I think you missed the point - If you own a $3000 monster carbon road bike that you love to ride, take up mountain passes and ride centuries with, and you decide that you want to commute to school or work in a high bike theft area, then the cheapo Wally World bike would be what you'd use for the commute. :)

You don't know a lot about tools do you? The two best locks for bicycles can be defeated within two minutes with the cheapest battery powered angle grinder. http://gizmodo.com/5922074/the-best-bike-lock More expensive battery powered angle grinders cut a lot faster.

And then there's picking, something that happens quite a bit in Europe but is slowly catching on here in America, and a good picker will have the best lock undone in 30 seconds. And the whole time he's doing that it just looks like he's having trouble with his key.

And yes there are other tools bike thieves have used for years but modern technology is changing what is used in the game.

And bike theft is a $200,000,000 dollar a YEAR crime!

So if someone has a $4,000 bike and needs to use it for commuting and parking outside why do that? When you could find a nice used bike or decent Walmart bike for under $250 and still have a decent bike to commute on and a really nice bike for the weekend without fretting if the $4,000 bike will be there when you're finished with work. Thus my logic is you still have the nice bike, which is what I said that you freaked over because you failed to read, but you're using a lessor quality bike for high risk parking and leaving unattended. Keep another thing in mind too, thieves are also stealing bike components, those you can't lock up unless you buy special bolts. Again why spend $250 for a lock, couple hundred more for locking bolts and skewers then have to hassle with all that crap to fix something on the bike? I think it's nuts, sorry. But if I had to park a bike outside my place of employment I would take my least valued bike that I didn't care a whole lot about if it got stolen, or buy a low value bike.

I've had 2 bikes stolen from me in my lifetime. The first one was chained up and they cut through the chain like it was nothing. The second one was locked in my garage. I was 16 when the first was stolen and maybe 22 for the second. I'm 57 now. What has kept my bikes, and I've always had multiple bikes, safe and secure is that I NEVER LOCK THEM OUTSIDE, ANYWHERE!!! For 30+ years I didn't own a bike lock. A few years ago I decided I wanted to try commuting to work so I bought both the NY Fuhgedaboudit U-Lock, and the top of the line Kryptonite chain lock. I used my old MTB to commute and locked it outside my building within site of the security desk. I got friendly with the security guys so that they'd watch out for me. I used my chain by itself the first year or so and never really used the u-lock. When I was hired by the company after being a consultant for many years, I was allowed to bring the bike inside to the new parking area at the secondary entrance, also under the eyes of security. Now I leave my carbon fiber road bike and use my U-lock. The bike parking feels so secure I didn't lock up my bike once when I forgot my keys. I just made it look like it was locked by looping my helmet around.

As for weight, both of my locks weigh too much to carry and I am leaving them locked to a rack on the street. My laptop weighs enough, I don't need another 10 pounds. I still don't lock my bikes up anywhere else, ever.

My little knowledge in electronics tells me that a 1$ device bought at radioshack will probably disable all lights and sounds.
But there is one thing that angle grinders can't beat. We probably all have experimented the principle at least once.

Would you mind elaborating on both?

Well.... sort of.

Anyone that wants your bike will get it. The trick is to make the hassle difficult and to have much more tempting targets nearby.

My kids both have their bikes down at a major urban university. We use the Kryptonite Evolution locks - they each have two: 1 with the longer 9" shackle and the other with the 5" shackle. They use the 9" when they go to class and at their residence hall or for longer times, they use the short shackle lock around the front wheel and the 9" shackle on the rear wheel/frame. The locks are keyed alike so one key does it. They also have pit locks on the hubs, seat post and stem. We have had zero issues. That angle grinder would take the same 30 seconds to steal our bikes but there are way easier bikes to steal that are close by that are a lot less hassle.

The keyed alike likes work great. They typically will leave the short shackle lock attached to the bike rack back at the dorm. The alternative that we also use is a 4' cable to goes through the shackle of the rear lock thru the wheel. It's just easier to have the two locks and faster.

We use the Sheldon Brown lock strategy and it work just fine. No need to take off wheels or get too crazy about locking the bikes up.

http://sheldonbrown.com/lock-strategy.html

With this, when a potential thief looks at our bikes, they see a LOT of work to get it done and then once they steal the bike they still need to deal with the pitlocks. The bikes we use are late '80s mid range to low high end road bikes - nice bikes in other words, but not at all flashy. They hold up well because they are quality but they are really not worth much - maybe $200 or so apiece. They are just worth more than that to us, we find we have less maintenance issues using good stuff, they hold up better etc... So, we don't worry about it or have to deal with the hassle of police reports and replacing them. Besides that it works well. Been doing this for 2 1/2 years and it's worked great despite bike theft being epidemic on the campus and seeing broken locks and various bike carcasses with parts missing still locked to the racks around campus.

J.

