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Old 12-10-20, 10:47 AM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by jack pot View Post
...the context is ameriKa today and it IS a CUT & DRIED & OBVIOUS & SIMPLISTIC & CRUDE example of WHITE race humor in the context of today's fractured ameriKa ...
I was referring to how the meme would be read differently if it were Montana and, say, Don Majkowski (I'm from Green Bay). The context of racism in this country is shockingly clear. I did a lot of reading this year, I would encourage others to do the same. I also talked to some black friends and acquaintances about how they're treated here in Wisconsin. A friend of mine described having weapons drawn on him by cops multiple times for trumped up traffic violationsómostly in Milwaukee. They're routinely followed in shops, have to put up with unbelievable crap at work, etc. And if they respond they are somehow 'aggressive' or 'political.' I was ashamed of my community. And go ahead and look at the stats, racism is literally killing people every day because of public health outcomes, police violence, 'black-on-black' violence that stems from poverty that stems from systemic racism. There's the old argument about nature vs. nurture; and the truth is that it's both. And this society is much more nurturing to white people than anyone. This is what's meant by white privilege and not to acknowledge just makes you a dick. All lives won't matter until we treat all people like their lives matter just as much as white people's. We don't do that.
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Old 12-10-20, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by jack pot View Post
..... I paint what I see you can call a white icon guy asking a black activist guy to do a menial task a politically neutral NFL meme and post that ever since Kap opened his mouth you aint watching ameriKa's favorite game > why, because Kap didn't' wash a car... if it is NOT a WHITE racist meme what is it ??? you may think you are race neutral but guys like you might as well wear sheets in public because there aint a black man in America who would think that the Montana or Rice memes are not exactly what i said they are : white hate humor ............................... old white folks rarely get it because it was mostly them that caused it ................ as for "ameriKa" if you aint got it by now it's too late to start
Oh my goodness this is filled with misdirected vile hate.

- I watch the NFL all the time. I have never even thought about no longer watching it. You seem to confuse me with...well the opposite of me.
- I have no issue with Kap kneeling. I have no issue with Kap talking about police brutality, systemic racism, or any other issues. He has been factually incorrect more than a few times and I dont like that, but the reason I dont like it is it gives people the opportunity to dismiss him and these important issues. They can say 'he doesnt even know what he is talking about'. But I think him speaking up, in general, is great. The same applies for any other sports figures- they are seen as role models for youth so if NBA, NFL, etc players want to speak up on issues of inequality, that is fantastic by me.
- Saying I should wear a sheet over my head just because I viewed a meme as being about accomplishment instead of only about race is a terrible thing to say.
- Your dismissive attitude is quite clear. You took the time to equate me to a klansman, but you wont explain why you spell America with a lowercase 'a' and an uppercase 'K'? That doesnt make sense to me. Its only too late to explain it to me because you arbitrarily decided so.


This entire time, I have discussed that the meme wasnt obviously racist to me. It was called obviously racist and I initiated conversation because it wasnt obvious to me. I find it interesting that two people can interpret something differently and the initial focus of art or pop culture can be on two different things(success or race, in this instance) and wanted to discuss that. From that initial post, it has now devolved into me being equated to a klansman.
Goodness, this is mindboggling.
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Old 12-10-20, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
Oh my goodness this is filled with misdirected vile hate.

- I watch the NFL all the time. I have never even thought about no longer watching it. You seem to confuse me with...well the opposite of me.
- I have no issue with Kap kneeling. I have no issue with Kap talking about police brutality, systemic racism, or any other issues. He has been factually incorrect more than a few times and I dont like that, but the reason I dont like it is it gives people the opportunity to dismiss him and these important issues. They can say 'he doesnt even know what he is talking about'. But I think him speaking up, in general, is great. The same applies for any other sports figures- they are seen as role models for youth so if NBA, NFL, etc players want to speak up on issues of inequality, that is fantastic by me.
- Saying I should wear a sheet over my head just because I viewed a meme as being about accomplishment instead of only about race is a terrible thing to say.
- Your dismissive attitude is quite clear. You took the time to equate me to a klansman, but you wont explain why you spell America with a lowercase 'a' and an uppercase 'K'? That doesnt make sense to me. Its only too late to explain it to me because you arbitrarily decided so.


