Cleave

Hi All,

First time posting in this sub forum. A little background: I am basically a bike racer with 35 years in the sport. When I was in my 20s during the 1980s I commuted for about a decade on my race bike with tubular tires and a backpack. Job location, kids, and laptop computers caused me to stop commuting regularly. Something had to give and racing came first.

Now that the kids are older (as am I), I am looking to commute by bike 3 days a week (2 minimum). I have a bunch of bikes, including these two:




The Milano is my errands bike and any time I ride to work (just a few times each year) I use it. The Roger is my rain bike for winter training.

I know a lot of you hardcore commuters will think I'm crazy or have too much disposable income, but I have gotten "permission" to build a commuter bike.

(Why not commute on either of those bikes? The Milano is just too heavy and clunky for me for a 6 mile each way commute with all of my work stuff. I'm not interested in putting a rack and other accoutrements on the Roger for commuting. In fact, I take the fenders off of it during the summer when I need a change of pace for training.)

After doing a fair amount of research, I have settled on a Spot frame, The Proletariat (https://www.oneghost.net/One_Ghost_In...OLETARIAT.html). I'll be using Avid BB7 road disc brakes and a belt drive. Other than that, I'm looking for some practical advice on other choices.

I have Soma Sparrow bars on the Milano and I like them MUCH better than typical flat bars (which hurt my wrists). Since my commute is fairly urban, bad roads and bad traffic, I think that the Sparrow bars would work better than drop bars with a bike with panniers with a fair amount of stuff in them. Thoughts?

After searching the forums and the rest of the internet, I want to use the Gates CenterTrack belt drive system with a single speed. The Nexus 8-speed on my Milano works well enough but since my commute is fairly flat, I am thinking the simplicity of a single-speed would be better overall especially if I have a rear flat. BTW, I have too much bike maintenance to do in general so I want this bike to be as maintenance-free as possible so that's why I want a belt-drive. Also, since CenterTrack parts are very hard to get are the original Carbon Drive components OK for single-speed applications? More thoughts?

Finally, the topic of panniers. I have some touring panniers that I've had since the 1980s. They work well but they are a major chore to put on and off the bike. Additionally, I'll have to CARRY the panniers about the equivalent of two city blocks as I work at a large factory and bike parking is just outside the gate near a guard location. Some of the panniers that convert to backpacks look interesting but shoulder straps would probably work fine. Which brand and model of pannier might work well for me?

TIA for any practical advice you can provide.

martianone

Sounds like you should check out a Trek SOHO

no motor?

I mean this with all due respect, but you're starting this from the opposite end of the spectrum from most people who post this question. There are a few commuters here who commute with a Norco belt drive bike up in the great white north that could probably answer those questions better than the rest of us.

fietsbob

Trek sold out the batch of Sohos mid summer. so Get in line for the 012.

Tout Terrain Metropolis comes from Germany thru Peter White cycles in NH.

the belt split is a Dropout Sandwich of 2 pieces
rear rack is a welded on part of the frame.

Forks redesign for Disc forces , asymmetrical left blade stronger than the RT.

use an alfine or any 135 wide disc compatible hub.

they planed the frame around front hub dynamos,and wire looms are built on/in.

tarwheel 

Personally, if you aren't commuting every day, why deal with panniers? My commute route has a lot of hills so I try to minimize the amount of gear that I carry. Since I usually end up driving 1-2 days/week, I bring clean clothes, food and other gear in my truck and take home laundry. I use a Carradice Barley or Acorn Med-Large seatbag to carry my lunch and other gear on my bike, and usually have room to spare.

With a Bagman quick-release seat rack, you can quickly install or remove their Carradice bags. If you need to walk a few blocks, get a shoulder strap to attach to the rings on top.

DiabloScott

Right! I suggest a front basket to hold the same backpack that you bring every day whether you ride or drive.

mbryant52

Your Milano, which is super sweet, is too heavy and clunky for a whole whopping *6* miles each way? It's such a pig you can't manage to pedal it for 20 minutes? That's in your head, brother, especially if you're bringing a bunch of gear with you. Buy a new bike if you must, but I'm calling bull**** on your excuse.

alan s 

I'd build up something with a Rohloff 14. Still a little skeptical about the Gates.

canyoneagle

I'm one of the Norco Belt Drive guys (IRClean is the other that I know of), though I've moved back from the great white north (good day, eh?)
I've sold mine, but used it daily of about 14-15 months, in SS and Alfine 8 speed configurations, and in all weather conditions.

