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Drop bar road ebike

Old 10-13-21, 11:07 AM
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Lazurm, I think you are correct about the Creo. I will check it out further. Thanks.

Mike
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Old 10-13-21, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by lazurm
Besides its cost and limited production, its motor only delivers a maximum of 15 Nm and 200 watts of force and its 85 watt hour battery very limited range, though one can opt for the 193 watt hour battery with its a little longer limited range. The Ares is amazing in terms of the engineering and looks and it serves as an inspiration for the direction this market may be going to but, otherwise, I'd pass.
Guess who gets my vote for Mr Obvious today? Only posted because there might be an individual interested in the technology.
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Old 10-13-21, 08:11 PM
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"Mr. Obvious"? How so?

Originally Posted by 2old
Guess who gets my vote for Mr Obvious today? Only posted because there might be an individual interested in the technology.
The high price may be obvious but the power and battery specs weren't. I looked that information up and it wasn't stated in this thread. Please consider the benefits of controlling what appears to be your negatively sarcastic tendencies while uplifting the promise of the internet.
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Old 10-13-21, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by lazurm
The high price may be obvious but the power and battery specs weren't. I looked that information up and it wasn't stated in this thread. Please consider the benefits of controlling what appears to be your negatively sarcastic tendencies while uplifting the promise of the internet.
What did you expect from a 19 pound bike? I'll ignore your tripe from now on. Too bad, this used to be a forum for really friendly exchange of information.

Last edited by 2old; 10-13-21 at 10:00 PM.
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Old 10-15-21, 01:02 PM
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How about an Orbea?

I've been looking into the Orbea Gain new e-road bike. It's available in either aluminum or carbon-fiber. Several different options available. Just a little over 30 pounds, if I remember correctly. I like that the battery is integrated into the frame so that it doesn't scream "fancy electric road bike-STEAL ME". It is designed very much as an electric assist, meaning you can make adjustments to get as much of a workout as you want; the motor doesn't take over.
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Old 10-15-21, 04:06 PM
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I bought a Specialized Turbo Creo SL which is a class III bike so it does not stop providing assist at 18 mph which is important to me. I like to power up the slopes where there are rolling hills and having the motor cut out midway on the hill would be a pain. The Creo SL comp weighs 27 lbs including its battery pack and it is lighter than my regular hardtail mountain bikes. Where I like it is when there is a 10 mph or stronger headwind as I can go faster and further with the bit of assist from the bike's motor. The Creo only provides power assist when pedaling and there are multiple power settings and these I can tune with a smartphone app.

Specialized also sells a 160WH range extender battery pack that mounts like a second water bottle to the downtube. Not cheap but it allows one to use higher power settings with little worry about running out of juice.
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Old 10-22-21, 01:40 PM
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Just wondering…

Does anyone make a compact assist motor, 50 watt/100 watt that will fit inside a standard 68mm bottom bracket.

Just provide a bit of assist only for tougher hills with the minimum amount of weight.

John
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Old 10-22-21, 01:52 PM
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Not quite all enclosed in the BB shell (some of the motor goes up into the seat or down tube) but it's all hidden. https://hps-bike.com/ I believe these are considered the most "stealthy" ebikes available. They're also the folks that built the Ares bike mentioned earlier in this thread.

I think these are the folks who built the illegal ebikes used in various European pro events (Cyclecross etc.) a number of years ago.

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Old 10-22-21, 02:13 PM
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Thanks!

It doesn’t have to be totally stealthy, but one day, like the OP, I would welcome a bit of assist as the same hills seem to be getting steeper.

I’m almost 70 and not looking for speed, just some extra watts.

If there isn’t really a good option, I’ll probably hold off until light e-assist road frames get a bit cheaper and lighter.

I would like to ride it as if there was no assist until needed.

John
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Old 10-22-21, 03:41 PM
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That is why we bought the Specialized Creo SL carbon bikes which weigh 27 lbs and can be pedaled without requiring the power assist. The comparable Trek road bikes weigh 37 lbs and much of the difference is in a much greater capacity battery pack. It is also much easier to lift and load the Creo onto a bike rack or to lift it to put the front wheel on a storage hook in my garage.
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Old 11-01-21, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO
Thanks!

It doesnít have to be totally stealthy, but one day, like the OP, I would welcome a bit of assist as the same hills seem to be getting steeper.

Iím almost 70 and not looking for speed, just some extra watts.

If there isnít really a good option, Iíll probably hold off until light e-assist road frames get a bit cheaper and lighter.

I would like to ride it as if there was no assist until needed.

John
I built something like this long ago. The easiest thing is to get a small hub motor that is wound for torque (not speed)

I built one like that, and it would max out at about 18mph. As I typically road around 20mph, it wasn't doing anything on the flats for me, but would give a nice little boost on hills. just use a throttle (I use an on/off button since it is slow speed, low power).

