Anti-theft saddle screw?
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 566 Post(s)
Liked 116 Times
in
98 Posts
Anti-theft saddle screw?
Hello
I noticed a lot of people carrying either a chain, a light lock that takes a couple of seconds to break, or even a U lock just to secure their saddle... all to no avail since the saddle is only connected to the seat post with a 100% unsecure regular Allen screw:
Indded, it seems no one makes secure saddle screws. The usual suspects (Pinhead, Pitlock, Zefal, Anti-vandale) only seem to sell seat post screws.
Can someone confirm, or is there a manufacturer I should know about?
Thank you.
I noticed a lot of people carrying either a chain, a light lock that takes a couple of seconds to break, or even a U lock just to secure their saddle... all to no avail since the saddle is only connected to the seat post with a 100% unsecure regular Allen screw:
Indded, it seems no one makes secure saddle screws. The usual suspects (Pinhead, Pitlock, Zefal, Anti-vandale) only seem to sell seat post screws.
Can someone confirm, or is there a manufacturer I should know about?
Thank you.
Last edited by Winfried; 06-03-13 at 04:38 PM.
#2
Palmer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 8,580
Bikes: Mike Melton custom, 1982 Stumpjumper, Alex Moulton AM, 2010 Dawes Briercliffe, 2017 Dahon Curl i8, 2021 Motobecane Turino 1x12
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1645 Post(s)
Liked 1,785 Times
in
1,041 Posts
Last edited by tcs; 06-03-13 at 05:26 AM.
#3
Full Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 359
Bikes: Salsa Fargo, One-One Inbred 29er, Blue Norcross
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
For about the same price, you can get a bag of 50-100 security torx screws from McMaster Carr. Outfit your whole stable, and maybe a couple friends' as well.
#4
DancesWithSUVs
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Griffin Cycle Bethesda,MD
Posts: 6,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
BB and some rubber cement. It's not like you'll prolly be needing to do a road-side repair.
__________________
C'dale BBU('05 and '09)/Super Six/Hooligan8and 3,Kona Dew Deluxe,Novara Buzz/Safari,Surly Big Dummy,Marin Pt Reyes,Giant Defy 1,Schwinn DBX SuperSport,Dahon Speed Pro TT,Brompton S6L/S2E-X
C'dale BBU('05 and '09)/Super Six/Hooligan8and 3,Kona Dew Deluxe,Novara Buzz/Safari,Surly Big Dummy,Marin Pt Reyes,Giant Defy 1,Schwinn DBX SuperSport,Dahon Speed Pro TT,Brompton S6L/S2E-X
#5
Keepin it Wheel
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: San Diego
Posts: 10,238
Bikes: Surly CrossCheck, Krampus
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked 3,399 Times
in
2,510 Posts
Pitlock offers saddle cables; it's hard to tell, but if you go here and roll the mouse over the saddle and seattube clamp areas, you can see in the pictures the cable being looped around a saddle rail, and the end-loops going around the pitlock seatpost-clamp bolt, which would secure your saddle (assuming you can trust the strength of the cable). Worst somebody could do is loosen your saddle bolt, maybe leave it dangling (or leave it loose so it falls off when you sit on it).
I have seen other people "securing" brooks saddles with light steel cables like that, but it's a question of what do you attach the cable to?
BTW torx screw I don't see as very secure. If a good thief doesn't have a torx on him, if he spies your bike in the same place more than one day in a row, he can count on coming back with a torx later.
And of course there's always an angle grinder. There are horror stories out there of bike thieves at work for a surprisingly long time with tons of passersby doing nothing.
Pitlock seems as good of a bike security solution as I've ever seen (but I've never bought them -- I'm fortunate that I only ever have to lock up in fairly safe suburban areas, and I get to roll my bike right into my cube every day, so I only ever bother with a cheap cable lock)
I have seen other people "securing" brooks saddles with light steel cables like that, but it's a question of what do you attach the cable to?
BTW torx screw I don't see as very secure. If a good thief doesn't have a torx on him, if he spies your bike in the same place more than one day in a row, he can count on coming back with a torx later.
And of course there's always an angle grinder. There are horror stories out there of bike thieves at work for a surprisingly long time with tons of passersby doing nothing.
Pitlock seems as good of a bike security solution as I've ever seen (but I've never bought them -- I'm fortunate that I only ever have to lock up in fairly safe suburban areas, and I get to roll my bike right into my cube every day, so I only ever bother with a cheap cable lock)
Last edited by RubeRad; 06-03-13 at 04:40 PM.
#6
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 566 Post(s)
Liked 116 Times
in
98 Posts
Sorry. Corrected.
Are they different from regular torx screws?
Thanks for the link. I'd rather secure screws than a cable.