I really liked it, but have gone back to a chain drive since my climate is essentially high desert (Utah, Colorado), and I see little benefit to the belt.
I guess I need to qualify that- in my view, much of the benefit of the belt drive is nearly zero drive train maintenance in crappy weather, which is REALLY nice. I could also see some benefit for super sandy/salty conditions. However, if you aren't riding in these conditions, the belt drive is more on par with a good chain drive, IMO, but requires higher tension than a chain drive, which raises some concern for bearing life, etc.

I was using the original (not centertrac) belt drive. The main diff that I am aware of is that the original belt system was far more sensitive to cog alignment than centertrac. It added perhaps 10-15 seconds to my wheel installation so I could fine tune the sliders to ensure that the rear axle was dead even across the dropouts (the belt would wander off of alignment if either side was too far forward/back). Once this was set, it worked great. Dead silent and really smooth for SS or IGH use. As mentioned above I found the belt drive system to require higher tension than a chain, in order to prevent the belt from slipping (popping one notch) under load (especially in the wet).



I'm not familiar with Stop cycles, but that frame looks like it would be fine. Another option would be the Van Dessel WTF, or perhaps one of the bikes from Spot (not Stop )

It sounds to me like single speed would work just fine for your use, and would support your goal to keep weight reasonable. That said, for commuting, weight shouldn't be too much of a concern IMO - you can have a really fun SS bike that is 20-24 pounds with racks and fenders.

Panniers - many (such as Arkel and Ortlieb) are super easy to get on and off the rack (once set up), and many have shoulder straps to make carrying easier.

A final thought - most chromoly frames can be converted to belt drive using the Paragon Machine Works stay splitter (which opens your options considerably).

It sounds like you have a fun project ahead of you!
Best of luck withwhatever you decide to do!

twinquad

Bars - sounds like you know what's comfortable, you just want to know if there's a question of control with drop bars and loaded panniers, correct? I have this combination for my similar-length commute, and control has never been a problem.

Gears - IGH is pretty low maintenance. I'd go with whatever will result in the most riding - if you're happy with SS, no problem, but if you think you'd ever bail on riding because you didn't feel like grinding or spinning that day, then go with IGH. As far as rear punctures, I'd go for tires with high puncture resistance, even if they're heavy - not a big deal when it's flat. Maybe have a rescue plan - I call my wife! It's only happened twice in 3 years. At that rate, it wouldn't be a big deal if the rescue plan was a taxi ride.

Panniers - I use Lone Peak panniers and they're very easy to mount and dismount. My walk is short enough just to carry them by the handle, though. Maybe if you're taking both panniers with you then you could have a shoulder strap permanently tied between their handles?

Sixty Fiver

Would think that most would consider your Milano to be a nearly perfect commuter.

fietsbob

anyhow, throw a Big Parisienne style Porteur rack on the front, and a low trail fork,
and you will be right there with another popular trend. ... and 650B wheels
Velo Orange has import builders to supply theirs.

I have 2 low trail front load bikes , but both have small wheels too,
so the trail , proportional to the wheel size is another calculation

gear

For 6 miles two or three times a week. You already own the bike that is best for that.. Can't you think of some better way to get rid of excess dough. Around here when someone has excess money they buy a boat.

slcbob

What he said.

I think there's a huge flaw in your foundational thinking about this. I don't care how svelte your steed is, once you add on the panniers, rack, gear, etc. etc., you're by definition klunky. ANY BIKE, not just your Milano, is going to be "too heavy and klunky." Further, the amount of marginal additional klunk from starting with your Milano vs. e.g. a Trek Madone or Pinarello Prince is going to be neglible.

I'm all for NOT tarting up the Roger with klunk and I think you have a great path to go down and you're asking the right questions if you want to build yourself a purpose built slick commuter. Go for it. But do it on THAT premise, not the flawed assumption you're jumping in with.

