of bikes were often lower quality or inefficient). Personally, if someone loves their bike, I am the last person that will take issue with that. But there is no way I would ever be attracted to a bike that is not efficient if it is intended to cover any real distance.

But when a hybrid lover gets into it with a hybrid hater on this forum,,,it seems very possible that they are not even talking about the same kind of bike.

They showed up/became popular when people realized MTB made poor road bikes but road bikes were still uncool.

As a newbie to road riding, it is hard to believe it was ever uncool.

My old hybrid seems to be exactly like a flat-bar cyclocross bike. In truth, it's a marketing term.

No such thing.

Stop trying to invent new classifications.

So if one changes the handlebars on a cyclocross bike it is no longer a cyclocross bike? What about the mountain bikers who use drop bars? Are they now riding road bikes? Handlebar style alone does not classify a bike... it's only one part after all.

I own a Trek 7200 hybrid and I love it. It's my first venture into real bikes. I run it with 700x25 tires I can go up to 19mph if I pick up the pace and I can go up to around 32 mph downhill. It's real comfortable to ride and I enjoy it! I have some panniers on it and I use it as a commuter and for errands. Every Sunday I take it out for 30-40 mile spins to the beach and I pass quite a few lycra roadies on it. I will get a caad9 soon for real road riding... but I'll never give up my 7200...

it has some kinda ugly welds on it tho... that's like the only real downside...

http://www.trekbikes.com/images/bike...hitenickel.jpg

You really don't know?

If Specialized takes a Tricross, changes the bars, shifters, brake levers (to convert it to flat bar) and sits it in a bike shop... no, it's absolutely not a cyclocross bike. They wouldn't try to call it one, and if they did everyone would have a problem with it.

Cut him some slack he's trying to be descriptive. :notamused:

When I'm with roadie types, my CrossCheck is commonly referred to as a hybrid. When I'm with the trail riding crowd my CrossCheck is referred to as a race bike. Don't like the definition, ask someone else.

To me a hybrid is a bike meant for riding on the streets as well as light off-road use. In my definition a hybrid could have drops. Some people would like to call that a cyclocross bike but I reserve that classification for bikes actually designed for cyclocross racing.

Hybrid covers a wide variety of bikes which is why people get mad when generalizations are made. Same with road bikes. Although there are many types of road bikes, some mistakenly consider road bike synonymous with racing bike.

I agree with this. Basically a hybrid anything is something that's strong in a few different areas, but not a super performer in those same areas. Does it ride relatively well off road? Does it ride relatively well on the road? If yes to both, then it's a hybrid.

One could (and you probably do) use the reasoning above to say there is no such thing as a flat bar road bike also. Yet that's exactly what many manufactures call them. I like how you avoided the mountain bike with drops issue too. Handlebar style alone does not classify a bike. Dewaday is right, if you don't like the definition just ask someone else.

To me, a hybrid is exactly the definition - a merge of two different bike types. The original hybrids were wider road tires, front sus fork, and an upright riding position. IE; a hybrid of a MTB and a road bike. jcrockermans pic above...

Here it seems anything goes.
-R

No.

At least nothing we can all agree on. Thus, the term hybrid.

This is a nomenclature problem that has gone on far too long to be fixed.

The first factory hybrid may have been the Bianchi Volpe of around 20 years ago. Anybody got one of those groundbreakers?

1.Flat bar road bike
2. Skinny-tired mountain bike
3. And all points in between

"Flat bar road bike"... That's a description, not a classification in my mind. Road bike, Mountain Bike... general terms. Touring, dirt jump, time trial, cyclocross, are specific terms with specific meanings.

I ignored your mtb question because it wasn't relevant. Is a downhill bike with 23c tires on it still a downhill bike? Is a comfort bike with no saddle still a comfort bike? Irrelevant.


Whatever. My entire point was that people have gone overboard with their need to classify everything. \

I think hybrid is a term that's outlived its usefulness. "City Bike" or "Commuter Bike" or "Cyclocross Bike" or "Touring Bike" or many others are better but still not perfect. In the end you have to look at specs and capabilities.

A mountain bike with drops might be called a hybrid, or a road bike with flat bars. Not a lot of similarity there. But dividing the world into "Mountain" vs "Road" was always a stupid idea. How many people really use their bike to ride up mountains or to race in road races? (No insult intended for those who do).