How do I get over the feeling that I知 cheating with an ebike?
03-27-18, 08:26 AM
#26
☢
This. You'll just have to learn to live with it.
Nope, use the bell -- as a pass/overtake warning -- that's what its for.
I'm pretty sure we already went down this path about 100 years ago?
I haven't met anyone who's had a single negative word to say, people like it and ask about it with varying levels of positivity - sometimes quite exitedly. And everyone wants one when they see it go.
That said, i use it with respect. I use it around pedestrians and i put them first. In that way, it's the same as a 'manual' bike - you earn respect or disrespect. But at least whilst i'm respectful, people adore it.
However, when i'm travelling and i catch up with a cyclist in front of me, i'm faced with a bit of a dilemma. I want to overtake, so i sound my bell, but this has mixed reactions... some seem to be wondering what's going on, and who on earth is so fit that they think they can pass... and this led more to people swerving as they turn to look at what's behind them.
So with experience i've taken to using the stealth technique - keep quiet, watch them like a hawk, read what they're doing, give it full power and just fly past them with a wide berth. And i have to say, it seems the best and safest way, but i doubt they're quite so impressed...
That said, i use it with respect. I use it around pedestrians and i put them first. In that way, it's the same as a 'manual' bike - you earn respect or disrespect. But at least whilst i'm respectful, people adore it.
However, when i'm travelling and i catch up with a cyclist in front of me, i'm faced with a bit of a dilemma. I want to overtake, so i sound my bell, but this has mixed reactions... some seem to be wondering what's going on, and who on earth is so fit that they think they can pass... and this led more to people swerving as they turn to look at what's behind them.
So with experience i've taken to using the stealth technique - keep quiet, watch them like a hawk, read what they're doing, give it full power and just fly past them with a wide berth. And i have to say, it seems the best and safest way, but i doubt they're quite so impressed...
We as human being can use our brains to overcome our limited physical abilities. The modern bicycle itself is a perfect example. Countless brilliant minds over the last 150 years have a created a machine so efficient that under most conditions a human can pedal faster and farther than a horse can run. Are we cheating riding a bicycle instead of walking or running?
The electric bicycle is just the next step in using our brains and ingenuity to supplement limited muscles. Not to take advantage of it is dumb; especially considering the cost vs benefits. It takes thousand of extra dollars in high tech component to improve a bicycles efficiency even 1%. A few hundred on ebike parts doubles or triples your performance.
"My main reason for cycling is the exercise. Why would I want an ebike?". That's a quote from me until my brother dropped an ebike at my door to fix. Any experience ebiker knows you actually work as hard as you can because it's so much fun; fast is more fun and satisfying than slow. Because it's fun, you actually do it. That killer hill to get back home is now my friend. It use to keep me watching cycling on TV instead of riding.
My wife and I are in our 70's and tandem riders. We had planned at some point to give it up. With an inexpensive kit installed on our Santana we don't plan to ever stop. We often had to walk the tandem up that killer hill. Now we look forward to busting our asses climbing it at 15mph.
The electric bicycle is just the next step in using our brains and ingenuity to supplement limited muscles. Not to take advantage of it is dumb; especially considering the cost vs benefits. It takes thousand of extra dollars in high tech component to improve a bicycles efficiency even 1%. A few hundred on ebike parts doubles or triples your performance.
"My main reason for cycling is the exercise. Why would I want an ebike?". That's a quote from me until my brother dropped an ebike at my door to fix. Any experience ebiker knows you actually work as hard as you can because it's so much fun; fast is more fun and satisfying than slow. Because it's fun, you actually do it. That killer hill to get back home is now my friend. It use to keep me watching cycling on TV instead of riding.
My wife and I are in our 70's and tandem riders. We had planned at some point to give it up. With an inexpensive kit installed on our Santana we don't plan to ever stop. We often had to walk the tandem up that killer hill. Now we look forward to busting our asses climbing it at 15mph.
03-27-18, 09:29 AM
#27
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I haven't met anyone who's had a single negative word to say, people like it and ask about it with varying levels of positivity - sometimes quite exitedly. And everyone wants one when they see it go.
