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Something similar to Surly crosscheck with disc brakes, and lighter?

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Something similar to Surly crosscheck with disc brakes, and lighter?

Old 08-19-13, 07:04 PM
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brbbiking
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Something similar to Surly crosscheck with disc brakes, and lighter?

So I have a Surly XCheck ('11 ?) that I like, except I want disc brakes. I also would like to get something lighter, if possible. I do like the versatility of the XCheck, the quality, etc. Does anyone have any recommendations for bikes such as that?

Thanks!
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Old 08-19-13, 07:15 PM
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Surly Straggler is very similar to the Cross Check with disc brakes, coming to a dealer near you soon
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Old 08-19-13, 07:57 PM
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How much are you willing to spend?
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Old 08-19-13, 08:39 PM
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I do not understand this weight thing? The CC is as light as any steel bike except for the high end steel road bikes like my Pinerello. If I took the fenders, racks, Brooks saddle, head lights, bell, heavy water bottle cages, blinkies, seat bag, chunky dual side SPD pedals off and then installed high end/race replacements and a carbon seat post and carbon bar and a high zoot bottom bracket and carbon fork and 23mm tires I am pretty sure the CC would weigh in around 22 pounds, possibly 20ish. And, it would be totally useless as a multi-mission and all terrain assault and zombie escape vehicle.

If you want a carbon road bike that weighs 16 pounds, there are plenty of them out there and they are fragile, do not take fenders and are expensive and LIFE LIMITED.

LC
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Old 08-19-13, 09:45 PM
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Trek Cross-rip frames are aluminum, Lighter? IdK, go weigh them..

Seattle? go look, at the Red Line bikes SBS is based there..
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Old 08-19-13, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Simpletommy View Post
How much are you willing to spend?
Probably at most $3k
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Old 08-19-13, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
I do not understand this weight thing? The CC is as light as any steel bike except for the high end steel road bikes like my Pinerello. If I took the fenders, racks, Brooks saddle, head lights, bell, heavy water bottle cages, blinkies, seat bag, chunky dual side SPD pedals off and then installed high end/race replacements and a carbon seat post and carbon bar and a high zoot bottom bracket and carbon fork and 23mm tires I am pretty sure the CC would weigh in around 22 pounds, possibly 20ish. And, it would be totally useless as a multi-mission and all terrain assault and zombie escape vehicle.

If you want a carbon road bike that weighs 16 pounds, there are plenty of them out there and they are fragile, do not take fenders and are expensive and LIFE LIMITED.

LC
Not looking for a 16 lb carbon road bike. Looking for something a bit lighter than the CC, while still retaining some of the characteristics I like, if possible.
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Old 08-19-13, 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Trek Cross-rip frames are aluminum, Lighter? IdK, go weigh them..

Seattle? go look, at the Red Line bikes SBS is based there..
Will take a look, thx!
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Old 08-19-13, 10:37 PM
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The Salsa Fargo looks interesting.. Has the disc brakes and some versatility of the CC. Thoughts on this one compared to the CC ?
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Old 08-19-13, 10:49 PM
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Errr, maybe the Salsa Vaya is closer, still with disc brakes
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Old 08-20-13, 05:48 AM
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I have the Vaya with discs and it is a great bike and rides very well. However, you won't get a leg up on better weight. The discs will add a little to your total too. What you might consider is building a set of wheels that are lighter, but still strong. That can make a bike feel a lot lighter than it really is. However, I do like the momentum of my Schwalbe Marathon Supremes (40mm wide) and Mavic Disc rims (719s). Once I get it rolling it feels smooth and as if I could ride all day.

Loose Chain has a good point too, but if you choose the lighter options on each of your upgrades (like a Tubus rack vs. Salsa) you may avoid an additional 5 pounds or so in the end. For really nice and light you may want to go with a Titanium frame. I'm looking at the Seven, but will take a few years to save up for that (touring frames at about $3,500). You may want to look at my The Ultimate Bike thread to get some ideas of what others are riding. Some pretty cool bikes discussed there.