This entire time, I have discussed that the meme wasnt obviously racist to me. It was called obviously racist and I initiated conversation because it wasnt obvious to me. I find it interesting that two people can interpret something differently and the initial focus of art or pop culture can be on two different things(success or race, in this instance) and wanted to discuss that. From that initial post, it has now devolved into me being equated to a klansman.
Goodness, this is mindboggling.
... well you and Opie and Aunt Bea can whistle Dixie on the front porch and bewilderingly wonder how can Americans think bad of me because I like Joe more than Kap while your ameriKan confederates keep on producing this race hate ad nauseam with your tacit but nevertheless open acceptance of this crap as artor pop culture........... I am against systemic white ignorance of black reality which your posts irrespective of what you say embody to the nth degree ................you are ameriKan through and through and until you realize how and what this means you will never be able to make America a better place for all, the operative word being ALL. Learn what it is to be an ameriKan and you will know who you are. Not until you know who you are can you come to be an American
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Old 12-10-20, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Mogens View Post
I was referring to how the meme would be read differently if it were Montana(ROGERS) and, say, Don Majkowski (FARVE) (I'm from Green Bay). The context of racism in this country is shockingly clear. I did a lot of reading this year, I would encourage others to do the same. I also talked to some black friends and acquaintances about how they're treated here in Wisconsin. A friend of mine described having weapons drawn on him by cops multiple times for trumped up traffic violationsómostly in Milwaukee. They're routinely followed in shops, have to put up with unbelievable crap at work, etc. And if they respond they are somehow 'aggressive' or 'political.' I was ashamed of my community. And go ahead and look at the stats, racism is literally killing people every day because of public health outcomes, police violence, 'black-on-black' violence that stems from poverty that stems from systemic racism. There's the old argument about nature vs. nurture; and the truth is that it's both. And this society is much more nurturing to white people than anyone. This is what's meant by white privilege and not to acknowledge just makes you a dick. All lives won't matter until we treat all people like their lives matter just as much as white people's. We don't do that.
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Old 12-10-20, 01:26 PM
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I try to give people the benefit of the doubt because it’s impossible to really know who people are in online forums, but yeah, I think Jack Pot has your number. We all got a healthy serving of racism with our Saturday morning cartoons, Mad Magazines, breakfast, etc. When you really start looking around, it is pervasive. “Woke” gets thrown around like a pejorative, but that really is how it felt to me. When you finally get the sense of the size and the shape of the thing....

I don’t think you’re a klansmen, but unless you’re fighting racism you’re allowing it to grow uncontested. There is no such thing as not being racist.
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Old 12-10-20, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Mogens View Post
I try to give people the benefit of the doubt because it’s impossible to really know who people are in online forums, but yeah, I think Jack Pot has your number. We all got a healthy serving of racism with our Saturday morning cartoons, Mad Magazines, breakfast, etc. When you really start looking around, it is pervasive. “Woke” gets thrown around like a pejorative, but that really is how it felt to me. When you finally get the sense of the size and the shape of the thing....

I don’t think you’re a klansmen, but unless you’re fighting racism you’re allowing it to grow uncontested. There is no such thing as not being racist.
The irony here is just tough to handle its so big. On another forum, i am constantly called woke. Here, im a klansman because I didn't look for racism and instead saw the message as about accomplishment.

Again, I am on the board and active mentor of a teen non-profit that serves local youth. The majority come from socioeconomically disadvantaged homes and probably 60% of the kids identify as POC. I spend hundreds of hours with them over 5 months and we go through multie awareness and sensitivity training classes each year to help reduce implicit bias, and improve connection/communication with the kinds.

Instead of simply reading some books this year to better understand why people are passed, I actively work to improve my community.

You think that Joe guy has my number??
- he accused me of no longer watching the nfl because of Kap, which is incorrect.
- he called me a confederate, which is incorrect.
- he likened me to a klansman(seriously, how is this acceptable?), which is incorrect.