Cassave

Hey Cleave;

I'm with Sixty-Fiver on this one. The Milano looks perfect for a flat 6 miles each way. Just consider it extra training load.
It's already got two essentials, fenders and a rack. Even here is SoCal I wouldn't commute without full fenders.
Regarding panniers, if your load is small enough consider a saddlebag or rack trunk. I've been using a Carradice Nelson for about 20 years and for me it's all I need.
You can get quick release mounts and shoulder straps for Carradice bags to make the dismount quick and easy.
The rack gets used (very) occasionally for overflow.
My commute is 22 miles RT with 2400 feet of loss and gain in each direction with a few short stretches at 23%, so 700C road bike with fairly wide range gearing, full kit and cleats.

fietsbob

as said, a B.O.A.T* is a hole in the water to pour money into..

*Break Out Another Thousand.

no motor?

It's nicer than what I ride, but i wouldn't trade him for it. I'm too attached to my bike now to do that.

Sirrus Rider

The Milan is to Clunky to go 6 miles? If you think that is clunky you should try it on a Schwinn Town & Country trike. The Milan is not clunky..

cyclocommuter

IMHO, you won't go wrong with a cyclocross bike for commuting. The wider tires allow lower pressures that smooths out cracks and ruts in the pavement. It also allows for fitting even wider winter tires or tires with studs. Since you could fit wider tires and full wrap fenders on your Milano I agree with the others that it already is a perfect commuter... just needs lights.

Here is the commuter I use based off a Canondale CADDX (54 km roundtrip 3 times a week).

sjt78

What does the Milano weigh so that we can figure out is your reference for too heavy? Maybe you think it is clunky due to the geometry and you want a new bike with a shorter wheelbase? Help us out and let us know what you are striving for as you will continue to get remarks that you already have what you "need" and just "want" a new bike. I have no issues with you wanting another bike, as long as you know what makes the new bike useful in a different way. BTW, my slowest and heaviest bike *is* my main commuter as it has the IGH, fenders, dynamo light, puncture resistant tires, etc.

Cleave

I test rode a Trek District which got me wanting belt drive. I also wanted disc brakes after riding my Roger for two years. The SOHO has IGH and weighs about as much as my Milano.

Which is why I posted the question.

Looking to go as simple as possible (and cheap). The Metropolitan looks like a really nice bike but way too much for what I envision. The Proletariat frame looks like it offers the best value for the feature I want.

My problem is that I have a company issued laptop computer that I need to bring home with me every day for security and sometimes for working from home. Back in the 1980s when I was commuting 13 miles each way I was just carrying a change of clothes and lunch. A basket might work and I will definitely think about other possibilities on carrying my stuff.

Cleave

My Milano is a fun bike to ride around town. Six miles is relatively short and I am hoping to do it without working up too much of a sweat if any at all as I would like to ride to work in regular, business casual attire. You can call it what you want but you haven't answered any of my questions.

My route to work is fairly flat. Fourteen speeds would definitely be overkill.

Thanks very much for all of the great info and leads. I decided to go with the Stop Proletariat because of its features and $300 price tag. I read a lot about the skipping issues and hope that the CenterTrack system reduces that sensitivity. Living on the SoCal coast, sand and salty air are always my main issues with chains. I want to be able to put this bike together and forget about significant maintenance for a few years.

That is exactly my bar question. Thanks for your experience. I did a couple of bike touring trips on a mountain bike but I've never ridden a bike with panniers with drop bars in heavy traffic. I think I'll at least start with the drop bars then.

Maybe most would.

Cleave

I knew I was setting myself up for the too much money comments but hey, I've been on these forums for a while now. Also, I don't like boats.

Well, I've had the Milano for a while and I race on a 14.4 lb SuperSix. As I've said, on the occasions when I ride to work I use the Milano. However, when I ride it,to keep the sweat factor down (it's not worth it to me to bring a change of clothes and to have to shower for a six mile ride), I end up riding pretty darn slowly and significantly increase my ride time. Did I mention I'm not a morning person?

Hi Cassave, long time no see. Yeah, my commute is very simple with one small hill. Fast and light (with the exception of the laptop) is what I'm after to keep the time and effort down. I've already got (10 year-old) mountain bike shoes with Ritchey recessed cleats and a set of pedals.

OK, never heard that one before, but then I've never had any interest in boating.

megalowmatt

I say if you want a new commuter bike - go for it.

unterhausen

I have been looking around for some solution to how to carry my stuff. I think I'm going to try a porteur rack and a porteur bag similar to this one