That said, i use it with respect. I use it around pedestrians and i put them first. In that way, it's the same as a 'manual' bike - you earn respect or disrespect. But at least whilst i'm respectful, people adore it.
However, when i'm travelling and i catch up with a cyclist in front of me, i'm faced with a bit of a dilemma. I want to overtake, so i sound my bell, but this has mixed reactions... some seem to be wondering what's going on, and who on earth is so fit that they think they can pass... and this led more to people swerving as they turn to look at what's behind them.
So with experience i've taken to using the stealth technique - keep quiet, watch them like a hawk, read what they're doing, give it full power and just fly past them with a wide berth. And i have to say, it seems the best and safest way, but i doubt they're quite so impressed...
That said, i use it with respect. I use it around pedestrians and i put them first. In that way, it's the same as a 'manual' bike - you earn respect or disrespect. But at least whilst i'm respectful, people adore it.
However, when i'm travelling and i catch up with a cyclist in front of me, i'm faced with a bit of a dilemma. I want to overtake, so i sound my bell, but this has mixed reactions... some seem to be wondering what's going on, and who on earth is so fit that they think they can pass... and this led more to people swerving as they turn to look at what's behind them.
So with experience i've taken to using the stealth technique - keep quiet, watch them like a hawk, read what they're doing, give it full power and just fly past them with a wide berth. And i have to say, it seems the best and safest way, but i doubt they're quite so impressed...
Last edited by linberl; 03-27-18 at 09:33 AM.
03-27-18, 04:53 PM
#28
Cycleway town
Thats all very well but nobody does it for me. If im just plodding along on speed-1 (whether the kid's on the back or not) other cyclists just pass me.
And I'm fine with it. After all, you don't sound your horn as you're overtaking another car, do you..? Motorbikes don't do that for each other either...
Like I say, ringing the bell is casusing problems. That is what's startling them.
I guess what helps is that it's customary to keep to the left, as we do on the road. So if someone's riding along on the left, and I pass on the right, then that's the correct overtaking procedure. I shouldn't be surprised that sounding the bell causes problems, it's just that some cyclists can be more erratic than others (world of their own).
And I'm fine with it. After all, you don't sound your horn as you're overtaking another car, do you..? Motorbikes don't do that for each other either...
Like I say, ringing the bell is casusing problems. That is what's startling them.
I guess what helps is that it's customary to keep to the left, as we do on the road. So if someone's riding along on the left, and I pass on the right, then that's the correct overtaking procedure. I shouldn't be surprised that sounding the bell causes problems, it's just that some cyclists can be more erratic than others (world of their own).
03-27-18, 09:24 PM
#29
☢
Thats all very well but nobody does it for me. If im just plodding along on speed-1 (whether the kid's on the back or not) other cyclists just pass me.
And I'm fine with it. After all, you don't sound your horn as you're overtaking another car, do you..? Motorbikes don't do that for each other either...
Like I say, ringing the bell is causing problems. That is what's startling them.
And I'm fine with it. After all, you don't sound your horn as you're overtaking another car, do you..? Motorbikes don't do that for each other either...
Like I say, ringing the bell is causing problems. That is what's startling them.
I guess what helps is that it's customary to keep to the left, as we do on the road. So if someone's riding along on the left, and I pass on the right, then that's the correct overtaking procedure. I shouldn't be surprised that sounding the bell causes problems, it's just that some cyclists can be more erratic than others (world of their own).
03-27-18, 09:34 PM
#30
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I was always a painfully slow rider because I'm not competitive and don't enjoy crazy-hard mashing on the pedals. Consequently my non-assist rides take forever and I get passed a lot. With the ebike I go fast and have fun, so for me the only rider I'm cheating is my own slow self. I can live with it.
03-28-18, 08:44 AM
#31
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Best line I have heard on the original issue is " I'm not competing, I'm commuting!".
On the overtaking, I have settled on shouting "right behind you!", before overtaking. That way, they can pick a side and I can avoid. I noticed that the traditional "on your left" caused people to pick a side, then sometimes change their direction while they figured out what "on your left" meant, then sometimes change a third time when they figured out their left from their right, all of which took too much time, and one too many course corrections for me.