I asked some people who pick locks. What I was told is that locks with keys like this are easy to pick:

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A..._2wrbqLlNMYqDP

These are a bit more tricky:
http://www.westonbodyhardware.com/fi...uble-sided.png

These are good:

http://www.spadinasecurity.com/A/MTL...KeyandCard.gif

It is also important that the lock is well secured from braking, that there's not much place for leverage.


I was also told that good locks only buy you some more time. Like you said, with good tools - a matter of minutes.


Good point. Good advice. I do exactly that... until I got my first road bike. It rides so quickly, nicely, that I ride it to work and leave a heavy bulky lock at work so I can lock it. Having fun until it gets stollen - but what's the use in having a great bike that collects dust at home. Won't sell it, will ride until it lasts.

Replacing the bike, fitting it, dealing with the reports, etc... I'd rather just not have it stolen.

J.

I think you will understand if I don't give new techniques to how to steal a bike. I think there is enough advices available on internet to help thiefs to steal a bike.

Regarding the second point. The strength of an angle grinder is its teeth on the disk but those teeth are also its main weakness.
What happen when you rotate your fork in a bunch of noddles? It stick to it.
The same things happen when the rotating part of a vacuum cleaner meet long hairs. Hairs get stucked.
How long that it takes to remove those hairs stucked... a while.

With the right wires placed in the right way on an ulock or a chain, these wires will stop the rotating disk of the angle grinder from moving.
In fact there is more than one solution for the angle grinder problem.

I say, use either a NY Fahgettaboudit or an OnGuard U-Lock for the first line of defense.

This thread has been hijacked in so many ways, and given erig007's preposterous statement that a $1 Radio Shack appliance can electrically disable an axle grinder from the incredibly loud sounds and bright sparks of filing down a hardened metal compound, we should all just agree that nothing good is going to come from the types of hairs you all are splitting now.

You're no fun. :notamused:

I'm not sure if the key with the chip can be picked or not, but those aren't found in bicycle locks anyways. All the other keys you showed are easy to do with practice. They actually have picking contests in Europe to see who can pick the most pick resistant lock made the quickest called DEFCON; this sport is growing here in the US now.

I guess they can pick transponder locks, just takes a bit longer due to reprograming the cars computer once the key is made that contains a new chip; see: http://lockpicktools.org/lock-pick-set-for-cars/http://lockpicktools.org/lock-pick-set-for-cars/

I didn't say to electrically disable an axle grinder nor did I say to use hairs on it neither.
Ok, first I was talking about electronically disabling an alarm cable not an axle grinder.
I realize you were talking about an axle grinder with your lights and sounds when I was talking about an alarm cable. My mistake.
For the second part, regarding the angle grinder I have said right wires not hairs. The hairs was used as an example

Are you all saying I can someone a haircut with a angle grinder? Any volunteers? Anyone?

You, sir, are a genius. I am not being sarcastic, you should get this patented and sell it to ABUS or Kryptonite. Can you imagine a U-Lock boasting an "angle grinder resistant" certification? It would sell like hot bread.

He's a genius, that's what I was thinking too. Perhaps they could do what bank vaults do, when an attempt is made to drill the door and it actually gets penetrated a bit a gas comes out to knock the would be heister out, instead of gas maybe as the angle grinder cuts about 1/3 of the way the lock would explode taking the thief out. There I go again being to rough on criminals

People should ride the bike they enjoy riding. Particularly if you're like me and 90% of your riding is on the commute, it would be silly to own a nice bike and not use it. Riding a crummy bike for fear of theft is a recipe for not enjoying your commute. My wife tried this strategy this fall (when she was commuting to school instead of a downtown office with indoor parking), and ended up not riding for weeks, before finally giving in and just taking her good bike.

To answer the original post, the best lock is an insurance policy. Sure, get a decent u-lock and do your best to protect the bike you've got. But if a lock needs to be replaced every, say, 5 years, you'll be better off buying a $50 lock plus insurance than a $250 lock.

The lock I mentioned is not covered in the article... and I actually own a couple different battery powered angle grinders (both a harbour freight cheapie and a more expensive dewalt) and neither are going to automatically shear through a lock like people seem to think. The cheap ass one might cut through it in 10 minutes (for one side) with a fresh blade and the dewalt will probably do it in half that. Both are likely to destroy the frame the lock is wrapped around while doing it... and in that time span there is a likelihood of burning up the blade and/or motor in the tool. I would honestly be more afraid of someone hacksawing the bike rack faster/safer than angle-grinding my lock (cutting galvanized pipe with a hacksaw is no amazing feat).

Methinks the average bike thief is not that dedicated. We're not talking simple locks that can be easily raked... and that bic fiasco is over.

...and there was a ring of thieves who were breaking into houses and stealing people's bikes based on CL posts and Strava data... but this is a rare occurence. I'm not going to stop buying nice bikes because someone may break into my house and steal them either.

So I should piss away money on a cheap unreliable bike to get myself to work every day? One with **** brakes and cheap components that are prone to failure? Nah, I'd rather not risk my life or job security, thanks.