But torx screws are insecure since they can be removed by anyone, while secure screws by the companies above require a special key, pretty much unique to the user.
What's "BB"?
Bicycle Bolts offers security Torx screws.
Pitlock offers saddle cables
But torx screws are insecure since they can be removed by anyone, while secure screws by the companies above require a special key, pretty much unique to the user.
What's "BB"?
#7
Keepin it Wheel
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: San Diego
Posts: 10,238
Bikes: Surly CrossCheck, Krampus
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked 3,399 Times
in
2,510 Posts
And looks like you missed this from Pinhead; fairly clever, a secure collar that obstructs access to the saddle clamp bolt. It would make it a pain to adjust the saddle since you have to loosen two things rather than one, but it looks like an effective idea to me!
(Thx for linking, I hadn't heard of Pinhead or Anti-vandale before, good to see Pitlock has competitors; will drive innovation forward and prices down!)
(Thx for linking, I hadn't heard of Pinhead or Anti-vandale before, good to see Pitlock has competitors; will drive innovation forward and prices down!)
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,595
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 608 Post(s)
Liked 352 Times
in
225 Posts
BB is ball bearing. Find one that fits in the allen head and put some rubber cement or epoxy to hold it and fill the indent. It keeps allen keys out unless you dig at it with a pick. Usually thieves won't bother and look for easier things to steal.
#9
Full Member
You can also get pit locks small enough to use as your seat post clamp bolt. Then someone needs your key to remove.
https://www.pitlock.com/to-the-shop/c...t-02/index.php
https://www.pitlock.com/to-the-shop/c...t-02/index.php
Pitlock offers saddle cables; it's hard to tell, but if you go here and roll the mouse over the saddle and seattube clamp areas, you can see in the pictures the cable being looped around a saddle rail, and the end-loops going around the pitlock seatpost-clamp bolt, which would secure your saddle (assuming you can trust the strength of the cable). Worst somebody could do is loosen your saddle bolt, maybe leave it dangling (or leave it loose so it falls off when you sit on it).
I have seen other people "securing" brooks saddles with light steel cables like that, but it's a question of what do you attach the cable to?
BTW torx screw I don't see as very secure. If a good thief doesn't have a torx on him, if he spies your bike in the same place more than one day in a row, he can count on coming back with a torx later.
And of course there's always an angle grinder. There are horror stories out there of bike thieves at work for a surprisingly long time with tons of passersby doing nothing.
Pitlock seems as good of a bike security solution as I've ever seen (but I've never bought them -- I'm fortunate that I only ever have to lock up in fairly safe suburban areas, and I get to roll my bike right into my cube every day, so I only ever bother with a cheap cable lock)
I have seen other people "securing" brooks saddles with light steel cables like that, but it's a question of what do you attach the cable to?
BTW torx screw I don't see as very secure. If a good thief doesn't have a torx on him, if he spies your bike in the same place more than one day in a row, he can count on coming back with a torx later.
And of course there's always an angle grinder. There are horror stories out there of bike thieves at work for a surprisingly long time with tons of passersby doing nothing.
Pitlock seems as good of a bike security solution as I've ever seen (but I've never bought them -- I'm fortunate that I only ever have to lock up in fairly safe suburban areas, and I get to roll my bike right into my cube every day, so I only ever bother with a cheap cable lock)
#10
Palmer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 8,580
Bikes: Mike Melton custom, 1982 Stumpjumper, Alex Moulton AM, 2010 Dawes Briercliffe, 2017 Dahon Curl i8, 2021 Motobecane Turino 1x12
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1645 Post(s)
Liked 1,785 Times
in
1,041 Posts
F'sure; security torx keys are sold in good hardware stores. But if someone is stalking your bike, staking out it's parked location, inventorying special and/or uncommon tools and techniques needed, planning to bypass easier targets and come back later with exactly what they'll need specifically to compromise your security regime...well, let's face it, you can kiss the whole bike goodbye.
#11
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 566 Post(s)
Liked 116 Times
in
98 Posts
Right. I'll add the torx screws to my list of solutions for this common issue.
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 101
Bikes: Fuji Nevada - winter/bad weather ... 80's Nishiki Prestige ... 80's Basso Gap
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I haven't used the torx variety, but allen head security screws with that central pin are not really very secure in my experience. If we didn't have the right key with us a few light taps on the pin with a screwdriver or similar would break the central pin off, now it's just a regular, unsecure allen screw. It takes very little time and might not even attract attention like cutting a chain or grinding through a lock.
