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soma cazadero tubeless success so far

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soma cazadero tubeless success so far

Old 04-03-17, 11:46 AM
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soma cazadero tubeless success so far

I removed my tubes and poured maybe 2-3 ounces of orange seal in each tire. This is on stans grail 700c rims that were previously tubeless. I simply put tubes in when I bought these tires using the original stans tape. The tires fit tight as before and it took about 30-35 psi to seat the beads. I rode around a couple blocks with 45 psi in each and then dropped each have tire down to around 30 psi and went for a spin. So far so good but I don't have any miles on it this way (just around a few city blocks). I will try to get on a ride when I get a chance and report back. This is my first set of non tubeless rated tires that I have mounted tubeless so if anyone else has attempted this, what should or should I not be wary of at first?

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Old 04-04-17, 09:01 AM
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Well although I haven't had a chance to go ride yet I did check my tire pressure this morning before I left for work and it seems as if sitting overnight they have lost about 10 psi. I think that's weird as I did go for a ride around town to get the sealant circulated through the tires and into all the cracks and crevices. It seems like somewhere I remember reading that these tires had a little bit of a porous sidewall but I don't know whether that's true or not.
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Old 04-04-17, 11:12 AM
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I'm hoping to run Cazaderos tubeless in the very near future so eager to learn more about how it works out for you. Also just curious about your impression of the tire overall. Keep us posted!
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Old 04-04-17, 11:43 AM
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The tire seems like a pretty decent one. It rolls really good on pavement because of the smooth center strip.

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Old 04-04-17, 12:24 PM
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What size(width) tire are you using? I'm shocked at the pressure you're running.
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Old 04-04-17, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
What size(width) tire are you using? I'm shocked at the pressure you're running.
Pretty sure they're 42s.
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Old 04-04-17, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by trail_monkey View Post
I think that's weird as I did go for a ride around town to get the sealant circulated through the tires and into all the cracks and crevices. It seems like somewhere I remember reading that these tires had a little bit of a porous sidewall but I don't know whether that's true or not.
I think the Cazaderos are made by Panaracer. My attempts to go tubeless on Panaracer-made BG Rock & Road tires (nearly identical from what I can tell except for the tread) ran into similar problems. Through various degrees of fussing with them, I eventually got 3 of 4 to hold pressure, but I eventually got tired of fooling with it and went back to tubes.

To seal the sidewalls, I had to let the wheel sit horizontal (on an open bucket to keep it level) for 15 minutes on each side at about 60 PSI. Sealing the bead just took riding (the bumpier the better), though I did have to add more sealant to one of them before it finally sealed up. A little soapy water in a spray bottle is your friend for pinpointing leaks.
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Old 04-04-17, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Kopsis View Post
I think the Cazaderos are made by Panaracer. My attempts to go tubeless on Panaracer-made BG Rock & Road tires (nearly identical from what I can tell except for the tread) ran into similar problems. Through various degrees of fussing with them, I eventually got 3 of 4 to hold pressure, but I eventually got tired of fooling with it and went back to tubes.

To seal the sidewalls, I had to let the wheel sit horizontal (on an open bucket to keep it level) for 15 minutes on each side at about 60 PSI. Sealing the bead just took riding (the bumpier the better), though I did have to add more sealant to one of them before it finally sealed up. A little soapy water in a spray bottle is your friend for pinpointing leaks.
I can't see any reason why they shouldn't hold air. They seated the bead just like any other tire and aired up fine and the sealant once it's sloshing around inside there as your riding around and doing figure eights ought to catch everything on the inside of that tire. And in response to the other posters question they are 42.
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Old 04-04-17, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by trail_monkey View Post
I can't see any reason why they shouldn't hold air.
Why should they? Aren't Cazaderos only spec'd for tubes? Panaracer had no reason to ensure low permeability and an airtight bead seat.
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Old 04-04-17, 03:12 PM
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Well I didn't have any soapy water but I had some simple green which is pretty foamy. sure as heck the sidewall is too porous and you can see by this video clip that it is leaking air at one location in my gumwall. I think I'm going to go back to inner tubes.


