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Any LHT owners? Did you install a kickstand?

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Any LHT owners? Did you install a kickstand?

Old 09-18-14, 09:03 AM
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DrPangloss
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Any LHT owners? Did you install a kickstand?

I'm a new LHT owner, and just read the official Surly position on kickstands. I love kickstands and have it on my other bikes. But now I'm having second thoughts about installing a Greenfield on the N + 1. My commute doesn't involve hauling heavy stuff; I usually just bring my purse, lunch, and clothes. Are there any issues I have to be mindful about?
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Old 09-18-14, 09:19 AM
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I have a kickstand on my MTB conversion commuter and sorta like it so I was considering installing a Pletscher double-leg kickstand on the LHT but read the same Surly blog post and decided against it. Turns out I don't need or miss it anyway.

IIRC the issue with installing the kickstand isn't quite as much with lateral leverage but with crushing the chainstays with the mounting-bolt torque. If you don't cinch the kickstand bolt too tight you should be fine and I think the newer Pletscher kickstands have better mounting brackets to help alleviate this.
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Old 09-18-14, 09:25 AM
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Surly has an "official position" on kickstands? Weird. My position on kickstands is this: "If you want a kickstand on your bike, then put a kickstand on your bike if it's possible and safe to do so. Otherwise, don't."

I don't have a LHT, but I do have a touring bike (my Trek 520). I installed a rear-mount kickstand on it because any bike I'm using to haul gear, carry groceries, commute, etc., will have a kickstand. It's just damned convenient. If you don't have the space for a traditional center-mount kickstand on your LHT, or if crushing the stays is a risk, then look into a rear-mount stand. Failing that, there are always options such as this one.
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Old 09-18-14, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Lanovran View Post
Surly has an "official position" on kickstands? Weird. My position on kickstands is this: "If you want a kickstand on your bike, then put a kickstand on your bike if it's possible and safe to do so. Otherwise, don't."

I don't have a LHT, but I do have a touring bike (my Trek 520). I installed a rear-mount kickstand on it because any bike I'm using to haul gear, carry groceries, commute, etc., will have a kickstand. It's just damned convenient. If you don't have the space for a traditional center-mount kickstand on your LHT, or if crushing the stays is a risk, then look into a rear-mount stand. Failing that, there are always options such as this one.
Not so much a position on kickstands per se but on installing them on thin-walled chainstay tubes.

Also, the LHT has a spoke-holder welded to the non-drive side chainstay that interferes with the installation of a rear-mount kickstand.
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Old 09-18-14, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by J.C. Koto View Post
I have a kickstand on my MTB conversion commuter and sorta like it so I was considering installing a Pletscher double-leg kickstand on the LHT but read the same Surly blog post and decided against it. Turns out I don't need or miss it anyway.

IIRC the issue with installing the kickstand isn't quite as much with lateral leverage but with crushing the chainstays with the mounting-bolt torque. If you don't cinch the kickstand bolt too tight you should be fine and I think the newer Pletscher kickstands have better mounting brackets to help alleviate this.
I was looking into the double-leg kickstand, but saw this complaint elsewhere: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...ht/ggpUqTLifPg

I suppose he could have prevented the problem by doing his own installation, which is what I will do if I decide on the Pletscher. Thanks for the suggestion, I think I will go with it instead of the single-leg kickstand.
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Old 09-18-14, 10:07 AM
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There are plastic padded pieces to go on top of the chainstay It has pins to fit in a different top . KS clamp piece..


fabricating a flat piece that the cross brace Mudguard screw would hold down .. Is Possible.

IDK if someone did it all for you.

Last edited by fietsbob; 09-18-14 at 10:11 AM.
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Old 09-18-14, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Lanovran View Post
Surly has an "official position" on kickstands? Weird. My position on kickstands is this: "If you want a kickstand on your bike, then put a kickstand on your bike if it's possible and safe to do so. Otherwise, don't."
That's pretty close to Surly's "official position" except that they add "if you over-torque the bolt that is clamping your chainstays between two pieces of metal you can crush the chainstays." That's not in any way specific to Surly bikes and I definitely wouldn't want to ride any bike that is more over-built than an LHT. If Surly's statement scares people away from using a kickstand on an LHT it should scare them away from using a kickstand on any bike.

I've never put a kickstand on my LHT. In fact, I haven't had a kickstand on any of my bikes since I got rid of the GT Timberline that I started commuting on seven years ago. It came with a kickstand. I put a kickstand on my daughter's Rockhopper because she wanted one. It was the Greenfield model that clamps the chainstays just behind the bottom bracket. It hasn't crushed the chainstay yet and it stays put. Of course, she doesn't use her bike for heavily loaded touring.

In support of Surly's "position" here's a picture of my LHT leaning against a wall.

