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Cyclocross and Gravelbiking (Recreational) This has to be the most physically intense sport ever invented. It's high speed bicycle racing on a short off road course or riding the off pavement rides on gravel like : "Unbound Gravel". We also have a dedicated Racing forum for the Cyclocross Hard Core Racers.

Dumb question #38

Old 12-16-21, 10:01 AM
  #26  
Fentuz
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Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
newb coming in strong with the heat!
I will just add that in the middle 8 or so cogs on my 2x11 gravel bike, the jumps are smaller than if I had a 1x11. Its sequential, unlike your claim, and its very much real.

I run 48/32 with 11-36. That gives a 121.19 - 24.74 gear inch range.
If I were to run 1x, I would need a 42t ring with an 11-46 cassette to get close to the same range as that would be a 106.18 - 25.29 gear inch range.
.......
my current cassette- 11,12,13,15,17,19,22,25,28,32,36
an available wide range cassette- 11,13,15,18,21,24,28,32,36,40,46
.
so [121.19 - 24.74] is 490% of range with 2x.
I have 511% on 11s 1x but, it requires a XD drive. 107.7 to 21.07 with 36T eagle and e13 cassette 46 39 33 28 24 20 17 14 12 10 9 which is on the same range as XC MTB
The gaps are not bad and yes, I know that despite I could achieve the same range as you with a 40 or 42 chainring, the gapping would feel greater as proportional to ring size.

Like I said, for off road, I think it is great however on road, I'd rather be 2x with 11s 11-30 max (which gapping would match my 9s 11-25T)
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Old 12-18-21, 04:12 PM
  #27  
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Iíve temporarily relocated to a very road centric area, gravel just isnít a realistic option here. I brought my gravel bike because I figured it could do it all, and I just didnít know what Iíd get here.

Turns out that Iíve been riding my gravel bike on pavement a lot. The 40 x 10-42 is mostly ok. No long steep hills so the gearing is adequate. I definitely notice the jumps between cogs on the road, same bike and same gearing, I donít really notice it on dirt or single track.

So yeah, if itís mostly smooth gravel or road riding with short dirt sections, Iíll finally admit 2x makes sense.

Build your bike for its intended job. Enjoy it.
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Old 12-19-21, 04:04 PM
  #28  
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I would only go 1x for shorter rides - for longer rides, I opted for more chain rings up front.
For MTB, I'm happy with 1x12
For my drop bar and bike packing bikes run 2x10, but I'm considering moving to 2x11
For road touring, I run 3x10, but I'm considering moving to 3x11
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Old 12-19-21, 10:35 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by cubewheels View Post
You'll see even more 1x gravel bikes in the future with 2x gravel bikes likely being phased out eventually!
I think that could be true because 1x allows brands to hold pandemic-era pricepoints while reducing parts and labor costs. Further, 1x creates a new pricing strategies where 2x can be offered as a higher priced, upgrade channel, allowing price stratification fine tuning like weíve never seen before.

I canít think of downsides to the 1x trend for bike manufacturers. For component manufacturers, 1x does raise questions about Shimanoís rationale for the remote Di2 battery, and could be pressure on them to get to full wireless like SRAM sooner rather than later, which as I said earlier I think will be in the 2-4 year range. The growth of the DTC retail segment will be a factor there, too, and if those kinds of brands see the simplicity and ease-of-setup of 1x and wireless as key components to customer sales and satisfaction, theyíll get the message to component manufacturers that they want more 1x, more wireless.

Weíll see.
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Old 12-20-21, 01:30 AM
  #30  
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I really appreciate the simplicity of 1x when I am racing 'cross and am at my absolute limit.
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Old 12-20-21, 09:52 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by cubewheels View Post
Speaking of MTB's, the 1x setup is always found on more expensive bikes.

The proper 1x cassettes and 1x RDs are also quite pricey and seem more expensive than 2x even if you consider the FD and big ring.
Interesting point regarding MTBs, but it does seem a little different case, not least for the fact that many upper tier MTB groupsets donít offer 2x arrangements. I think XTR is still available in 2x and 3x cranksets, but Iím not aware of any bike brands specíing it or even offering it. That makes it hard to compare pricing, I think, but maybe you know of some examples? If looking at entry level vs. top tier, yeah, but looking within similar spec ranges, can we say thatís true?