I am completely supportive of Kap kneeling, of BLM on the NBA floor, of corporate inclusivity training, of an increased focus on hiring POC as well as other protected classes, etc etc etc..

I simply saw an accomplished NFL qb insulting an unaccomplished NFL qb from that team. And because of that, I am apparently a Confederate klansman.
wow.


Edited to add- I'm out on this thread. I'll continue to work to improve my community(we have a youth team zoom call tonight, actually), continue to learn and work to better understand barriers that affect others, and know that I am trying hard to directly help improve the lives of others.

Last edited by mstateglfr; 12-10-20 at 04:27 PM.
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Old 12-10-20, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by jack pot View Post
ameriKa
Nothing makes people lend credibility to your arguments and want to pay more attention than making it a point to insult their country and/or identity.
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Old 12-10-20, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
The irony here is just tough to handle its so big. On another forum, i am constantly called woke. Here, im a klansman because I didn't look for racism and instead saw the message as about accomplishment.
Could be you'll never read this, but I wanted to respond. First, I explicitly said that I didn't think you were a klansman, you're conflating my post with another. But I do agree with jack pot that you're missing the point which means that you still haven't realized the full extent of racism in our society. Second, you don't know me or what I do in my community, so I really don't know why you're comfortable making factual assumptions about that. The reason that I care about this issue is because of what I have done and seen in my community and wanting to do it better. Actively denouncing racism when it's clearly visible is part of that. Last year I was on four boards, three of them directly related to youth education and development. So, great, I applaud you, but none of us are absolved simply by doing some things that are good. This year I am in grad school and starting a new business, so I've stepped back from community involvements. Third, individual actions and ideas can be racist or anti-racist. Doing some things that are anti-racist doesn't mean that you're not capable of doing other things that are racist. I suspect most people do some of each every day. I think it's probably going to take generations to undo the damage our country did to itself by supporting slavery and the racist culture that grew out of it. I would hope that that's work you would support.
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Old 12-10-20, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by bbbean View Post
Nothing makes people lend credibility to your arguments and want to pay more attention than making it a point to insult their country and/or identity.
.... if you learn the difference you would know that America is being assaulted by ameriKans
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Old 12-11-20, 11:14 AM
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The way this thread has devolved from being about football during a pandemic into a rant about racism in America is why we can't have nice things. I applaud mstateglfr for attempting to keep the conversation civil but the more "woke" contributors here won't allow it. The usual result is insults or name calling (Opie and Aunt Bea, ameriKan) to those who are less "woke." Whenever you try to personally diminish your opposition in a discussion you weaken your position instead.

Also, the definition of the concocted word ameriKan may not be what the user thinks it is. I had to google it since I'm not as "woke" as others here appear to be.
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Old 12-11-20, 11:37 AM
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I’m glad I’m a South Texan because all white and hispanic people get along because we are all Catholic and drunk I have many Hispanic grandmothers aka abuela that adopted me as their mio aka my son. Always gave me delicious food and made sure I was ok. I guess what I’m trying to say we are one people down here. Sure there are pockets of racism but it’s not tolerated by white or hispanic people. Doesn’t make any sense. Football is religion. If you are a crummy QB you will wash the good QB’s car that is the law.
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Old 12-11-20, 11:38 AM
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cool
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Old 12-11-20, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Hondo Gravel View Post
Iím glad Iím a South Texan because all white and hispanic people get along because we are all Catholic and drunk I have many Hispanic grandmothers aka abuela that adopted me as their mio aka my son. Always gave me delicious food and made sure I was ok. I guess what Iím trying to say we are one people down here. Sure there are pockets of racism but itís not tolerated by white or hispanic people. Doesnít make any sense. Football is religion. If you are a crummy QB you will wash the good QBís car that is the law.
Football is religion in Texas and should be judged as such.

