Anyone interested in electronic shifting?
 

Shimano has Dura Ace Di2 and now the more affordable Ultegra Di2 gruppos out. Campagnolo has been experimenting with their electronic shift group on pro race teams for years and is supposedly very close to release, and now there are rumors of SRAM also working on an electronic shifting system.

The reviews I've read and watched on Di2 say it's pretty much a 'game changer'. Here is an example of a Di2 review:

http://vimeo.com/6744095

And another:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJXKCoxMLnU


So my question is, does anyone have any real world hands on experience with an electronic shift system? I'm not jumping on the bandwagon just yet, but I'm very interested in electronic shifting once the price falls below $1k, and would love to hear your opinions.

I don't have any experience, but to answer your post title, not interested.

Electronic shifting on your bike seems as cool as an automatic transmission in your sports car.

Like . . . shifting is sooo hard. :p

I would like to try it on a test ride, but I am too cheap to own any bike that expensive. The 2 bikes I have put the most miles on in the past 6 months have DT shifters. LOL

Well if it makes front derailer shifting as precise as rear derailer shifting, never needs any adjustments or trim, and you are able to shift the front derailer (even cross chain) under full load, that sounds pretty good to me.

The main thing that kills it right now is the pricing, but new products are often released at a very high price point. Right now they are really only going after racers or the very 'well off' enthusiasts. That first review compared the people calling electronic shifting a 'gimmick' to the guys that said "carbon would never last, that aero bars would never catch on, that the internet was a fad." That's a pretty bold claim.

And some bicycles have motors on them! Imagine that, you don't even have to pedal!

Sorry, but electronic shifting to me just seems the equivalent of frozen toast. Now we need a microprocessor and a battery to shift our bicycle?

I still prefer friction shifting on my road bikes just because I think it is more fun (ya, I'm weird) so the answer is no.

I remember the first electronic shifting system, the Mavic Zap some 20 years ago. It didn't last that time, either. But Shimano may have made some real improvements, so I wouldn't count them out. But since I don't race, I don't really care about how fast and precise my shifts are. Looking forward to getting a Nuvinci on the road. Being continously variable, it doesn't care about speed or precision. It's always in gear, period.

http://www.disraeligears.co.uk/Site/...28C810%29.html
Shimano's first electronic shifting group was actually marketed towards the leisure/commuter set, but was a flop (it was put out in 2004, who still remembers it less than ten years later?). I think it fell in the same crack as the Trek Lime and Landrider Autoshift setups that aimed for the elusive rider who refused to learn to shift but willing to pay LBS prices.
Nowadays electronic shifting has the touted benefits of faster shifts and foolproof front derailleur trim, but what's the use? One setup by an LBS at the start of a bike's life and five minutes with a barrel adjuster once every other month after can achieve reasonably fast shifts on pretty much any setup. For those like me that aren't counting the seconds we save per hour, its not worth it to pay for a microprocessor to deal every shift with what is basic maintenance and setup. The weight savings on a Dura-Ace Di2 setup are only meaningful when compared to Dura-Ace mechanical. For most people, they'd get a better price/gram return by upgrading wheels, handlebars, stems, saddle, etc.

I've set up Di2...


It's impressive in real life. For the main target market, having multiple shifter locations can be solid gold on a TT bike. Try climbing a hill out of the saddle on your bullhorns, then reaching for your shifter on the tip of your aero bar while sprinting uphill to the finish line (e.g. the Tour Of California prologue). If you're a sprinter, having an auxiliary shift switch in the drops is cool.

Also, a system that doesn't deteriorate in shifting performance as you crank out thousands of dirty early-Spring training miles is nice. Up-front price is very high even with Ultegra Di2, so that's going to keep it out of most peoples' price ranges for now.

From talking with the Shimano guys, it's clear that people with physical handicaps are very pumped about Di2 as well, like my customer in the video there. He'd been putting up with a thumbshifter for a front shifter and a conventional STI lever for the rear. With very limited funtion in his remaining hand, it was sometimes more than he could take on long rides.

I'm sure someone will come out with a commuter with electric shift and hydraulic brakes now. The only reason the electronic shifter didn't pan out for Shimano back in 2004 is because there were no racers using electronic shifting. Now that racers are using electronics the masses will assume they'll need electronic shifting along with tights and carbon fiber to do their once a week ride around the block.

I spent 2.5 years living at Walter Reed. Ride 2 Recovery got these for some of the arm amputees (I believe Shimano donated them). These allow people to ride an upright bike that would have never been able to. In fact Ride 2 Recovery was able to get the 1st ever quad amputee on an upright bike. I think the product is amazing even if I will probably never own it.

The guy in the Vimeo review says, at 2:40, that he does not know how to adjust deraileurs. "We frequently find ourselves at the feet of our local mechanical guru, asking for a quick derailleur adjustment." He then says, "if you can program an address into a cellphone, you can adjust the Di2."