Certainly within the road/gravel realm, 2x groupsets are more expensive (comparing aftermarket pricing) than 1x groupsets in the same tier group (e.g. SRAM Force 1x vs. 2x, Shimano GRX800 1x vs. 2x). Where complete bikes with 1x and 2x spec are options within a range, e.g. Specialized Diverge Carbon, we see prices increasing from the 1x Base Carbon up through the 2x equipped Sport Carbon and Comp Carbon bikes, then a big $3k+ price jump up into the Pro Carbon offerings, which are 1x with either 13spd Campagnolo (all alone its category and 1x only) or wireless SRAM Force AXS. Since no Force 2x is offered, itís hard to say whether itíd fetch a premium over 1x Force, but given retail groupset pricing, itís a fair assumption it would, although if you look at Canyon Grizl 7 or Grail 8, both are offered with the same spec in either GRX 800 series 1x or 2x at the same price. As with Specialized, SRAM wireless 1x sits alone at the top tier pricepoint.

In any case, for gravel drivetrains where 2x options exist, I donít see 1x being generally more expensive, but there are lots of bikes out there and I donít pay a whole lot of attention, so please correct me if Iím wrong. That said, I donít know if what we see today is necessarily a template for whatís coming down the pike; COVID is a wrench in the works, for sure, and what this ongoing crisis means for consumers, trends, brands and component manufacturers is a complicated, inscrutable scenario for someone like me whoís well outside the industry. Anything is possible, I reckon.
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Old 12-21-21, 01:43 AM
  #32  
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Iím far from an expert so this might be off.

I know on motorcycles where the countershaft sprocket is in relation to the swing arm pivot is important.

So I think the 1x in MTB might have to do with rear suspension geometry.
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Old 12-22-21, 02:54 PM
  #33  
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OP: I ended up buying a '21 Salsa Warbird this past Saturday with 2x. Maybe it's because that's what I already have on my road bike and my previous gravel bike, but I still like the option of more gears instead of fewer.

The information shared in this thread has been wonderful - thanks to all of you!

Gary
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Old 12-23-21, 09:01 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by BrazAd View Post
OP: I ended up buying a '21 Salsa Warbird this past Saturday with 2x. Maybe it's because that's what I already have on my road bike and my previous gravel bike, but I still like the option of more gears instead of fewer.

The information shared in this thread has been wonderful - thanks to all of you!

Gary
I hope you enjoy it! I'm also a little jealous - my local shop couldn't find a Warbird for me. I ended up with a Lauf (which I'm thrilled with) but was very interested in the Warbird.
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Old 12-23-21, 11:49 AM
  #35  
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When I get my new custom gravel bike I will be running 40/26 in front and 9-32 in back. 546% range. Current gearing is 46/30 and 11-36 (502%). With the new gearing I'll do most of my riding in the 40, but with 2X I'll have the low gears that are not available in most 1X setups.
I think it really comes down to where you ride. In Iowa a 1X setup makes sense. In new Hampshire and Vermont I use all of the gear range I have and could often use more!
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Old 12-26-21, 09:38 AM
  #36  
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I was a die hard 2x guy because I live in the land of wind and big climbs and the 1x setups just didn't have the range I need. BUT... the SRAM mullet setup is very appealing. The range of that big cassette is what a 1x needs IMO. I could probably get by just fine with a 44 x 9-52 setup and losing the front der would be nice. If I ever build another gravel rig, that will be the way I go.
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Old 12-30-21, 03:07 PM
  #37  
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Having gone through many bikes over the last 40+ years, most of them road bikes, I now find myself with three 1x bikes: Kona Rove NRB gravel, Salsa Carbon Mukluk fat, older Salsa El Mariachi all around (started as a 2x, I modded it). I've done gravel touring with the El Mar with some big and long hills, and had enough gearing that I didn't have to walk. I've done the Arrowhead Ultra with the fat, including many hills in that race that had to be walked because of conditions and to get some warm blood back into the toes, and 1x was fine. The Kona Rove 1x is just a great bike that hasn't limited me. The only time I ever miss 2x is occasionally when I am riding with others and I am subconsciously tempted to match their cadence, but the great majority of my riding is solo. 1x is just simpler, I guess. And FDs can be a bit finicky to adjust once you get up to 11 speed, so there's that.

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Old 12-31-21, 11:24 AM
  #38  
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I believe it doesn’t matter it is what you prefer. The camp will be 50/50 on this.
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Old 12-31-21, 11:27 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Hondo Gravel View Post
I believe it doesnít matter it is what you prefer. The camp will be 50/50 on this.
Absolutely - but 50% are right and 50% are wrong! ;-)
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