Tubeless for gravel - does it make sense?
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Tubeless for gravel - does it make sense?
Hello, I use my CX bike also as gravel bike - replaced Schwalbe X-One Evo to Panaracer GravelKing SK 700x35c last time and can't seal these tires using trezado sealant (before any issues with Schwalbe X-One). Don't know why, maybe to low pressure in first seal Rims are ok - DT460 with two layers of stans tape. I used tubes and it works fine. According to panaracer website, SK 35c whould be tubeless compatible.
I'm not heavy rider - about 74 kg (~163 lb) and I wonder if it makes sense... Yes, with tubless I can use lower pressure, but with that weight... 40-50 PSI is really ok and without punctures. Also - with or without tubeless, I always MUST take a backup tube... So I think tubeless may be not great always - for MTB race, yes of course! But for general riding... not sure.
I'm not heavy rider - about 74 kg (~163 lb) and I wonder if it makes sense... Yes, with tubless I can use lower pressure, but with that weight... 40-50 PSI is really ok and without punctures. Also - with or without tubeless, I always MUST take a backup tube... So I think tubeless may be not great always - for MTB race, yes of course! But for general riding... not sure.
#2
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I went tubeless about 3 weeks ago and I love it. 38 and 43 Panaracer GravelKing SKs on Hunt wheels, 2 layers of Stans tape and Stans sealant. This is my first time using tubeless but setup was super easy and the tyres hold air perfectly.
I use my gravel bike on rougher terrain too, and I can go down to 28-29psi in the front without worrying about pinch punctures.
I don't know if it's running tubeless, or the tyres or the two combined but compared to my tubed 37 Vittoria Voyagers these GKs tubeless feel so good. When I ran the same low pressures in the Voyagers the bike felt super squishy in a bad way, it felt like there was a delay when I turned the handlebars. With the Panaracers I don't have that feeling, but I get the compliance. I happily run 28-29 in the front and 34-35 in the back even on pavement and they roll great.
Haven't had a puncture yet, although I haven't had a puncture in years with tubes either. But that was with mountain bikes and road bikes. Nowadays sometimes i'm "underbiking" a bit with my gravel bike, on one of my recent rides i've felt the front tyre completely bottom out a few times when riding rougher stuff. I'm pretty sure tubeless saved the day.
Personally i'm not sure if i'm ever going to run tubes again. Most good rims and tyres are tubeless anyways, so why not just run them tubeless
I use my gravel bike on rougher terrain too, and I can go down to 28-29psi in the front without worrying about pinch punctures.
I don't know if it's running tubeless, or the tyres or the two combined but compared to my tubed 37 Vittoria Voyagers these GKs tubeless feel so good. When I ran the same low pressures in the Voyagers the bike felt super squishy in a bad way, it felt like there was a delay when I turned the handlebars. With the Panaracers I don't have that feeling, but I get the compliance. I happily run 28-29 in the front and 34-35 in the back even on pavement and they roll great.
Haven't had a puncture yet, although I haven't had a puncture in years with tubes either. But that was with mountain bikes and road bikes. Nowadays sometimes i'm "underbiking" a bit with my gravel bike, on one of my recent rides i've felt the front tyre completely bottom out a few times when riding rougher stuff. I'm pretty sure tubeless saved the day.
Personally i'm not sure if i'm ever going to run tubes again. Most good rims and tyres are tubeless anyways, so why not just run them tubeless
Last edited by Facanh; 04-27-18 at 01:24 AM.
#3
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For gravel I ride tubeless (mtb too) and think it is great. I can't stand tubeless for road bikes though...I think something changes around the 32mm tire width to where the system makes a ton of sense.
I do it on the gravel bike primarily for flat protection and still run my tires in the 30-40 psi range depending on the terrain and find that I don't get burps and the tires never unseat themselves. I have had that happen on a cyclocross course running lower pressures.
