Biking safer than driving?
#51
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Yeah me too, which is I think why I am not realizing weight loss since starting my commute. Usually I end up basically "going for a walk" (atop two wheels), and I need to focus or set a stopwatch to make myself work.
Still, "going for a rolling stroll" is better for me than sitting my fat a@@ in a car
Still, "going for a rolling stroll" is better for me than sitting my fat a@@ in a car
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I must be lazy because when I ride my bicycle, my quads do not burn, I never get out of breath, nor do I ride so fast that I get bugs in my mouth/eyes/nostrils. Helmets? The less said the better. I ride at a pace that doesn't bring about those masochistic pleasures. I would not enjoy cycling otherwise.
A lot less people would ride bicycles anywhere if they had to be amongst the "weird folks" and make a g-d hammerfest out of every ride.
A lot less people would ride bicycles anywhere if they had to be amongst the "weird folks" and make a g-d hammerfest out of every ride.
A lot less people already have gotten into cars and don't ride a bike anywhere if they can afford the choice. A hammerfest isn't usually a choice that people make, and that's why such a small fraction of the population rides, because there are times when we have no choice but to hammer to overcome an obstacle. Bicycling to work is the path less traveled and it should be obvious why. It's not fear of death. It's fear of exertion and pain from that exertion and all the accompanying embarrassment associated with failing in some cardiovascular endeavour. Easily done for those with training and already established VO2-max levels. But for the majority of folks who'd easily find someone caring to help them at a 24-hour fitness club and maybe even find a date with that person, you're pretty much one your own when you commute on your bike most of the time unless you already belong to that club of non-exertion, pre-developed quad cyclists with VO2-max levels above normal who can hang with most of us seasoned commuters. And even then, my own destiny means I usually commute when I want to and I'm not bike-pooling with some grouppees who wanna hang out and chit-chat and ride side by side on the bike lane - which makes it more dangerous.
I have 2 pins holding my left ankle together due to a commuter accident on a bike in Tokyo. I'm not dead. But it was life changing. Safer than a car? Heck no. Safer per mile than a car? Heck no. Safer in any other aspect to unmaintained roads, potholes, bad drainage grates? Heck no. But I'm still riding because I can and I'm different and I'm a cheap bastard who hates paying too much for gas and taking longer to drive and park than to ride door to door. Weird isn't always bad. It's just not the mainstream, who are lazier.
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I must be lazy because when I ride my bicycle, my quads do not burn, I never get out of breath, nor do I ride so fast that I get bugs in my mouth/eyes/nostrils. Helmets? The less said the better. I ride at a pace that doesn't bring about those masochistic pleasures. I would not enjoy cycling otherwise.
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Being in the life insurance industry, I tend to prefer looking at all-cause premature mortality rather than just accident rates. Many activities that don't kill you with accidents increase your risk of death from disease or disorders. Driving is one of those activities -- it increases not only accidental death rates, but also cardiovascular disease, diabetes, emphysema, and some cancers.
Cycling to work reduces the all-cause risk of premature death by 40%, even after controlling for other athletic activity. (Copenhagen Heart Study, Andersen et al., 2000)
Life years gained by cycling outweigh life years lost in accidents by 20 to 1 (Baden et al., 1998)
We're all going to die. Some people obsess over *how* they're going to die, but personally, I care more about *when* I'm going to die, and I'd like to delay it as long as I can maintain quality of life. Compared to driving, cycling does both -- it dramatically reduces premature mortality, and it significantly improves quality of life, with reductions in stress, obesity, diabetes, lung disease, heart disease, osteoporosis, and some cancers.
If you could bottle the health and longevity benefits of cycling and sell it as a painful injection every month for the rest of your life, you'd make billions...
Cycling to work reduces the all-cause risk of premature death by 40%, even after controlling for other athletic activity. (Copenhagen Heart Study, Andersen et al., 2000)
Life years gained by cycling outweigh life years lost in accidents by 20 to 1 (Baden et al., 1998)
We're all going to die. Some people obsess over *how* they're going to die, but personally, I care more about *when* I'm going to die, and I'd like to delay it as long as I can maintain quality of life. Compared to driving, cycling does both -- it dramatically reduces premature mortality, and it significantly improves quality of life, with reductions in stress, obesity, diabetes, lung disease, heart disease, osteoporosis, and some cancers.
If you could bottle the health and longevity benefits of cycling and sell it as a painful injection every month for the rest of your life, you'd make billions...
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Ironically, that would kill most of us decades earlier than bicycling. Sitting at home is very dangerous in the longer term, almost as dangerous as sitting at a desk. Perhaps more dangerous, depending on what you eat and drink while staying home ;-)
#57
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I was just about to unsubscribe from my own thread because it is growing tiresome, but then...