1. What a load of bull. Anybody who has been around bikes for a while, especially someone who works in the industry, knows how to adjust derailleurs.
2. The review is targeted at midlife crisis purchasers who know nothing about bikes but have money to spend.

To answer the OP: no I'm not interested in electronic shifting. It improves shifting negligibly for $3000. At $40 an hour that's over 9 days of full time work. At $100 an hour that's almost 4 days of work. At $8 it's three months of work. You'd be out of your mind to spend that kind of labour for that pointless piece of bling. Buy a car instead.

I prefer friction shifting. Shifting isn't rocket science.
It may be a game changer for amputees or some such as can't physically use any other shifting mechanism. My wife for example doesn't have the strength in her hands to use the twist shifters her bike came with. I swapped them out for rapid fire shifters. She can use them, although she prefers singlespeed.

The major bike component companies seem to be under the illusion that cyclists are all wealthy with unlimited sums of money to throw at new equipment. That may be true for some cylists -- and I know a few of them -- but the vast majority of us would prefer equipment that is reliable, functional and relatively low cost. Add electronic shifting to the long list of bike gear that I will never own or care about.

I'd be very interested in trying it, but I'd likely wait for Campagnolo to release it and buy it used 6 years later. I also think I'd probably wait until the signal is passed wirelessly rather than through cables. It seems to me that one of the big advantages of electronic shifting would be the lack of cables, and I'd like to see that advantage maximized. When i built my dream machine, I debated between Campy 11 and DI2...I went with 11 because it seemed like a better match for the bike, DI2 was ugly (sorry, but aesthetics counted) and I generally am not an early adapter. Price also played a role.

I haven't used DI2, so i don't have an opinion. I have used other DA groups, and the front trim sucks, so I can understand the need for this. At the same time, Campy Ergo front trim doesn;t suck, so I'm not sure the advantage there is quite as big. I can still see an advantage in not having to adjust or changes housings and I'm sure automatic front trim is wonderful. At the same time, I hate charging my phone, and often forget. I'm not sure I want an expensive electronic part that a lot of shops couldn't work on.

The world is flat. Those dang automobiles will never amount to anything. Who needs the internet. A PC will never have more than 64K of memory. Who needs integrated shifters/Index shifting? Aero is for wimps. etc. etc. etc. Cyclists are so often just blinded by tradition, it's almost comical. Until they get their tail waxed by the guy that figured out the next new thing.

I'm not sure about this, but didn't DI2 just dominate the winners of the TdF?

I think this has a huge amount of potential. Talking to those that actually use DI2 talk about how much they like it. My LBS owner tried it to stay current and you couldn't pay him to give it up now. He loves it. I think being able to shift under load on either front or rear is a huge deal, a game changer even - maybe even especially for those who aren't all that experienced. The micro adjusting of the front and rear is pretty cool. I'm thinking that a MTB group could be pretty interesting too - changing under load anyone?

This is probably where it all goes in the future. This is going to continue to get cheaper until it pretty much covers any bike that is tiagra on up at some point.

J.

It no doubt has its uses, such as for riders who physically can't use a mechanical system, or for competition cycling, where having a second shifter (switch) can make a difference. For most riders though, it's just unnecessarily complex and expensive, especially where conventional cable systems work just fine. Most of us don't have endless pots of money to throw at gimmicks.

+1

I waited to buy a cell phone until they were out for a while. I didn't get a smart phone until they were around for a few years. I generally wait for the market to trend and com in late - I'm a late adapter. That being said, I'm definitely looking forward to when this does become standard and I definitely see the pluses. I want to see it a bit more proven first, I'd like to see it get lighter, I'll wait until the shops are familiar with it and I'll wait until it's wireless.

I have never met anyone who used DI2 and wasn;t blown away by it.

...and to think that I thought that I was lazy just for using using indexed shifting!

Bikes Direct has a Di2 equipped bike and while $3700 is way out of my price range it didn't seem to ridiculous for the people looking at a really nice bike. I don't knwo how that one compares in additional cost to their other similar DA carbon framed equipped bikes.

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...eam_di2_xi.htm

It seems like in the future this could be a relatively straightforward technology and the cost wouldn't be too much greater. Its not like I want to buy it or anything, but its been said already there are some great applications for this system and I think there are some everyday joe's out there that would possibly enjoy this system too once the cost is lowered.

Please forgive my hazy memories, but when I shopped the gruppo, I remember it being around 50% more than Campagnolo SR 11. I guess once you're laying down that kind of money it shouldn't matter, but that difference did play a role for me. It wasn't the whole reason, but it played a role.

I was going to say "I have it and like it" but now I think I need to run for cover :(

I have no appreciation for added complexity.