I do it on the gravel bike primarily for flat protection and still run my tires in the 30-40 psi range depending on the terrain and find that I don't get burps and the tires never unseat themselves. I have had that happen on a cyclocross course running lower pressures.
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OP, it seems like you are having trouble getting these tires set up tubeless and want permission to use tubes.
Permission granted.
Though if you really want to run them tubeless, there is plenty of info on the 'net that could help solve your problems.
Permission granted.
Though if you really want to run them tubeless, there is plenty of info on the 'net that could help solve your problems.
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Hello, I use my CX bike also as gravel bike - replaced Schwalbe X-One Evo to Panaracer GravelKing SK 700x35c last time and can't seal these tires using trezado sealant (before any issues with Schwalbe X-One). Don't know why, maybe to low pressure in first seal Rims are ok - DT460 with two layers of stans tape. I used tubes and it works fine. According to panaracer website, SK 35c whould be tubeless compatible.
I'm not heavy rider - about 74 kg (~163 lb) and I wonder if it makes sense... Yes, with tubless I can use lower pressure, but with that weight... 40-50 PSI is really ok and without punctures. Also - with or without tubeless, I always MUST take a backup tube... So I think tubeless may be not great always - for MTB race, yes of course! But for general riding... not sure.
I'm not heavy rider - about 74 kg (~163 lb) and I wonder if it makes sense... Yes, with tubless I can use lower pressure, but with that weight... 40-50 PSI is really ok and without punctures. Also - with or without tubeless, I always MUST take a backup tube... So I think tubeless may be not great always - for MTB race, yes of course! But for general riding... not sure.
I have a feeling that if you were able to get the tires to seal you wouldn't feel this way about going tubeless.
That being said, there are plenty of anti-tubeless people here, I'm sure we'll hear from them too.
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#7
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I've reverted to tubes and not looked back. I'm not anti tubeless, it's just that I don't see enough benefit to outweigh the hassle.
#8
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I don't get enough flats to justify the expense but if I get more into the mtb side of things I'll likely have some tubeless in the future. I don't run wide enough tires at low pressure to really worry about pinch flats. Luckily we don't have goatheads or other issues to deal with around here. If I were getting more flats I would definitely be considering it.
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I have WTB tubeless rims and tires 700x40 but rarely get flats so I stick to tubes. Over the years I have become fast at fixing flats. But I see where tubeless would be great I just haven’t converted yet.
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i dont run tubeless, havent run tubeless, and have no plan to run tubeless.
it just isnt an issue. Perhaps i am incredible at picking my line, perhaps im lucky, or perhaps i am delusional as to what real gravel is, but i haven't found myself wanting for tubeless.
i run my tires higher than most everyone here, and weigh more too. That may be part of why i dont care- i dont pinchflat like some would if they ran tubes at absurdly low levels like they do tubeless.
I doubt 25psi is needed/beneficial for me, so its moot as to whether i need tubeless to avoid snakebites.
Ryn em tubed. Run em tubeless. Like most in cycling, its a tradeoff and both options have benefits and drawbacks.
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I made this again today - cleanup tires, cleanup rims... and seal without sealant without problems - added after that.
But... I'm still not sure it's "safe" and ok. Used before on MTB, used last time with Schwalbe X-One and now used on road wheelset with Schwalbe Pro One - it's ok, but I think I still should carry backup tube.
BTW. Tested on 30 PSI front / ~35 PSI rear - maybe more comfort, but difference is not significant. Traction is worse - tires have the tendency to "swim", is not stable.
But... I'm still not sure it's "safe" and ok. Used before on MTB, used last time with Schwalbe X-One and now used on road wheelset with Schwalbe Pro One - it's ok, but I think I still should carry backup tube.
BTW. Tested on 30 PSI front / ~35 PSI rear - maybe more comfort, but difference is not significant. Traction is worse - tires have the tendency to "swim", is not stable.