Originally Posted by brbbiking View Post
Errr, maybe the Salsa Vaya is closer, still with disc brakes
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Old 08-20-13, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
I do not understand this weight thing? The CC is as light as any steel bike except for the high end steel road bikes like my Pinerello. If I took the fenders, racks, Brooks saddle, head lights, bell, heavy water bottle cages, blinkies, seat bag, chunky dual side SPD pedals off and then installed high end/race replacements and a carbon seat post and carbon bar and a high zoot bottom bracket and carbon fork and 23mm tires I am pretty sure the CC would weigh in around 22 pounds, possibly 20ish. And, it would be totally useless as a multi-mission and all terrain assault and zombie escape vehicle.

If you want a carbon road bike that weighs 16 pounds, there are plenty of them out there and they are fragile, do not take fenders and are expensive and LIFE LIMITED.




LC
Because the difference between a 222 pound bike and rider combo and 220 bike rider combo will save him .32346 seconds per 5 miles on his commute. In the highly competitive sport of bike commuting that's the difference between a win and a loss.
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Old 08-20-13, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Germany_chris View Post
Because the difference between a 222 pound bike and rider combo and 220 bike rider combo will save him .32346 seconds per 5 miles on his commute. In the highly competitive sport of bike commuting that's the difference between a win and a loss.
Hard to argue with this logic, . I'd look at Soma's double cross disc made of tange prestige tubing (main triangle, chrome moly forks and stays). I own the plain vanilla double cross and it is a fine bike. I cannot recommend it highly enough. It may not be quite light enough though for the sport of bike commuting. Perhaps we'll all get lucky commuting and the sanctioning body for the sport will outlaw bikes that are too light . . .

https://www.somafab.com/archives/prod...ble-cross-disc
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Old 08-20-13, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
I do not understand this weight thing? The CC is as light as any steel bike except for the high end steel road bikes like my Pinerello.
No, the Cross-Check is extremely heavy for a modern steel frame, even among framesets in a similar price bracket. The Soma Double Cross is just one example of an inexpensive steel frame that is a fair bit lighter than the Cross-Check, over half a pound in most sizes. That's not a great deal in the grand scheme of things, but between two frames of similar quality, it's significant. The Cross-Check is a tank. I have one and love it, by the way, just saying that it is heavy and half a pound less on the frame is money you don't have to spend on components to get that half pound lighter.

Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
If I took the fenders, racks, Brooks saddle, head lights, bell, heavy water bottle cages, blinkies, seat bag, chunky dual side SPD pedals off and then installed high end/race replacements and a carbon seat post and carbon bar and a high zoot bottom bracket and carbon fork and 23mm tires I am pretty sure the CC would weigh in around 22 pounds, possibly 20ish. And, it would be totally useless as a multi-mission and all terrain assault and zombie escape vehicle.
I've got my Cross-Check built up at about 23 lbs with a fairly standard cyclocross build, no need to go to cartoonish extremes. Add fenders and it's more like 24. But... that's pretty heavy. A little bit of difference in weight makes a big difference in how a bike feels.

Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
If you want a carbon road bike that weighs 16 pounds, there are plenty of them out there and they are fragile
Wrong.

Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
do not take fenders
Most don't, but some careful looking will yield a surprising number of examples that can take fenders.

Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
and are expensive
Well, yeah, so? Some people are willing to spend money on a commuter bike, some aren't. It's not a universal requirement that they be cheap. Think how many people are commuting on expensive custom bikes that AREN'T light and fast. Plenty! What matters is they're commuting on the bike they want to ride every day.

Originally Posted by Loose Chain View Post
and LIFE LIMITED.
Wrong again.