"Right behind you" allows them to make a choice and stick with it, requiring only one course correction from me.
On the overtaking, I have settled on shouting "right behind you!", before overtaking. That way, they can pick a side and I can avoid. I noticed that the traditional "on your left" caused people to pick a side, then sometimes change their direction while they figured out what "on your left" meant, then sometimes change a third time when they figured out their left from their right, all of which took too much time, and one too many course corrections for me.
"Right behind you" allows them to make a choice and stick with it, requiring only one course correction from me.
03-28-18, 11:47 AM
#32
Senior Member
Best line I have heard on the original issue is " I'm not competing, I'm commuting!".
On the overtaking, I have settled on shouting "right behind you!", before overtaking. That way, they can pick a side and I can avoid. I noticed that the traditional "on your left" caused people to pick a side, then sometimes change their direction while they figured out what "on your left" meant, then sometimes change a third time when they figured out their left from their right, all of which took too much time, and one too many course corrections for me.
"Right behind you" allows them to make a choice and stick with it, requiring only one course correction from me.
On the overtaking, I have settled on shouting "right behind you!", before overtaking. That way, they can pick a side and I can avoid. I noticed that the traditional "on your left" caused people to pick a side, then sometimes change their direction while they figured out what "on your left" meant, then sometimes change a third time when they figured out their left from their right, all of which took too much time, and one too many course corrections for me.
"Right behind you" allows them to make a choice and stick with it, requiring only one course correction from me.
I agree, for us "cyclists" in the know saying on the left we shift right, but most people don't hear us or actually go left because they here "left"
I slow way the heck down and say hello and see which way they go and I go around , if they have earphone, I give as much room as I can
04-01-18, 10:00 AM
#33
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My approach is 3 fold. From a good distance to allow response time, I ding my bell (it is loud). That works about half the time and people often thank me as I go past. If no response, I yell "bike coming". If no response, I assume they have in headphones or are hearing impaired, and tap my air horn lightly. That almost always works, but once I literally stopped behind a guy and tapped him on the shoulder! He was reading a text, listening to music, and pushing a stroller while weaving over the pathway. He sheepishly said "sorry" and I told him it was all good but he needed to be more aware. With other cyclists, the ding usually works fine.
04-01-18, 10:35 AM
#34
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My approach is 3 fold. From a good distance to allow response time, I ding my bell (it is loud). That works about half the time and people often thank me as I go past. If no response, I yell "bike coming". If no response, I assume they have in headphones or are hearing impaired, and tap my air horn lightly. That almost always works, but once I literally stopped behind a guy and tapped him on the shoulder! He was reading a text, listening to music, and pushing a stroller while weaving over the pathway. He sheepishly said "sorry" and I told him it was all good but he needed to be more aware. With other cyclists, the ding usually works fine.
I ring my bell well in advance (so as not to startle anyone) and continue until I get a response. Then I pass as far to the left as possible. Things only become exponentially more difficult when passing multiple riders or when small kids are involved. Kids have incredible hearing so they're usually the first to react.
04-01-18, 10:59 AM
#35
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Nothing works 100% of the time but you need to pick a method and stick with it. Consistency is the key to staying safe. I always use my bell because a bell is universally recognized as a bike approaching.
I ring my bell well in advance (so as not to startle anyone) and continue until I get a response. Then I pass as far to the left as possible. Things only become exponentially more difficult when passing multiple riders or when small kids are involved. Kids have incredible hearing so they're usually the first to react.
I ring my bell well in advance (so as not to startle anyone) and continue until I get a response. Then I pass as far to the left as possible. Things only become exponentially more difficult when passing multiple riders or when small kids are involved. Kids have incredible hearing so they're usually the first to react.
04-02-18, 09:24 PM
#36
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I absolutely NEVER trust little kids. I had one move to the side, holding mom's hand, then suddenly dash in front of me as I pedaled past on the left. Had to lay down my bike to avoid a collision (nowhere to go). If there's a kid ahead, I always slow way down now no matter what. Too unpredictable, so I assume the worst. Otherwise, my methods work quite well. A bell doesn't work when folks have headphones on (only the horn works then), and a lot of seniors (I am one) don't hear a bell but do hear me call out.