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Old 09-18-14, 11:25 AM
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I love my Click-Stand!
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Old 09-18-14, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Bike Hermit View Post
I love my Click-Stand!
I think I saw one of those in a Dali painting.
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Old 09-18-14, 11:53 AM
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My road bike has no kickstand, my racked, fendered "commuter" with folding baskets does. I use both for commuting. While neither is a LHT, I wanted to add that the commuter has the kickstand mounted on the frame by the left rear axle. The reason was that with a load on the rack and baskets, the bike would fall backwards with a traditional kickstand. I like it and can kick it up from the saddle if need be.
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Old 09-18-14, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
[snip]

Could you please tell me what handlebar wrap that is? I recently got an antique brown Brooks saddle and since my stock handlebar wrap is coming undone I'd like to replace it with something brown to match the saddle. What you have here looks especially nice compared to a lot of the other brown wraps I've seen.
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Old 09-18-14, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
That's pretty close to Surly's "official position" except that they add "if you over-torque the bolt that is clamping your chainstays between two pieces of metal you can crush the chainstays." That's not in any way specific to Surly bikes and I definitely wouldn't want to ride any bike that is more over-built than an LHT. If Surly's statement scares people away from using a kickstand on an LHT it should scare them away from using a kickstand on any bike.
That's exactly the info I'm looking for. I wasn't sure whether the LHT chainstay is thinner than, say, the Jamis Coda's. If not, then I should be able to use a kickstand without worries. I mentioned the Coda, because I have a kickstand on that bike for years, and I haven't seen any pinching of the chainstay.

BTW, here's my bike looking photogenic at Acadia National Park, sans kickstand:
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surlylht.jpg (101.5 KB, 67 views)
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Old 09-18-14, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by J.C. Koto View Post
Could you please tell me what handlebar wrap that is? I recently got an antique brown Brooks saddle and since my stock handlebar wrap is coming undone I'd like to replace it with something brown to match the saddle. What you have here looks especially nice compared to a lot of the other brown wraps I've seen.
It's Salsa dark brown gel cork tape, and I like it a lot. You do have to tolerate the Salsa logo plastered all over it though.

Universal Cycles -- Salsa Gel Cork Tape - Dark Brown
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Old 09-18-14, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
It's Salsa dark brown gel cork tape, and I like it a lot. You do have to tolerate the Salsa logo plastered all over it though.

Universal Cycles -- Salsa Gel Cork Tape - Dark Brown
Thank you!
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Old 09-18-14, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by DrPangloss View Post
That's exactly the info I'm looking for. I wasn't sure whether the LHT chainstay is thinner than, say, the Jamis Coda's. If not, then I should be able to use a kickstand without worries. I mentioned the Coda, because I have a kickstand on that bike for years, and I haven't seen any pinching of the chainstay.

BTW, here's my bike looking photogenic at Acadia National Park, sans kickstand:
Nice looking bike! I just had lunch with my buddy that rides a LHT - he uses Pletscher Twin-Legger Kickstand polished silver He recommends the "deluxe adapter kit" (?)
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Old 09-18-14, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Hypno Toad View Post
Nice looking bike! I just had lunch with my buddy that rides a LHT - he uses Pletscher Twin-Legger Kickstand polished silver He recommends the "deluxe adapter kit" (?)
Thanks!

I'll look into the deluxe adapter kit. I'm still deciding between the Greenfield and the Pletscher, although the consensus here seems to favor the latter.

Nice handle BTW. I miss Futurama.
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Old 09-18-14, 02:24 PM
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A kickstand is a theft-promotion device. You should be locking your bike to something solid when you are not on it. Use that object to hold up your bike. If you have a kickstand, then it is easy to run into the store and become a victim of "I just left it for a minute" theft. Unless you live in Mayberry RFD where there is no crime. Then a kickstand just becomes an unnecessary addition to your fine machine. Are you going to tour across Kansas? Perhaps then a kickstand would come in handy. Anywhere else in the world, not so much.
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Old 09-18-14, 11:31 PM
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A DT, with a pletscher dual kickstand.


