kengrubb

OK, first I just have to say there seems to be a great deal of inconsistency here with those two statements. I'm safer in the road, but an inattentive rider can still kill me? The latter part is intuitive, and tends to make the former part difficult to swallow.

Yes, there are driveways, but vehicles moving in and out of driveways tend to be moving a lot slower than vehicles moving on roads. Differential speed, not speed alone, is what kills.

Regardless of what motorists are expecting on the sidewalk, if I'm on the sidewalk, and they aren't, I fail to see the risk. The distance from the bike lane (if there is one), to the sidewalk, is generally only a few feet. While it's possible there is a thick hedgerow separating the road from the sidewalk--thus completely concealing from view a bicyclist--that is not the norm.

Because I can legally ride on the sidewalk in Washington, I tend to make transitions from the road to the sidewalk and back as it seems prudent--regardless of what that b*tch in the BMW in doing. If there is a bike lane or sharrows, I ride there. If there is a shoulder, I ride there rather than in the lane of traffic.

Whenever possible, I get onto side streets and off main arterials as soon as possible. I try to choose routes that minimize the number of red lights and stop signs I encounter. Even on side streets, I try to pick a route with the least amount of traffic.

Along one point of my commute, the bike lane ends a block before my route crosses over top of a state highway. The lane I'm in turns into a turn only lane that would force me onto that state highway. As such, I ride up onto the sidewalk for that last block and think pedestrian. There are several driveways and there's a crosswalk at the light. I watch my mirror and slow down so that any traffic making the turn, which would cross my path, can proceed ahead of me. There's a pedestrian crossing, I hit the button, and I comply with that signal. When I get a walk signal, I proceed across and ride back out onto the road as it crosses the state highway and a block later a wide shoulder resumes for me to ride in.

There are a myriad of reasons that make sense to me when one should transition off the road onto the sidewalk and back. Storm grates of death, narrow bridges, industrial parks with a heavy volume of class 8 trucks, etc.

Is there any data, not just anecdotes, to back up the assertion one is truly safer riding on the road rather than riding on the sidewalk?

contango 

Depending on just how prominent the branding on the uniform is the manager could potentially have an easy "out" with a simple question "Are you sure it was a McDonalds uniform this person was wearing?". Couple that with the fact he can quite truthfully report up the chain of command that this woman came into the store and made allegations against a member of staff which were demonstrably false and so he wasn't inclined to regard any of her complaint as being something he could count on and you've probably got a pretty easy situation to deal with.

JCS

Appreciate the comments everyone, thanks for sharing your opinions.

About which is safer street vs sidewalk, let me say a few things

First, I am aware of the danger of driveways. That's why I always ride on the side so I'm going the same direction as traffic and when I see someone pulling out of a driveway I always look to make sure that they've seen me before I ride past them. I also get off my bike and walk at all intersections.

Secondly, this is not a downtown area where the sidewalks pose a danger of opening doors and there are a lot of people walking around. This is a suburban sprawl sidewalk along a four lane highway with most cars going over 50 mph. The bike lane (if you can call it that) is a tiny one foot strip between the outermost road line and the curb. I think the "sidewalks are more dangerous" idea must have come from city areas, because along a road like I describe it is definitely much safer to be on the sidewalk.

making

I ride 99% streets, occassionally I will ride on a sidewalk, but only if it "feels" safer. I dont expect that to make sense, so here is an example. Last week they closed 2 lanes of a busy 4 lane I ride on. Cars were trying to run over each other to get in the 2 lanes, it did not look like anywhere I wanted to be on a bike or in a car. To the right was a smooth, concrete empty sidewalk. Rarely used by walkers. A couple of store fronts, which I just slowed way down for. Safer to be on the sidewalk for a couple of blocks in this case. I just do the safest thing I can do all the time.

sonatageek

Before I changed my route home, I had a stretch of about 1/2-3/4 of mile that I road on the sidewalk. It was the slowest and most time consuming part of the trip, but rights be damned, the narrow lanes and huge number of cars filled with grumpy people going home, made it the right choice for me. Had to really check at drives and crossings and really slow down and give a wide berth to any people walking.