Last edited by EAA; 06-04-13 at 05:04 AM. Reason: clarification
#13
Palmer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 8,580
Bikes: Mike Melton custom, 1982 Stumpjumper, Alex Moulton AM, 2010 Dawes Briercliffe, 2017 Dahon Curl i8, 2021 Motobecane Turino 1x12
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1645 Post(s)
Liked 1,785 Times
in
1,041 Posts
Well, let's remember that the fenced value of most used saddles is nil. Saddles have been the #1 swapped out component since the 1890s, and your typical bike shop has a bin of brand new OEM take-offs they'll sell for pocket change.
That's probably the most secure suggestion in the thread, but, and it's a big but, posters have worried thieves might carry odd, rare or multiple tools just to steal saddles. Well, a tubing cutter will silently go through an aluminum seat post in under half a minute; a battery powered sawzall makes more noise but would cut a seat post in seconds.
If you want to protect the beloved Brooks B17 Select World Traveller that's broken in to match your derriere, lock the bike frame & wheels and take the saddle with you!
And looks like you missed this from Pinhead; fairly clever, a secure collar that obstructs access to the saddle clamp bolt.
If you want to protect the beloved Brooks B17 Select World Traveller that's broken in to match your derriere, lock the bike frame & wheels and take the saddle with you!
Last edited by tcs; 06-04-13 at 11:26 AM.
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 621
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
#15
Palmer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 8,580
Bikes: Mike Melton custom, 1982 Stumpjumper, Alex Moulton AM, 2010 Dawes Briercliffe, 2017 Dahon Curl i8, 2021 Motobecane Turino 1x12
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1645 Post(s)
Liked 1,785 Times
in
1,041 Posts
Perhaps this instead.
#16
Keepin it Wheel
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: San Diego
Posts: 10,238
Bikes: Surly CrossCheck, Krampus
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked 3,399 Times
in
2,510 Posts
Perhaps I'm too easily entertained, but I'd buy a ticket to watch somebody attempt to arc weld a steel fixing bolt into an aluminum seat post.
Perhaps this instead.
Perhaps this instead.
#17
Palmer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 8,580
Bikes: Mike Melton custom, 1982 Stumpjumper, Alex Moulton AM, 2010 Dawes Briercliffe, 2017 Dahon Curl i8, 2021 Motobecane Turino 1x12
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1645 Post(s)
Liked 1,785 Times
in
1,041 Posts
Red really puts stuff together - you'll need a torch to get it back apart, and I don't know if you want to torch near a good saddle. Maybe Loctite Green instead? Usually just hair drier heat and some persuasive torque will pop that.
#18
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 566 Post(s)
Liked 116 Times
in
98 Posts
Thanks for the feedback.
Just remember that saddles can be stolen by kids and tossed in a garbage can just for "fun".
Either way, you're stuck with no saddle.
Just remember that saddles can be stolen by kids and tossed in a garbage can just for "fun".
Either way, you're stuck with no saddle.
#19
Palmer
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 8,580
Bikes: Mike Melton custom, 1982 Stumpjumper, Alex Moulton AM, 2010 Dawes Briercliffe, 2017 Dahon Curl i8, 2021 Motobecane Turino 1x12
Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1645 Post(s)
Liked 1,785 Times
in
1,041 Posts
#20
Full Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: West Palm Beach, Florida
Posts: 263
Bikes: 1984 Cannodale full touring bike, Giant full carbon dura ace, Belinsky frame Tandem
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Very good thread. I have been able to loosen a red loctite bolt with a 100w soldering iron. More precise way to apply heat. Double O
#21
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 2,494
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 566 Post(s)
Liked 116 Times
in
98 Posts
Thanks for the tip. I was about to ask what the most efficient way was to unloosen the ball bearing after gluing it in place with some superglue :-)
Edit: Elsewhere, someone mentions using acetone instead of heat.
Edit: Elsewhere, someone mentions using acetone instead of heat.
Last edited by Winfried; 06-07-13 at 04:16 AM.
#22
Full Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: West Palm Beach, Florida
Posts: 263
Bikes: 1984 Cannodale full touring bike, Giant full carbon dura ace, Belinsky frame Tandem
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Thanks for the tip. I was about to ask what the most efficient way was to unloosen the ball bearing after gluing it in place with some superglue :-)
Edit: Elsewhere, someone mentions using acetone instead of heat.
Edit: Elsewhere, someone mentions using acetone instead of heat.
#24
my nice bike is at home
I use a chain. around the seat rail to the seat stay. It is a lighter gauge than a bicycle chain but the same kind of links, only smaller. I think it was a small-motor chain will try to post a pic. Also a company used to make a seat post "anchor" I guess using a star nut, which had a cable connected to the water bottle cage screw inside the seat tube. Wild but effective. If u r handy u cld fab that up easily.
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 705
Bikes: Bianchi circa late 1980s, Surly Cross Check, Kona Blast
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I use a kryptonite cable, loop it through the saddle rails, rear triangle/wheel and then u-lock the front wheel to the rack/cable.