#12
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I recently picked up an adventure/gravel bike that came with tubeless (38s). I had previously run 28s on my road bike and I didn't hate it. Truthfully the only thing I disliked about tubeless was the significant increase in cost of a pair of tires.
Hutch Sectors circa 2015
Given the mileage I put on them, I would have had to burn through north of a dozen tubes (between both wheels) to offset the premium. Considering how crummy the roads are where I ride, the lower pressure of tubeless was marginally noticeable.
I was pleasantly surprised to see a pair of Specialized 2Bliss tires for only $40/each though (Sawtooth) at my local shop the other day. So I'm glad that less expensive options exist.
I'm a big dude, with my bike (RLT 9 Steel) and panniers I'm pushing 285-290 pounds on the tires so not having to run 100+ psi pressures can be a welcome change when I'll sometimes be in the saddle for 6+ hours during a weekend ride.
Hutch Sectors circa 2015
Given the mileage I put on them, I would have had to burn through north of a dozen tubes (between both wheels) to offset the premium. Considering how crummy the roads are where I ride, the lower pressure of tubeless was marginally noticeable.
I was pleasantly surprised to see a pair of Specialized 2Bliss tires for only $40/each though (Sawtooth) at my local shop the other day. So I'm glad that less expensive options exist.
I'm a big dude, with my bike (RLT 9 Steel) and panniers I'm pushing 285-290 pounds on the tires so not having to run 100+ psi pressures can be a welcome change when I'll sometimes be in the saddle for 6+ hours during a weekend ride.
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I run my gravel rig tubeless. Roadie is tubed.
Seldom had a roadie tubeless seal properly well enough to keep riding (75+PSI). Whereas all my gravel punctures sealed, and most well enough to last 500-1000mi....and fast enough that only one needed a CO2 cart.
As always YMMV.
Seldom had a roadie tubeless seal properly well enough to keep riding (75+PSI). Whereas all my gravel punctures sealed, and most well enough to last 500-1000mi....and fast enough that only one needed a CO2 cart.
As always YMMV.
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I'm not heavy rider - about 74 kg (~163 lb) and I wonder if it makes sense... Yes, with tubless I can use lower pressure, but with that weight... 40-50 PSI is really ok and without punctures. Also - with or without tubeless, I always MUST take a backup tube... So I think tubeless may be not great always - for MTB race, yes of course! But for general riding... not sure.
FWIW, it's not always needed to carry a spare tube. A good friend of mine rides tubeless and hasn't had a flat in so long that he carries nothing and just accepts that he'll walk out in the rare event of a flat on the trail. It's an acceptable risk given our local conditions and the trails we ride.
#15
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They make less sense on skinny high pressure tires but I've pulled several dozen goatheads from my tubeless tires without getting a flat. Yesterday a cactus got stuck to my tire. No fukts were given. Tubeless can be a pain to set up and maintain but it makes riding off road without flats possible.
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I just converted my gravel bike to tubeless...It came with compatible rims, so I figured, "Why not?" It wasn't really that difficult. I don't get many flats, but I am enjoying the worry-free lower psi.
I might go back to tubes eventually, but it's really not a big deal either way.
I might go back to tubes eventually, but it's really not a big deal either way.
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meh- some swear by it, some are ambivalent, and some are strongly against it.
i dont run tubeless, havent run tubeless, and have no plan to run tubeless.
it just isnt an issue. Perhaps i am incredible at picking my line, perhaps im lucky, or perhaps i am delusional as to what real gravel is, but i haven't found myself wanting for tubeless.
i run my tires higher than most everyone here, and weigh more too. That may be part of why i dont care- i dont pinchflat like some would if they ran tubes at absurdly low levels like they do tubeless.
I doubt 25psi is needed/beneficial for me, so its moot as to whether i need tubeless to avoid snakebites.