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Old 04-04-17, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by HTupolev View Post
Why should they? Aren't Cazaderos only spec'd for tubes? Panaracer had no reason to ensure low permeability and an airtight bead seat.
I didn't realize not being tubeless compatible had anything to do with permeability. I thought it just had to do with how safely the beads would seat if they would seat at all and stuff like that. Now I know better.
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Old 04-04-17, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by trail_monkey View Post
Well I didn't have any soapy water but I had some simple green which is pretty foamy. sure as heck the sidewall is too porous and you can see by this video clip that it is leaking air at one location in my gumwall. I think I'm going to go back to inner tubes.

https://youtu.be/lgWteOpgxW0

I've had Orange Seal come through the sidewall before. If you keep pumping up the tire and sitting the tire overnight on trash can and alternating they will eventually seal.
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Old 04-04-17, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Planemaker View Post
I've had Orange Seal come through the sidewall before. If you keep pumping up the tire and sitting the tire overnight on trash can and alternating they will eventually seal.
Do you just have to do that one time when the tires are new and then they are permanently "non porous" for good?
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Old 04-04-17, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by trail_monkey View Post
Do you just have to do that one time when the tires are new and then they are permanently "non porous" for good?
Yup

I did that with come Continental Speed non tubeless tires. I had orange dots all over the sidewalls. Once they sealed, I never had an issue again. It just takes patience (pumping up the tire, rotating it and letting it set).

I don't know if it helped but, I pumped the tires up pretty high to force air and sealant through the sidewall.
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Old 04-05-17, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by trail_monkey View Post
Do you just have to do that one time when the tires are new and then they are permanently "non porous" for good?
My BGs continued to "weep" sealant through the sidewalls for a month before I went back to tubes. In one case, I wasn't losing any pressure, but it appeared that sidewall flex while riding would cause pores to open up and re-seal. One of the downsides is that the permanently "tacky" outer sidewalls became dirt magnets. This was with Stan's ... a different sealant might have been more stable, but I was more interested in riding than doing a science project
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Old 04-05-17, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Kopsis View Post
My BGs continued to "weep" sealant through the sidewalls for a month before I went back to tubes. In one case, I wasn't losing any pressure, but it appeared that sidewall flex while riding would cause pores to open up and re-seal. One of the downsides is that the permanently "tacky" outer sidewalls became dirt magnets. This was with Stan's ... a different sealant might have been more stable, but I was more interested in riding than doing a science project
Not sure about Stan's but, my success was with Orange Seal

I might add this was a couple of years ago. With all the great tubeless specific gravel tires out there now, I'm not sure I would go through the trouble again.
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Old 04-05-17, 04:12 PM
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IME, tires with very supple casings can be very difficult to set up tubeless (even if the beads seat properly). As others have mentioned, supple casings are very prone to weeping.
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Old 04-06-17, 09:05 AM
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Disappointing to hear. I'm convinced of the benefits of tubeless for the sort of riding I do -- not just gravel, but light singletrack, 4X4 trails, etc. -- and want a >40mm tire that can still roll decently on the pavement I ride to connect between trails. I guess maybe the 45mm WTB Riddlers. Anybody have any experience on those?
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Old 04-06-17, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by blazin View Post
Disappointing to hear. I'm convinced of the benefits of tubeless for the sort of riding I do -- not just gravel, but light singletrack, 4X4 trails, etc. -- and want a >40mm tire that can still roll decently on the pavement I ride to connect between trails. I guess maybe the 45mm WTB Riddlers. Anybody have any experience on those?
The WTBs would be a good choice. Maxxis' Re-Fuse, while not a knobby, is very capable for a file-tread tire (and is tubeless-ready).
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Old 04-09-17, 02:31 AM
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Shame about the bleeding sealant, I was hoping Cazaderos wouldn't have that problem because they seem like an awesome tire. I wonder if the black sidewall tires behave any differently than the skinwall.
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