meanwhile

These are the Avocets that Jobst "I invented the wheel" Brandt designed???

chucky

Another fast tire with inverted tread and thin sidewalls is the Intense MK2...
https://www.intensetyres.com/itdj-mk-210.html
Unfortunately in the 26" diameter they're not available thinner than 2.10" width (so they're about the same weight as the widest Avocet Cross II SLs) which I think is way too wide and heavy for road riding, but in the 20" diameter they're available in a variety of widths weighing from 170-450g and they're cheap cheap cheap.

To me for riding on pavement you want to look at a tire around 200-300g...wider for rougher surfaces and narrower for smoother surfaces, which means smaller diameter for rougher surfaces and larger diameter for smoother surfaces in order to stay around that weight. Good rubber is also important, but once the quality of tire construction is selected the two tradeoffs are:
-Weight vs Rolling Resistance
-Robustness to surface imperfections vs aerodynamics (at a given weight)
...so you really need two dimensions to optimize things (wheel diameter and tire width), but since most people just stick with whatever diameter their frame was made for they only have one dimension left (width) to tradeoff between surface robustness and rolling resistance vs aerodynamics and weight, but even if the diameter is wrong you can't go too wrong picking a width of tire that weighs 200-300g IMO.

meanwhile

..And the reason you think a small variation in tyre weight matters is..?

meanwhile

This chart is for MTB slicks c. 1997, but it shows how bad the assumption "narrow = fast" is:



..eg at 80lbs the fastest 1.25 tyre won't be as fast as the fastest 1.75 - but the fastest 1.5 is faster still. In fact, you run the 1.5 Cheng at 70lbs, with much more suspension and grip, and still be taster than the 1.25 Specialized even when it is at 100lbs

If you want a fast tyre, you need to look for the right rubber compound, little tread (it's not needed on a road tyre for a bicycle) and a thin tyre carcass. Getting this in a form that won't puncture too much or wear out quickly will probably require the use of advanced anti-puncture technology involving something like kevlar - and paying 2 or 3x as much as the cheapest tyre.

Regarding pressure: you should usually aim for each tyre to deflect about 15% when the bike is fully loaded.

More:

https://www.terrymorse.com/bike/rolres.html

https://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_in...ing_resistance

spare_wheel

Meh.

Tire width is not the only determinant of rolling resistance. For example, a 25 mm tire on an 19 mm internal rim has a different rolling resistance from the same tire on a 13 mm rim. Likewise the main reason that faster cyclists prefer skinnies is not due to rolling resistance but due to drag and rotational mass (e.g. no one is gonna race on a wire bead fattie no matter how low the rolling resistance is).

meanwhile

What part of

..read like rocket science to you? Why do you think I pointed out that one particular 1.5 was faster than both the narrower and wider tyres???

This is true, but practically irrelevant - the sensible thing to do is to buy a tyre width that works for your rim.

But this isn't the racing forum. People are not cycling at the speeds where small reductions in aero drag outweigh increases in rolling resistance - you have to be cycling at TT speeds for that; even in Audax a 28-32 is faster than a 23.

And slight differences in acceleration give a huge tactical advantage in crit racing on a corner, but again crit race NOT EQUAL commute! It doesn't even equal an Audax. (In fact, a tyre that accelerates easier is also slowed down easier as well when you don't want it to be - narrow tyres lose a lot more energy to minor bumps and dips in the road. Not a problem for carefully chosen crit racing circuits, but for a commute it is a real issue.)

Overall, you have no idea what "faster cyclists" prefer - you just see what the bike showroom tells you gets used in the TDF. Faster in other contexts - Audax, messenger work, even some of the European road races that get held on rougher roads where the teams race bikes with +28 tyres using cross bikes or specially built team frames - can be much more relevant to commuting.

spare_wheel

LOL! your quote unquote irrelevancy is one of the single biggest developments in road rim technology in the past decade. google hed and a23 and get back to me.

when does rotational mass count the most? think about this a little before you answer.

i know what i prefer.

i seriously laughed out loud at that comment.

the high teens are not tt speed. i get that you prefer wide, heavy, squishy tires. good for you. despite you "preference" there is virtually no difference in rolling resistance between a "sensible" 1.3 inch tire at 80 psi and a 1 inch tire at 105 psi.