I can remember being in a Chinese restaurant in Houston in the 80s and people who didn't know each other, seated at separate tables, got into a yelling and screaming argument over the relative merits of competing QBs. Very bizarre.
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Old 12-11-20, 11:59 AM
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The CFL is Canadian religion Calgary Stampeders and Molson beer. Now what about hockey? Hockey is the official religion of Canada. The second string of a hockey team washes all the starting players cars.
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Old 12-11-20, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Hondo Gravel View Post
The CFL is Canadian religion Calgary Stampeders and Molson beer. Now what about hockey? Hockey is the official religion of Canada. The second string of a hockey team washes all the starting players cars.
I've been a Stampeders fan since I was 10 years old. But I dont know if the CFL is going to survive the pandemic. They cancelled their season this year, which looks smart in retrospect.

Hockey is definitely a religion, I'm just not happy about subsidizizng billionaires to build new arenas.
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Old 12-11-20, 01:29 PM
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Not Canadian but i grew up in hockey country. Home to one of the six teams of Canadians (when there were only six teams and all the players were Canadian). My hero - Bobby Orr. I have seen maybe one equal to him on ice skates, never better. (Kurt Browning, the figure skater. Another complete natural on skates.)

My brother lives in Amherst, MA. There is a store 25 minutes away that sells hockey equipment, Nothing else. Open year 'round. 2 floors. There are so many rinks in Amherst it might be easier to count the houses. (Well, no, but ... ) Many rinks open year 'round and have ice time booked nearly 24-7. And every rink has an old Zamboni driver who does perfect 4-wheel power slides the envy of the best stock car drivers (only at 10 mph!). I used to play goalie. I got to be the first on the still wet ice and see their perfect work around the nets every day. Watching the west coast Zamboni drivers now? They're hacks. Comedy.
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Old 12-11-20, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by jack pot View Post
.... if you learn the difference you would know that America is being assaulted by ameriKans
The good old fundamentalist paradigm; "If you don't understand it the way I do, you don't understand it."

Once again, if you want people to listen and consider your arguments, it is helpful to avoid alienating and insulting them.

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Old 01-04-21, 03:59 PM
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great wildcard weekend ahead but will the Browns, Bills, et al or Covid decide the winners
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Old 01-04-21, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Hondo Gravel View Post
Iím glad Iím a South Texan because all white and hispanic people get along because we are all Catholic and drunk I have many Hispanic grandmothers aka abuela that adopted me as their mio aka my son. Always gave me delicious food and made sure I was ok. I guess what Iím trying to say we are one people down here. Sure there are pockets of racism but itís not tolerated by white or hispanic people. Doesnít make any sense. Football is religion. If you are a crummy QB you will wash the good QBís car that is the law.
Asi mismo compadre...
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Old 01-04-21, 04:22 PM
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Washington football club will win the super bowl the first losing team to do it. Going in at 7-9 ...
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Old 01-04-21, 05:07 PM
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Hondo, the Seattle Seahawks coach came up with a plan that might be unstoppable. Actually it is just a little inside competition. Coach Carroll challenged each unit (receivers, line, etc,) to a competition to be the most COVID clean unit on the team. Not get sick, adhere to sanctions, be fully traceable, etc. The team has embraced the challenge. I call this a stroke of genius.
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Old 01-05-21, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
Hondo, the Seattle Seahawks coach came up with a plan that might be unstoppable. Actually it is just a little inside competition. Coach Carroll challenged each unit (receivers, line, etc,) to a competition to be the most COVID clean unit on the team. Not get sick, adhere to sanctions, be fully traceable, etc. The team has embraced the challenge. I call this a stroke of genius.
...as usual the Browns coach is the last to learn ................. looks like Steelers are a lock
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Old 01-05-21, 01:41 PM
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Well, I have to hand it to the NFL for at least completing the regular season. It wasn't always pretty. What a crappy year to have the Superbowl in my city.
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Old 01-05-21, 04:18 PM
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Cleveland will have their B team going against Pittsburgh. 8-9 players on COVID protocol and the coach is out to.
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Old 01-08-21, 09:39 AM
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Closed for politics.

The sporting aspects of football can be discussed in Foo. Thank you!
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