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Viral mutations may cause another ‘very, very bad’ COVID-19 wave

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Viral mutations may cause another ‘very, very bad’ COVID-19 wave

 
Old 01-05-21, 10:46 PM
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wgscott
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Viral mutations may cause another ‘very, very bad’ COVID-19 wave

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Old 01-05-21, 10:47 PM
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The one in South Africa looks even worse.

CNBC

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Old 01-07-21, 11:01 AM
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If we bail out of the World Health Organization, these will just go away!!!
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Old 01-07-21, 11:18 AM
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another mutation,

total lockdown maybe inevitable.
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Old 01-07-21, 01:49 PM
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Viral mutations may cause another ‘very, very bad’ COVID-19 wave
Apparently, the hope is with the mRNA type vaccines coming out that it'll handle a very wide range of mutations on the thing. (Can't recall where I read that; one of the research journals, in the past 3-4mos or so.)

It's going to take quite awhile to vaccinate a majority of the globe's population, so who knows when it'll be able to curb transmission rate.

I'm sure the vaccine makers and other virologists around the world are examining exactly this question, as the various mutations are found. I hope it's all covered. Even if it turns out to be a once-annually type vaccination program, like some other things are.

It's going to be a bumpy couple of years, I think. Perhaps longer than that.
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Old 01-07-21, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Clyde1820 View Post
Apparently, the hope is with the mRNA type vaccines coming out that it'll handle a very wide range of mutations on the thing. (Can't recall where I read that; one of the research journals, in the past 3-4mos or so.)

It's going to take quite awhile to vaccinate a majority of the globe's population, so who knows when it'll be able to curb transmission rate.

I'm sure the vaccine makers and other virologists around the world are examining exactly this question, as the various mutations are found. I hope it's all covered. Even if it turns out to be a once-annually type vaccination program, like some other things are.

It's going to be a bumpy couple of years, I think. Perhaps longer than that.
mRNA vaccines are unpredictable since they are brand new and no one knows how they will react in the long run and how long the acquired immunity will last for. Plus the only way to transport these vaccines is via a specially refrigerator that keeps the temperature constantly below 80 degrees C. So when it comes to globalization of these types of vaccines it's highly unlikely that they will work. I am more interested in the results of the AstroZenecca trails.
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Old 01-07-21, 02:58 PM
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2021 is going to suck canal water. I don’t see reschedules concerts from 2020 to 2021 happening. I hope I am wrong. I guess I will lift weights, rides bike and drink beer. And stay away from Bubba and Bubbette as much as possible. At almost 53 years on this planet I’ve never seen the gutter trash come to life like this. I’m jamming to Megadeth right now so things are ok.
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Old 01-07-21, 04:43 PM
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Cant you see what is happening. Just after vaccination started, they said there are other mutations, and these mutations simultaneously appeared in a number of countries at the same time. How convenient. They know people who have been vaccinated will still get infected. When people get infected, they can say it is because of these mutations.

I know, most people believe everything they hear on the media, and I expect some hostile reactions to my comments.

Vaccines are among the most profitable of all things drug companies make. They are making more money from this than you and I will ever see.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.
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Old 01-07-21, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by alo View Post
Cant you see what is happening. Just after vaccination started, they said there are other mutations, and these mutations simultaneously appeared in a number of countries at the same time. How convenient. They know people who have been vaccinated will still get infected. When people get infected, they can say it is because of these mutations.

I know, most people believe everything they hear on the media, and I expect some hostile reactions to my comments.

Vaccines are among the most profitable of all things drug companies make. They are making more money from this than you and I will ever see.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.
Or, maybe the virus does what viruses do (and what people have been saying all along that they might do ... and what flu viruses do as well) and has, in fact, mutated?

No ... so much easier to believe that thousands of researchers working hard to save lives (including yours) are stupid gnomes who don't realizing they are being duped and manipulated. I mean ... they are smart enough to defeat a virus, but not as smart as you, eh? Or even more believable ... they KNOW they are being duped, and are willing to sacrifice their life and their loved ones in favor of some big conspiracy.

Seriously ... you should be ashamed of yourself. Your nonsense is going to believed by gullible people, and some people will die because of it.
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Old 01-07-21, 09:51 PM
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No cure for cancer, no cure for the common cold. It took almost 600 years to eradicate yellow fever, and almost 200 to beat polio. But this time around, scientists somehow beat an RNA virus in under 9 months-- and mind you, RNA viruses mutate far faster than other viruses-- up to a million times faster.

So yeah, we've apparently got a vaccine for the initial strain of COVID-19, a virus whose effects we don't even fully understand (how come some people are fully asymptomatic, some go on a vent, and some get to be infected for the "longhaul" ) but are fully aware of it's ability to mutate... yet clamor for a vaccine that went through rapidized texting like nothing we've ever seen in the past.

Death rates and infection rates probably aren't going to drop after the first few million doses are administered, and now the pharma industry has a tidy explanation as to why.
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Old 01-07-21, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
...