04-03-18, 02:55 AM
#37
☢
I absolutely NEVER trust little kids. I had one move to the side, holding mom's hand, then suddenly dash in front of me as I pedaled past on the left. Had to lay down my bike to avoid a collision (nowhere to go). If there's a kid ahead, I always slow way down now no matter what. Too unpredictable, so I assume the worst. Otherwise, my methods work quite well. A bell doesn't work when folks have headphones on (only the horn works then), and a lot of seniors (I am one) don't hear a bell but do hear me call out.
You got that right. It has been my experience that inexperienced riders and almost all children will turn the direction they look over their shoulder. So when they are cycling on the right side and you ring a bell or say on your left, they look over their left shoulder and turn left at the same time. If they are on the left, they look over their right shoulder and turn right. Either way they turn into you. Slowing down and being prepared is the only solution when children are involved.
04-03-18, 09:23 AM
#38
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It's not cheating if there isn't a good country song for it.
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04-03-18, 01:56 PM
#39
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Honorable mention to a fat bike with loud tires (only works on paved routes though).
04-03-18, 02:00 PM
#40
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I'm going to be installing a friction drive for exactly that purpose. Super light weight ( less than 5 lbs total), easily removed for most of the riding, and has the boost I need when I ride hills and/or cart around 40lb bags of dog food. check out shareroller.com, rubbee, etc., as some examples. If you're handy, endless sphere has instructions on how to build your own. You can get 750w hill climbing power with minimal weight very inexpensively.
04-03-18, 02:02 PM
#41
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I built my current ebike to ride to and from work. I plan to use it part of the time, and I値l use my road bike other times. I have to admit, my ebike is much, much faster and easier. But every time I finish my commute, I feel like I致e been cheating. It doesn稚 help when I fly past someone else pedaling hard down the road. I知 not giving up my ebike, but I just wish I didn稚 feel this way after my rides.
But ultimately, a "car" is cheating. And like said above - its only cheating if you are racing. Commuting is not racing.
04-03-18, 11:44 PM
#42
Senior Member
It's no more 'cheating' than riding a motorcycle, as long as you obey the rules of traffic.
The grey areas are what kind of irk me as both a cyclist and motorcyclist (in Pennsylvania, at least). On a bicycle, I can legally slip past stopped traffic between lanes or on the right shoulder, saving a lot of time when urban commuting. However, it's illegal to do the same on a motorcycle. Why? Ostensibly, with the recently passed (2014) amendment to PA vehicle code, an electric assist bike with a top assisted speed of 20mph is for most intents and purposes considered a regular bicycle, so I could filter through traffic on an e-bike, but again not a motorcycle. That seems a bit arbitrary to me.
The grey areas are what kind of irk me as both a cyclist and motorcyclist (in Pennsylvania, at least). On a bicycle, I can legally slip past stopped traffic between lanes or on the right shoulder, saving a lot of time when urban commuting. However, it's illegal to do the same on a motorcycle. Why? Ostensibly, with the recently passed (2014) amendment to PA vehicle code, an electric assist bike with a top assisted speed of 20mph is for most intents and purposes considered a regular bicycle, so I could filter through traffic on an e-bike, but again not a motorcycle. That seems a bit arbitrary to me.
04-05-18, 12:29 PM
#43
Senior Member
It's the oppsoite of cheating, since YOU are the one who are able and willing to go by bike instead of just using a car.
Everybody can co to work by car, that's no achievement.
Going by bike needs much more skills and higher fitness.
Commuting with an Pedelec combines the advantage of physical training with less sweating like going by car.
Everybody can co to work by car, that's no achievement.
Going by bike needs much more skills and higher fitness.
Commuting with an Pedelec combines the advantage of physical training with less sweating like going by car.
04-05-18, 04:30 PM
#44
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04-06-18, 03:06 PM
#45
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I don't think guys on motorcycles are cheating.