Helps a me lot, and yes, if bike is in public it's gonna be locked. Not necessarily a great lock, usually a heavy cable and padlock shared with SO's bike... else one of us is with bikes else bike comes with me.
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Old 09-19-14, 08:46 AM
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I'm really close to replacing my Disc Trucker frameset with a Soma Saga Disc. The Soma has a kickstand plate and a slightly better geometry for touring. Compared to the LHT, the Saga has a longer head-tube, and for the same length top-tube (the only tube that really matters for sizing), the Saga has a fair bit more stack and about the same reach. I'm leaning toward the LHT actually being a bit too 'racey' and leaned over. I've got my bars at the top of the steerer and wouldn't mind them a wee bit higher. Even then, the Saga has a longer head-tube, so having the bars at the same height would result in a good bit less flex. Why can Soma tack on a kickstand plate but Surly cannot is beyond me. It's a freaking touring bike, not a ultra-lightweight tubing racing bike. Don't put chainstays on that are too thin for a kickstand plate to be welded to, that's just silly. It'll be maybe $200 total loss to get a Saga once I sell off my Disc Trucker, so I'm quite tempted.
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Old 09-19-14, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by dwinks View Post
I'm really close to replacing my Disc Trucker frameset with a Soma Saga Disc. The Soma has a kickstand plate and a slightly better geometry for touring. Compared to the LHT, the Saga has a longer head-tube, and for the same length top-tube (the only tube that really matters for sizing), the Saga has a fair bit more stack and about the same reach. I'm leaning toward the LHT actually being a bit too 'racey' and leaned over. I've got my bars at the top of the steerer and wouldn't mind them a wee bit higher. Even then, the Saga has a longer head-tube, so having the bars at the same height would result in a good bit less flex. Why can Soma tack on a kickstand plate but Surly cannot is beyond me. It's a freaking touring bike, not a ultra-lightweight tubing racing bike. Don't put chainstays on that are too thin for a kickstand plate to be welded to, that's just silly. It'll be maybe $200 total loss to get a Saga once I sell off my Disc Trucker, so I'm quite tempted.
Before this current bike, I was also looking at building a Soma Saga, because of the shorter top-tube. The reason I went with the Disc Trucker is because my LBS had a great deal on one my size.

I'm still getting used to the bike, but my impression so far is that I am a bit stretched out, and there's a bit of weight on my hands. I just got a stem raiser so I can push my bars up a bit higher to get rid of the hand numbness.
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Old 09-19-14, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by DrPangloss View Post
but my impression so far is that I am a bit stretched out, and there's a bit of weight on my hands.
That's my exact issue too, and I'm riding a 52cm one at around 5'9" with normal-ish proportions. Hopefully if I do switch to a Saga, those issues would be rectified.
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Old 09-19-14, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by J.C. Koto View Post
Not so much a position on kickstands per se but on installing them on thin-walled chainstay tubes.

Also, the LHT has a spoke-holder welded to the non-drive side chainstay that interferes with the installation of a rear-mount kickstand.
I'm sure I'll get the flames for this, but that's just a crappy design for both reasons stated above.
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Old 09-19-14, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by DrPangloss View Post
I'm still getting used to the bike, but my impression so far is that I am a bit stretched out, and there's a bit of weight on my hands. I just got a stem raiser so I can push my bars up a bit higher to get rid of the hand numbness.
If Surly could figure out a way to make money selling spacers they'd really have something. (See also: the pic of my LHT.)

But, you know, level top tubes are just so aesthetically pleasing.
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Old 09-19-14, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
But, you know, level top tubes are just so aesthetically pleasing.
I'm pretty darn sure that the lack of head-tube in the LHT is because of compromises on the part of Surly to keep the top-tube mostly level. The Saga has a sloping top-tube, and it doesn't look quite as 'classic', but it fits most people better, is more comfortable for touring, and will have less flex since there's less spacers.

I really Soma had a disc Saga when I bought my DT, would have saved me a lot of headache (and neck-ache) and a few hundred dollars...
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Old 09-19-14, 11:49 AM
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I had an LHT for years (stolen three years ago ), and never put a kickstand on it. As for Surly's reasoning behind not putting a kickstand plate on it, it's their design and they made the bike they wanted. I've done a few tours, one or two with a kickstand (before I had my LHT) and others without. I didn't really miss it; a single-leg kickstand isn't too useful in my experience, and the double-leg versions were always far too pricey for me.

Originally Posted by dwinks View Post
I'm leaning toward the LHT actually being a bit too 'racey' and leaned over. I've got my bars at the top of the steerer and wouldn't mind them a wee bit higher.
Doesn't compute for me, but that's why there are so many different bikes out there.

Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
If Surly could figure out a way to make money selling spacers they'd really have something. (See also: the pic of my LHT.)

But, you know, level top tubes are just so aesthetically pleasing.
I feel like this has come up before. The Surlys I've had (I still own a Cross-Check) have not required crazy-tall piles of spacers. Even my LHT only had an inch and half or so of spacers before I realized I was more comfortable with the stem and bar a bit below the saddle, rather than above it. At which point I had even fewer spacers underneath the stem. Like I just said, thank goodness that there are lots of bikes out there whose designers have made different decisions about the geometry. The headtube heights preferred by Surly aren't a design flaw. The Surly frames I've had fit me GREAT, because I need a relatively low head tube relative to the size of the frame. There are lots of other people like me out there. It doesn't work for everyone, but for those of us who prefer it, it's really excellent, as it can be difficult to find bikes that don't have the headtube too high. And yeah, I like the look of a level top tube, too, so that makes it even better .
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