Death rates and infection rates probably aren't going to drop after the first few million doses are administered, and now the pharma industry has a tidy explanation as to why.
The first few million doses aren't enough to do more than spare some of the elderly and front line workers. The rest of us are going to go about our virus spreading ways. Yeah. even if this virus works perfectly, a whole lot more people will be dying every day than now for quite a whileunless we change our habits.
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Old 01-07-21, 10:19 PM
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DrIsotope We haven't beat the virus yet, unfortunately, although hopefully the vaccine will make the difference. Different RNA viruses mutate with very different rates. SARS-CoV-2 actually mutates rather slowly compared to (for example) HIV. The SARS-CoV-2 transcription/replication complex exhibits rather high fidelity, complete with a proof-reader subunit. Given that the genome is one very long (30kb) single-stranded +mRNA, this is crucial for its viability, but results in rather slower mutation and evolution when compared with other RNA viruses such as influenza, which has multiple copies of rather shorter genomic RNAs, and HIV, an RNA retrovirus that is diploid. The RNA viruses with multiple copies of their genomes typically have recombinases (and integrase, in the case of retroviruses), which result in a genome that evolves much more quickly. My virologist wife's main worry at this point is that the roll-out of the vaccine is going so slowly that if it is less effective against one or more of the new strains, partially vaccinated populations will just select for it more rapidly.

@lysagrey mRNA vaccines have been around for awhile, but this is the first they have been deployed in large scale for human populations. They actually don't work that much differently from conventional vaccines. This is slightly over-simplified, but basically instead of having part of the spike protein (or fragment) injected into your bloodstream for primary antibodies to bind to and initiate B-cell proliferation, instead an mRNA that makes it into a cell will be translated into the same protein fragment that will then be secreted from the cell into the bloodstream. So it works in a rather similar way, but actually has some major advantages. (In this case, the first approach caused very toxic primary responses, whereas the mRNA vaccine winds up being a more gentle approach to the same goal.) Admittedly I have a bias as an RNA scientist, but I really think this is the future for vaccines.

The other advantage of mRNA vaccines is, as @Clyde1820 mentions, that new versions can be created extremely quickly. Say the spike protein mutates in such a way as to escape the current vaccine, you just make a new sequence of the mRNA vaccine in your next batch that codes for the new variant, and off you go. In theory you could do this in hours or days.

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Old 01-07-21, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by alo View Post
Cant you see what is happening. Just after vaccination started, they said there are other mutations, and these mutations simultaneously appeared in a number of countries at the same time. How convenient. They know people who have been vaccinated will still get infected. When people get infected, they can say it is because of these mutations.

I know, most people believe everything they hear on the media, and I expect some hostile reactions to my comments.

Vaccines are among the most profitable of all things drug companies make. They are making more money from this than you and I will ever see.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.
Sure. You're among the precious few thinking for themselves, right?

Do you have any idea how vain and out of touch that sounds?

But this is exactly how cults evolve. By appealing to people's vanity and desire to feel special, part of something secret and exclusive. It's always about some secret handshake, or magical underwear, or rituals at a candlelit altar, or coded language the true meaning of which is obscure to the profane but profound to the enlightened ones.

Funny how these things always evolve and ultimately devolve the same way: usually into a sex or death cult, sometimes both. At some point in the 1960s Carlos Castaneda decided to abandon a methodical approach to his anthropology study and cooked up elaborate fictions about a mythical brujo named Don Juan, who supposedly taught Castaneda the secrets of Yaqui sorcery, including the uses of hallucinogenic substances.

Later it all turned out to be 95% fiction, with some basis in people Castaneda met in Mexico who shared some anecdotes. But by the 1980s Castaneda started falling for his own BS, formed a cult associated with "Tensegrity," which basically turned out the same way every quasi-religious cult turns out: a way to lure in gullible young people, especially attractive young women, for sex under the guise of "enlightenment."

But even in the midst of this elaborate fiction, Castaneda offered a few insights that echoed the "wisdom" of other ancient philosophies. One of those was the concept of "seeing," which roughly translates into today's wokeness.

The difference is that the mythical Don Juan warned Castaneda that "seeing" alone is only a step in the journey and could be a trap if the person becomes complacent and stops the journey at that point. Same as all these woke-folk who believe they've discovered the mysteries to life, the universe and everything. And anyone who disagrees is among the profane, the infidels, and probably part of the Deep State or a commie.

But go ahead, keep repeating that "Think for yourself" mantra that's got you hypnotized right now.

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Old 01-07-21, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by alo View Post
Cant you see what is happening. Just after vaccination started, they said there are other mutations, and these mutations simultaneously appeared in a number of countries at the same time. How convenient. They know people who have been vaccinated will still get infected. When people get infected, they can say it is because of these mutations.

I know, most people believe everything they hear on the media, and I expect some hostile reactions to my comments.