That's the kind of informed feedback I was hoping for. Thanks so much for weighing in! And your perspective is verified by the existence of the life insurance industry (which would not be making money and still existing if this was a view that did not line up with reality)
Nice! I'm sure the same could be said for all sorts of activities, like running, swimming, hiking, etc. But perhaps what makes cycling unique is that it can take a very utilitarian form; throw a rack and bags on and it's commuting to work. Take the rack and bags off, and it's a ride for exercise or pleasure.
That's the kind of informed feedback I was hoping for. Thanks so much for weighing in! And your perspective is verified by the existence of the life insurance industry (which would not be making money and still existing if this was a view that did not line up with reality)
If you could bottle the health and longevity benefits of cycling and sell it as a painful injection every month for the rest of your life, you'd make billions...
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That's the kind of informed feedback I was hoping for. Thanks so much for weighing in! And your perspective is verified by the existence of the life insurance industry (which would not be making money and still existing if this was a view that did not line up with reality)
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You misinterpreted the feedback from jputnam. He is in the insurance industry. The statistics he quoted about "life years gained by cycling," and any inference that cyclists live longer than non cyclists was not gathered by the life insurance industry nor was this alleged "reality" verified by the life insurance industry.
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It's also been estimated (medical study, not insurance industry) that for every hour you spend commuting by bike, you add an hour in life expectancy. That's taking into account the chances of fatal and debilitating accidents.
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Now searching for cross-country traveling sales jobs I can apply for...
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Well, you're only breaking even unless you enjoy the biking for its own sake. One hour in the saddle, one hour longer life. Or the other way around: if you hated the cycling but do it for health only, you waste an hour for every hour gained. Fortunately most of us here do enjoy it, and I personally take it in the spirit that every hour riding is an extra hour out of time. Kind of like a two-wheeled Tardis that way.
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Breaking even is all I need. I can live forever (as long as I stay on the bike!)
I'll have to find a closed course where I can ride and sleep at the same time...
I'll have to find a closed course where I can ride and sleep at the same time...
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You might gain even more hours of life if you spend a couple hours on the Internet searching for a different and even higher estimate of cycling's unverified/unsubstantiated life extension power; maybe an estimated two-fer can be found.
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Nah, I don't need to live for two forevers.
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Just commuting - riding forever doesn't count. In other words the hour or two of cardio exercise daily added a similar total time to the life spans of the subjects. Taking it to excess probably doesn't work.
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I'm sorry, that's just dumb. Unless you are being sarcastic and mocking the "1 person/1 death" guy, in which case it's brilliant and incisive. But with that perspective, why even bother discussing anything? How about you just give me your wallet, because the chance that you'll drop it and I'll find it on the road are just 50/50, it'll either happen or it won't, so I'll flip you for it!
I'll instead suggest to you that you COME GET my wallet; it's 50/50 whether you'll get up, travel here, and try; 50/50 that, if you try, you will succeed. 50/50 that your attempt could also end with the 100%.
It's THE wonderful thing about this country -- we can agree to disagree, and if we are both MATURE, we won't call each other "dumb" or "stupid" for having different opinions.
Careful getting into this debate -- I may have you out in the field behind the castle, wolfing grass........
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You misinterpreted the feedback from jputnam. He is in the insurance industry. The statistics he quoted about "life years gained by cycling," and any inference that cyclists live longer than non cyclists was not gathered by the life insurance industry nor was this alleged "reality" verified by the life insurance industry.
One study or two can easily be a fluke, but the large number of studies of bicycling's impact on health and longevity, conducted over decades and in diverse locations, strongly suggest the correlations derived are real, and the benefit ratios I cited are towards the lower end of the spectrum found in published studies.
Life insurance companies generally aren't that granular about what improves your physical condition -- there are just too many possible lifestyle variables to make a reasonable underwriting model. Instead, life insurance focuses on matching the individual's physical condition and major lifestyle factors to actuarial analysis of the population. It generally doesn't matter what non-medical means you use to lower your blood pressure or cholesterol, or how you maintain a healthy weight for your height. As long as you're in excellent physical shape without medical intervention, you'll satisfy that part of the underwriting requirements whether you cycle, run, swim, etc.
#71
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I'll instead suggest to you that you COME GET my wallet; it's 50/50 whether you'll get up, travel here, and try; 50/50 that, if you try, you will succeed. 50/50 that your attempt could also end with the 100%.
It's THE wonderful thing about this country -- we can agree to disagree, and if we are both MATURE, we won't call each other "dumb" or "stupid" for having different opinions.
Careful getting into this debate -- I may have you out in the field behind the castle, wolfing grass.......
#72
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FWIW, the original comment by locolobo was also stupid ("The death rate is the same for everybody. 1 person, 1 death."), which is why I said "unless you are mocking..." All you needed to do is say "yes I was mocking that other guy" and I'd say "I'm sorry I misinterpreted you and called you stupid." But now you've canceled all benefit of the doubt you might have been entitled to, and confirmed that, yes indeed, you said something stupid on the internet. It's ok, it happens to all of us, even me.
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