I think the only real area where the OP failed was exploding at the women and calling her a name. Keeping ones cool is the best way to go. That said, I exploded at a women on a horse on one of the areas multi-purpose trails. I was riding across a bridge that goes over a freeway, and that small stretch is also the crossing of that road for the bridle trail. She starts going off that I am suppossed to walk my bike across because of horses and on and on and there is a sign and yada yada. Further that my riding my bike on the trail by her horse might get the horse to throw her off. (humm control issue and lack of training of the operator?) All the sign says is to watch to horses on the bridge.

After a minute of so of this I just let loose before riding away and actually got to say 'F-you and the horse you road in on!'

KD5NRH

So who am I representing when I wear the McDonalds "uniform" I got from the Salvation Army store?

I was tempted to get the WalMart vest too and go on a multi-city rampage of public legal-but-very-rude acts.

smasha

sorry to hear about your employment situation. this too, shall pass.

as for dealing with idiots, the best tactic is usually smile, wave, and say "thank you" while you keep going. really. that is almost guaranteed to result in the least "interesting" stories. interesting stories are fun to share on the forums, but in real life the best rides are blissfully uneventful.

as for riding on the sidewalk, do what you believe is safest under the circumstances and give respect to everyone else who is using that space (whether or not they're there legally). if where you're riding is not legal, be prepared to explain to a cop and/or judge why it's in the interest of safety that you are forced to breach the law (and understand that they may not see things your way). there are a few spots where i (illegally) take the sidewalk regularly... up a hill, narrow lanes and fast traffic.

understand the risks of riding on the sidewalk, and weigh them against the risks of riding on the street. also consider alternate routes. there's one spot where i can go up a hill one block over from traffic (and usually not meet any cars on the side road) then turn towards the main road, ride half a block on the sidewalk, and then move with traffic down the other side of the hill.

obviously, you feel the sidewalk is safer than the road, and apparently you gave plenty of room to a pedestrian who has undisputed right to use the sidewalk. it all seems reasonable so far. some people are just miserable twats. be glad you only had to deal her briefly... she has to deal with herself all the time.

phoebeisis

Occasionally I bail out to the sidewalks.
I'm not so sure that a 45 mph(but actually 55 mph) hy is safer than a sidewalk- especially if you are aware of the danger when you come to driveways/road crossings and take special precautions when you cross them(slow down-get a good look-swing wide on driveways, watch out for the hedges that block your view-maybe even get off the bike and take a look).

Did you learn something from this??
It is always a mistake to curse a stranger- bad manners also.
Always avoid on road/sidewalk confrontations-always pedal away- ignore angry folks- pretend you don't hear them.
Good manners are important.
I would probably stick with the sidewalk- but try to avoid this person-too late to apologize to her???Explain you don't want to get killed on the road? Uncle died etc?Tell her you'll be careful passing her cute dog'"I have a dog etc,so I'm like you" or some such white lie?
You are probably right about the dog being her main concern-folks love their pets.I sure do.A human will avoid a bike- dogs have less sense and don't realize they have a leash on-a leash you can accidentally ride thru .
Charlie

wphamilton

[QUOTE=longbeachgary;12909164]The corporation can pressure the franchise owner with the threat of revoking the franchise but only as specified in the franchise contract. Mostly that would be about operational standards and product standards. There is literally nothing the corporation can do about an employee of a franchise having a verbal altercation on a sidewalk somewhere in the city.

While we're on the subject, wearing the shirt and logo does not mean the person is representing the corporation, not in any legal sense. If there's something in the employee's contract about conduct while wearing the uniform they would have something to say about it, but that's the extent of it.

chipcom 

You were fine until this point. Watch your mouth, boy, and you won't have crazy pissed-off ladies following you to work and complaining to your manager...or worse.

Sundance89

If you commute the same time every day, chances are you will see her again. For this reason, I have always maintained that while you are out their commuting, you are an ambassador for cyclists everywhere and are establishing a relationship with 100's of people that see YOU everyday.