Vaccines are among the most profitable of all things drug companies make. They are making more money from this than you and I will ever see.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.
Is that you, Q-anon Shaman?

1. We don't yet know if the new variants of the virus can evade the vaccine. The SA one does have me worried, based on the current, sketchy, reports, but there is not yet any evidence that the vaccine will be less effective. What it does mean in that the more infectious form might require a more effective and compulsory vaccination strategy. (Meanwhile, I will be more than happy to have yours.)

2. Vaccines are among the least profitable of all things drug companies make, which is a huge problem. Your propaganda is 100% incorrect about this (not that you exhibit any concern regarding mere facts.) Drugs that are the most profitable for drug companies are ones like Gleevec, which costs $120K/year and people are on it for the rest of their lives. Vaccines are often one or two shots, and cost less than a Rene Herse tire.

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Old 01-08-21, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted by alo View Post
Cant you see what is happening. Just after vaccination started, they said there are other mutations, and these mutations simultaneously appeared ...
It's been mutating since it was first seen (actually, that's how life rolls, on this planet, of course). There are more than a half-dozen mutations documented, along with the last couple since December.

One write-up from back in July: https://www.frontiersin.org/articles...020.01800/full .
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Old 01-08-21, 03:03 AM
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Yeah, I suspect there have been many mutations all along and some people have developed limited resistance after exposure -- but only to that particular strain.

That seems like a plausible scenario for closed system groups of people -- families, coworkers, acquaintances, neighbors within a closed building, who have either agreed to limit their outside contacts, or simply don't get out much.

I'm betting that's why my apartment complex has had few or no COVID deaths. This is a high risk group -- all over age 60, many with disabilities, some with comorbidities such as obesity, diabetes, cardiovascular disease, etc. I fully expected half the building to be wiped out. Didn't happen. But these folks don't get out much or socialize outside their small groups of neighbors.

The high risk exposures appear to be the super spreader events where people encounter multiple minor variations and their immune system is overwhelmed.

In my city -- according to friends who are health care professionals, many on the front line -- the super spreader events appeared to be within families and close friends, who got together with a dozen or more people a few times this year for birthdays, Independence Day, Thanksgiving, Christmas. But because some family members traveled they may have carried mutated strains that overwhelmed the immune systems of their older and vulnerable family and friends. In a few cases survivors of the victims gave heartfelt apologies on the news, even on TV, urging others to not make the same mistakes.

It's made zero impact on most people. They all think it won't happen to them. Including prominent local politicians who made many high risk appearances, often unprotected, and got sick and recovered. But they didn't mention the older more vulnerable people in their circles of contacts who did get sick and died from COVID-19. It just doesn't seem to penetrate that attitude of "Well, everyone has to die sometime, and, besides, they were old... like, 90... or 80... or 70... or 60... it's like the flu... or they didn't really die of 'COVID,' they died from pneumonia, or blah blah blah..."
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Old 01-08-21, 09:37 AM
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More on the SA strain: https://www.bbc.com/news/health-55534727
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Old 01-08-21, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by alo View Post
I expect some hostile reactions to my comments.
.
this kind of crap should be removed by mods. not funny anymore. never was.
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Old 01-08-21, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
this kind of crap should be removed by mods. not funny anymore. never was.
They far more quickly removed the thread I made mocking one of his (it is almost always a "he") crazy conspiracy nutjob conoravirus-denial anti-vax threads.

Psychos and promulgators of fascist conspiracy theories seem to get a free pass.

People having the temerity to call them on it do not.

#Priorities

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Old 01-08-21, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
No cure for cancer, no cure for the common cold. It took almost 600 years to eradicate yellow fever, and almost 200 to beat polio. But this time around, scientists somehow beat an RNA virus in under 9 months-- and mind you, RNA viruses mutate far faster than other viruses-- up to a million times faster.

So yeah, we've apparently got a vaccine for the initial strain of COVID-19, a virus whose effects we don't even fully understand (how come some people are fully asymptomatic, some go on a vent, and some get to be infected for the "longhaul" ) but are fully aware of it's ability to mutate... yet clamor for a vaccine that went through rapidized texting like nothing we've ever seen in the past.

Death rates and infection rates probably aren't going to drop after the first few million doses are administered, and now the pharma industry has a tidy explanation as to why.
600 years sounds like a long time to work on eradicating yellow fever, but in reality for most of that time there was no work being done. Hell, doctors thought there were 4 fluids in our body during this period- they werent exactly working on the eradication of diseases since viruses werent even discovered as existing until the end of the 1800s.
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Old 01-08-21, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by alo View Post
Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.

Think for yourself.
Isn't that what those folks did at the Trump rally at the Capitol, Wednesday? I mean of course they had their leader do the thinking for them and his brain is the best, man woman place camera T.V.. I guess they also listened to some random conspiracy generator which has been wrong every time but you know you gotta think for yourself. Of course not to the point you actually use your brain capabilities to generate your own thoughts, that is wrong.
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