Uh... DEFCON is a security conference, not a lock-picking contest (though most years there are lock picking workshops)... and it's held in Las Vegas every year... not Europe. Perhaps you meant the Chaos Communication Conference? Which used to hold the annual German lockpicking championships (but hasn't done so in over half a decade)? Again however, it is not a lockpicking contest, it's a security conference.


Obviously, you're talking out of your ass... but yes, there is some manner of risk to locking a bike up outside in public. The question has never been one of "should I lock up outside?" it has been one of "What is the best lock?" and the OP has been answered. Both the Abus and Kryptonite lock are best-in-class u-locks.

If you're going to commute to work with a bike, the "best" solution is to bring it indoors with you, but if you have to lock up outside, I wouldn't settle for anything less than the above mentioned locks as they will stop all but the most dedicated of thieves.

^^ TheGnome. It's obvious you're very wealthy, so for you to buy a $5,000 bike is probably like pocket change to most of us here. So for you it makes sense to go and buy a $5,000 bike every time it gets stolen.

But your perception of a lower costing bike falling apart is pure nonsense, there are people on this forum that ride low end LBS bikes to work and have no issues, for years I rode a bike (a 84 Trek 660 with Suntour Superbe components) to work that accumulated over 160,000 miles in that time frame and it never broke. And risk your life? Your risking your life more riding that carbon fiber dream bike!! Get real, and stop insulting riders on this forum that ride to work on less then $500 bicycles. Maybe a $100 Walmart bike isn't idea, but their $275 Schwinn Prelude would more then hold up.

And lock picking contests began in Europe and Holland with what was known as LockCon and LockSport and other names, but the contests first came out of Europe in 1997 which I got confused with the American version DefCon. But DefCon didn't add lock picking to other assorted hacking until early 2000 and it was a slow catching on contest.

But regardless you're speaking out of your ass. You don't understand bikes at all, nor tools. 10 minutes for an angle grinder to cut a lock is pure BS and thus the real ass talker is you on those points.

But you did say something that isn't pure BS out of your ass, and that's taking the bike in doors with you. I was always able to take my bike inside and right into my office.

All the locks can be picked. With right tools and enough time. It's not about chip, but those holes in the key. Such locks/keys are more difficult to pick. Perhaps I didn't find the right picture.


Something like this (key in the bottom right corner):

http://www.kaba-elzett.hu/en/Product...hape-lock.html


Just make sure the cable fits tightly, so there's not much leverage for braking it.


I got some 200 euros in locks. Didn't pay that much (got on sale), but that's what I use. They last for years and years. The biggest I could carry. Had 4 bikes stolen so far, so I take no chances. They weren't too expensive, but it still sucks.

Now I make sure my bike is locked to a solid object that can't be moved/cut. Make sure it is better locked and uglier than the bikes around it.

Except for a road bike I use for commuting, but not running errands. I lock it at work place, 1 meter from security's window. It's not 100% safe, but a good chance it won't get stolen that easily.


U locks are practical fro carrying (frame mount), but offer limited choice when you don't have nice bike racks. You can't tie it to a tree or something similar. That's why I prefer a chain. Good fat chain, good fat cable, both with good locks. Locked seat to the frame as well. Made bike look ugly. Grinded with sand paper all the "shimano" marks, chipped paint (it's alu frame, won't get ruined by rust), left it dirty except for the frame.

You're bet.
I bought a 100$ walmart bike once.
It was degrading so fast i thought i had bought a biodegradable bike.
In only a week, gear shift, brakes, handlebars, chain and pedals all broke.
I remember ending up with the shift in my hand while changing gears

Again, you don't really know what you're talking about, but I digress...

The OP's question was answered long before this thread devolved into some sort of paranoid conspiracy theory hoopla. I own the tools that everyone mentions and use them on a semi-regular basis, so I have an ok knowledge of what they're useful for... and while they will make short work of a cheapie Bell lock with a 1/4" shackle, it is going to take a while on a hardened lock with a huge shackle... especially with the turd of a tool you can buy for $30 (which, might I add... needs constant brush replacement). If you want to get into total crazy land... they also make portable band saws... and those will cut through the lock waaaay faster... and much quieter.

And as for "cheap bikes". Most of the Walmart variety *are* junk with all manner of scary parts (plastic armed side-pull brakes for instance). Can you get an ok bike for cheap? Sure, if you spend a lot of time looking and want to do your own wrenching... and if you're really that strapped for cash, I don't think coughing up another few hundred dollars for another bike is going to help.

I've been bike commuting my entire life (I'm 31 and never licensed to drive) and I've had 1 bike stolen ever... when I was in high school, because it was unlocked. It was a cheapie POS.

Or not.

http://youtu.be/H9fLtdZyX-A

Take a deep breath; let it out slowly.

A quick check of facts shows the two tested locks are not 'the best' from their manufacturers.