Let's just say this one relationship got off to a rocky start, but it's something you don't want to escalate. Pet owners can be extremely emotional about their animals. Just as with you, we don't know what has happened in her past, and the irony is, this is probably the very reason why you two "interacted" in the first place. Communicate and diffuse it. Do the zen thing.

the cyclops

Sorry,stopped reading after "I was riding the sidewalk".You shouldnt ride on the sidewalk.I would have pushed you over,and yes I am serious.

the cyclops

Thats crazy?Im gonna go ahead and tell you and everybody here...
A-I will tell people to not ride on the sidewalk in a second.
2-If you cussed me like that,I am probably going to follow you as well(I am a runner)
D-I wouldnt have complained to the manager.If I made the effort to track you down,because you cussed me out,Im coming in and making sure you are gonna be eating your egg mcmuffin through a straw for the next month.
Now thats crazy o)

myrridin

Assinine better describes your naivete...

He was wearing a company uniform. Therefore his actions reflect upon the company... And his actions were deplorable. Certainly grounds for termination in any state I have ever done business in (including Florida)

myrridin

You would be representing yourself and McDonald; however, since you aren't an employee they have no recourse... That is why some companies insist on owning the uniforms--just to prevent that kind of thing.

thdave

I got to chime in here, as I feel this cyclist is getting a bad rap.

This old coot had no business trying to enforce the law to this cyclist. No, you shouldn't swear at her, yet if everyone tried to put on a sherrif's badge we'd have kaos and nothing would get done. This woman needs to shut up.

Also, I doubt this city has ever enforced such a law--if it even exists!

Elkhound

I don't know if riding on the sidewalk is or is not illegal where you are; if you don't know, then perhaps a trip to the public library on your day off might be in order.

If you are nervous about cycling on the street, I'd suggest contacting your local bicycle club to see if they have a safe cycling course you can take.

You shouldn't have sworn at the old lady. Even if you weren't wearing the uniform shirt, it was not a nice thing to do. Would you want people talking like that to your mother or grandmother? Of course not!

KD5NRH

Exactly; if you get preachy with random strangers, you should expect to be told to MYOFB in not-so-genial ways.

wphamilton

Just chill. People behave that way to disrupt you emotionally and the reaction is what they want. It's gratifying for them. It was so good for the old lady that she just had to track him down for more. So just chill out, if you talk to them at all make it something relaxed and unresponsive.

It doesn't come naturally, but then again working in retail you learn that anyway. OP, as you surely know by now, some people see the uniform as open season to bully you because they can complain to the boss. The old lady evidently (and incorrectly) felt that applied outside of your workplace. Just ignore all the warnings in this thread of dire consequences or escalations. That's all just friendly advice - as a free citizen you can be as rude and confrontational as you want barring threats or obscenities and no one, particularly a corporation you don't work for, has the right to tell you differently.

AlmostTrick

If the uniform wearing person were driving a (personal) car would you fire him for simply cussing out someone while not on company property also? You’ve posted here often enough that I know that you wouldn’t.

AlmostTrick

Agreed. Maybe "Would you like some fries to go with that shake" would have been more appropriate.

chipcom 

No...there ain't no excuse for bad manners. Just because someone else displays bad manners is not an excuse for you to do the same. The old "if he jumped off a bridge" schtick applies. Obviously we all F up and let our anger lead to bad behavior sometimes...but that just makes us human, it doesn't make the bad behavior right. IMO, trying to rationalize it to kids like the OP just makes them think somehow that it is acceptable behavior. It isn't.

chipcom 

I was thinking "My, you sure look lovely today Mrs. Cleaver!" in my best Eddie Haskell voice.

the cyclops

I respectfully disagree.When he was in the wrong and clearly he was,and the lady(who obviously was a runner/cyclist and new her laws and also rides in the street)told him to not be riding there,perhaps in anger,did not cuss him.When the F-bombs start flying,all bets are off.As they say,thems fighting words.Dont know where you or the poster is from,but as I said earlier,I would have done much worse than that lady.

AlmostTrick

So F-bombs are off limits but messing someone up physically is OK with you?