I don't think a superlight carbon road bike is the ideal commuting bike, at least not for me on most days, but they aren't made of marzipan. In any case, there's a happy medium to be found. One can spend a lot less money than it would take to get a 15 lb carbon bike and instead get a 17, 18 or 19 lb aluminum or carbon bike that still feels a lot lighter and zippier than a heavy Cross-Check. Thinking about weight isn't pointless and isn't just about performance, it makes a big difference in how a bike feels to ride, and if that makes the ride more pleasurable, it's well worth it.
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Old 08-20-13, 07:11 AM
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How about the Specialized Tricross Steel?

https://www.bicycletimesmag.com/conte...el-disc-triple
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Old 08-20-13, 07:20 AM
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... or the All-City Macho Man Disc.

https://allcitycycles.com/bikes/macho_man_disc
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Old 08-20-13, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by grolby View Post
Thinking about weight isn't pointless and isn't just about performance, it makes a big difference in how a bike feels to ride, and if that makes the ride more pleasurable, it's well worth it.
I'd argue that geometry has more to do with the zippy feel than weight especially at the weight differences were talking here. The second thing that makes bikes feel fast is wheel weight more specifically rim and tire weight.

The difference of 1/2 pound is 226.8 grams

A 220 pound bike rider and crap combo is 99,792 grams

A new frame with 1/2 pound weight difference will yield a .2% weight difference to the entire package. Even if he pulled say 4 pounds off the bike he's looking at a 1.8% in total weight.
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Old 08-20-13, 08:16 AM
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The Cotic Roadrat is a sweet machine worth consideration here. I cannot, however, speak to the weight comparison with the Surly; I'm thinking to replace my old Big Buzz with one, so I'll shoot the Cotic folks an email and see what they say.

https://www.cotic.co.uk/product/roadrat
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Old 08-20-13, 08:31 AM
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Ridley, of Belgium, distributed , by QBP, makes CF& aluminum cross race Frames, Carbon Forks.

https://www.ridley-bikes.com/be/en/ dealer search https://www.ridley-bikes.com/be/en/about-ridley/dealers

I found 4 are in PDX, 2 in Seattle, using the search.

Last edited by fietsbob; 08-20-13 at 08:38 AM.
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Old 08-20-13, 08:36 AM
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Everyone is missing the obvious. Soma Double Cross Disc. Tange Prestige steel. My 56cm frame is more than half a pound lighter than a CC in the same size. Ride quality is great. Get one used for <$300
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Old 08-20-13, 08:47 AM
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Habanero Cycles offers a disc-only titanium cyclocross frame.
https://habcycles.com/cross.html (at the bottom)
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Old 08-20-13, 09:38 AM
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I'm looking at similar bikes. One you might consider is the Kona Rove, although I don't imagine there is an appreciable weight advantage over the CC. I think the component specs are better than the new Straggler.

https://www.konaworld.com/rove.cfm

They also make the Rove frame in titanium, which looks like fun if money is no object.

https://www.konaworld.com/rove_ti.cfm
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Old 08-20-13, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Dylansbob View Post
Everyone is missing the obvious. Soma Double Cross Disc. Tange Prestige steel. My 56cm frame is more than half a pound lighter than a CC in the same size. Ride quality is great. Get one used for <$300
It was mentioned twice already before this, in posts 13 and 14.
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Old 08-20-13, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Germany_chris View Post
I'd argue that geometry has more to do with the zippy feel than weight especially at the weight differences were talking here. The second thing that makes bikes feel fast is wheel weight more specifically rim and tire weight.

The difference of 1/2 pound is 226.8 grams

A 220 pound bike rider and crap combo is 99,792 grams

A new frame with 1/2 pound weight difference will yield a .2% weight difference to the entire package. Even if he pulled say 4 pounds off the bike he's looking at a 1.8% in total weight.
^^^^^^
THIS
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Old 08-20-13, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by phughes View Post
^^^^^^
THIS
I say this every so often and I'll mention it again here. People will pay a premium for a laptop that's a fraction of a pound lighter just because they're easier to deal with. Now, it's not like you're carrying your bike everywhere you go but some of us do end up lifting them quite a bit.

There's the whole thing about sprung vs unsprung weight and how that affects performance. Your weight doesn't affect performance the same way that weight attached to the bike does.
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