Ryn em tubed. Run em tubeless. Like most in cycling, its a tradeoff and both options have benefits and drawbacks.
i dont run tubeless, havent run tubeless, and have no plan to run tubeless.
it just isnt an issue. Perhaps i am incredible at picking my line, perhaps im lucky, or perhaps i am delusional as to what real gravel is, but i haven't found myself wanting for tubeless.
i run my tires higher than most everyone here, and weigh more too. That may be part of why i dont care- i dont pinchflat like some would if they ran tubes at absurdly low levels like they do tubeless.
I doubt 25psi is needed/beneficial for me, so its moot as to whether i need tubeless to avoid snakebites.
Ryn em tubed. Run em tubeless. Like most in cycling, its a tradeoff and both options have benefits and drawbacks.
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Tubeless is the only way to fly if you are riding any long miles or distance races. Dirty Kanza used to be a big discussion on how many flats you got, that's not really the case anymore in my experience. Last year the only people who had flats it seemed weren't running tubeless. Any of the Panaracer Gravel Kings, Maxxis Rambler, or any of the newer gravel tubeless tires should be absolutely flawless. Orange Seal Endurance formula is my favorite sealant and I use their tape and valves as well. Other then flat prevention it's much faster to run tubeless at a lower pressure then you'd think. I was told by the Stans Panaracer Team to run about 25-27 psi in my 40c, I weigh about 160lbs.
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Borrowed a friend's wheels this weekend to try a new bike. He has them setup tubed. Two rides this weekend, two flats. You can't tell me tubeless isn't the way to go.
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Amazing ive ridden a handful of thousand miles of gravel with tubes and no flats. I am blessed.
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I was speaking in general terms. Tubeless is like the new clipless pedals. It gets pushed on people more than it ought.
I've tried both ways and can't say that I felt a difference in the ride quality. And I'm already running my gravel tires at as low a pressure as I'd want, because I can go low enough even w/tubes that the tires squirm. As I buy newer bikes and accumulate more tubeless rims, I'll probably drift toward tubeless as a natural result.
I've tried both ways and can't say that I felt a difference in the ride quality. And I'm already running my gravel tires at as low a pressure as I'd want, because I can go low enough even w/tubes that the tires squirm. As I buy newer bikes and accumulate more tubeless rims, I'll probably drift toward tubeless as a natural result.
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I was speaking in general terms. Tubeless is like the new clipless pedals. It gets pushed on people more than it ought.
I've tried both ways and can't say that I felt a difference in the ride quality. And I'm already running my gravel tires at as low a pressure as I'd want, because I can go low enough even w/tubes that the tires squirm. As I buy newer bikes and accumulate more tubeless rims, I'll probably drift toward tubeless as a natural result.
I've tried both ways and can't say that I felt a difference in the ride quality. And I'm already running my gravel tires at as low a pressure as I'd want, because I can go low enough even w/tubes that the tires squirm. As I buy newer bikes and accumulate more tubeless rims, I'll probably drift toward tubeless as a natural result.
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#24
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You can gain some flat prevention with sealant in your tubes.. Use tubeless style rim tape if you are worried about it making a mess.
I am currently tubeless on my hardtail and gravel bike. I like to occasionally switch tires depending on things and being tubeless throws a curve ball in overall "is it worth it" decision. Time will tell but for now I can see myself going back and forth between TL/Tubed or maybe getting a deal on a second set of wheels.
I am currently tubeless on my hardtail and gravel bike. I like to occasionally switch tires depending on things and being tubeless throws a curve ball in overall "is it worth it" decision. Time will tell but for now I can see myself going back and forth between TL/Tubed or maybe getting a deal on a second set of wheels.
Last edited by u235; 05-01-18 at 10:02 AM.
#25
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I resemble and concur with these statements. I'm tubed at the moment.
But since I already went ahead and bought a second wheelset, that set of wheels is set up tubeless with the knobbier tires.
Last edited by athrowawaynic; 05-01-18 at 09:16 AM.