I don't think your cheating,
I don't think your riding a bicycle either.
Ride your motor bike and enjoy It.
I don't think your cheating,
I don't think your riding a bicycle either.
Ride your motor bike and enjoy It.
04-06-18, 03:42 PM
#46
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I built my current ebike to ride to and from work. I plan to use it part of the time, and I値l use my road bike other times. I have to admit, my ebike is much, much faster and easier. But every time I finish my commute, I feel like I致e been cheating. It doesn稚 help when I fly past someone else pedaling hard down the road. I知 not giving up my ebike, but I just wish I didn稚 feel this way after my rides.
04-07-18, 11:04 AM
#47
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It's not cheating, really. But probably not a good idea to blow past normal bicycles.
The weight issue: Two years ago, a fast commuter on a mtn style bike swerved head on and crashed into my slow stable 12mph, him doing at least 15mph. We both fell, but were okay (helmets are good). My 55+ lb e-bike was rideable, but needed a new spoke and disc rotor. His front wheel was bent, and all he could do was push the bike to a nearby shop. So, be careful out there.
The weight issue: Two years ago, a fast commuter on a mtn style bike swerved head on and crashed into my slow stable 12mph, him doing at least 15mph. We both fell, but were okay (helmets are good). My 55+ lb e-bike was rideable, but needed a new spoke and disc rotor. His front wheel was bent, and all he could do was push the bike to a nearby shop. So, be careful out there.
04-11-18, 06:05 AM
#48
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MikeyMK,
PLEASE,use the bell
there is nothing more dangerous on pathway than being passed at high speeds with NO warning.
agree with most of posters here
it is important who/how ebike is used, not how poweful.
I ride on 1000W hub and I ride according to situation on pathway.
"flaying" without warning by somebody 1 meter apart is rude and inconsiderate.
PLEASE,use the bell
there is nothing more dangerous on pathway than being passed at high speeds with NO warning.
agree with most of posters here
it is important who/how ebike is used, not how poweful.
I ride on 1000W hub and I ride according to situation on pathway.
"flaying" without warning by somebody 1 meter apart is rude and inconsiderate.
04-11-18, 06:52 AM
#49
☢
If a grandma can pass me and accelerate out of sight going up hill then all I can say is it ain't natural. That was my first experience to e-bikes.
I managed to recoup my masculinity by insisting that I was at the end of my 3.5 hour ride and that she was likely fresh out of the oven (her ride of course) from one of the nearby apartment complexes.
Not to mention dangerous. Which is why these warnings are required by law.
I managed to recoup my masculinity by insisting that I was at the end of my 3.5 hour ride and that she was likely fresh out of the oven (her ride of course) from one of the nearby apartment complexes.
MikeyMK,
PLEASE,use the bell
there is nothing more dangerous on pathway than being passed at high speeds with NO warning.
agree with most of posters here
it is important who/how ebike is used, not how poweful.
I ride on 1000W hub and I ride according to situation on pathway.
"flaying" without warning by somebody 1 meter apart is rude and inconsiderate.
PLEASE,use the bell
there is nothing more dangerous on pathway than being passed at high speeds with NO warning.
agree with most of posters here
it is important who/how ebike is used, not how poweful.
I ride on 1000W hub and I ride according to situation on pathway.
"flaying" without warning by somebody 1 meter apart is rude and inconsiderate.
Last edited by KraneXL; 04-11-18 at 06:55 AM.
04-11-18, 07:30 AM
#50
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of course some walkers , only some are surprised by bell,
if you hit somebody on pathway by ebike all witnesses around would concentrate on your ebike - heavy, powerful, illegal,etc. few would notice how walker acted.
far more dangerous than ebikes are road bikes racers who use pathway as racing grounds
anyway my max. speed depends on me NOT motor when I pedal along with motor.
if you hit somebody on pathway by ebike all witnesses around would concentrate on your ebike - heavy, powerful, illegal,etc. few would notice how walker acted.
far more dangerous than ebikes are road bikes racers who use pathway as racing grounds
anyway my max. speed depends on me NOT motor when I pedal along with motor.