You really don't want to go below 250 watts. Power wise, that is gonna make it feel rather like a tandem at 250-350 watts.

What you describe does exist (see Canyon Endurance electric), but it ain't cheap. Hub motors are.
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Old 11-01-21, 12:32 PM
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Another option if speed up the hills is not a big deal is to use lower gears. Cheapest mod is to put a smaller inner chainring on your existing bike or go to a new crankset with triple chainrings. I ride with 46/52 chainrings and a 14-28 freewheel, but my wife's bike has 3 chainrings with 48/36/26 teeth. With the 26T chainring engaged she can pedal up anything.

With the e-bike market there are two very different groups of buyers, the urban cyclist where weigh is not an issue and the open road riders who want some assist but with a relatively lightweight bike and a stealth design. The Rad Power bikes are in the first group and they are fine up to 18 mph. The others are the Class III bikes with motor assist at speeds greater than 18 mph and with a motor and battery concealed in the drop tube and these cost 3-5 times as much as the urban Rad Power bikes. The Class III overall weigh half as much and the extra 25 to 30 pounds with the Rad Power type of bike is significant.

There are also the Yamaha Civante bikes with Class III capabilities but a large and highly visible battery mounted on the downtube. These are very hard to find to buy but the price is about $3,400. Yamaha has one of the best e-bike warranties but little in the way of bike shop dealers.

The Hilltop drives are not much of a solution for the OP when they add 18-21 lbs of weight for the one with 25-50 miles of range.

Last edited by Calsun; 11-01-21 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 11-01-21, 05:25 PM
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its been a long time since I looked at hill topper, although it is similar to what I described.
my 10v36ah battery weighs 3.3kg
my motor weighs 2.2kg.

with a simple 19lb donor bike, my road bike weighs less than many mountain bikes, and still handles like a bike. I agree though, adding 20lbs of weight to any bike, and its not gonna feel like a road bike.

I'm not sure one needs 50miles of range if one is only using it for climbing. But when I'm not in lycra mode, its nice to have something flatten out the hills.
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Old 11-09-21, 09:42 PM
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I absolutely love my Specialized Turbo Creo SL E5. It is fast and smooth. I can now keep up with the younger members of my team. It wasnít cheap, but worth it.
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Old 11-10-21, 03:44 PM
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KDGast Nice. I do race training rides in the summer. when at speed they are 25mph steady, ramping up to over 30mph (analogue bike).
Coming home from one of these rides a guy pulls out in front of me - so I decide to pace him to see how fast we are going.

We are riding into a decent headwind slightly up hill doing 28mph. I'm thinking - who is this guy and how do I not know him. I'm ok in his draft, but I can't pull on the front that hard for long.

We get to a stop light, and he has this grin on his face.
He says to me - "I guess you were working pretty hard back there?"
uh, yeah, kinda....

That is when he tells me he is on his Specialized Turbo Creo SL

I mean, that doesn't look at all like an ebike (and I've been riding my stelth e-road bike for 8 years) unless you look at the bottom bracket. Gorgeous bike.
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Old 11-10-21, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by chas58
KDGast Nice. I do race training rides in the summer. when at speed they are 25mph steady, ramping up to over 30mph (analogue bike).
Coming home from one of these rides a guy pulls out in front of me - so I decide to pace him to see how fast we are going.

We are riding into a decent headwind slightly up hill doing 28mph. I'm thinking - who is this guy and how do I not know him. I'm ok in his draft, but I can't pull on the front that hard for long.

We get to a stop light, and he has this grin on his face.
He says to me - "I guess you were working pretty hard back there?"
uh, yeah, kinda....

That is when he tells me he is on his Specialized Turbo Creo SL

I mean, that doesn't look at all like an ebike (and I've been riding my stelth e-road bike for 8 years) unless you look at the bottom bracket. Gorgeous bike.
That red one does look really neat.

Here's mine - sometimes stealthy sometimes less so


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Old 11-11-21, 11:57 AM
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The black container in the seat tube bottle holder is a battery pack that can be added to provide 50% more range with the Turbo Creo bike or left off if not wanted. This Specialized Range Extender adds weight but can be removed to have a lighter bike. The electronics on the Turbo Creo work very well to add assist when needed without the problem with other e-bikes of having the power cut out completely at 18 mph which if when one is attacking a hill is a major pita. For road bikes a Class III provides the most natural experience as compared to a standard road bike.
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Old 11-12-21, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Calsun
The black container in the seat tube bottle holder is a battery pack that can be added to provide 50% more range with the Turbo Creo bike or left off if not wanted. This Specialized Range Extender adds weight but can be removed to have a lighter bike. The electronics on the Turbo Creo work very well to add assist when needed without the problem with other e-bikes of having the power cut out completely at 18 mph which if when one is attacking a hill is a major pita. For road bikes a Class III provides the most natural experience as compared to a standard road bike.
I actually purchased a second Range Extender (RE) since I'm old and overweight. On my longest Creo ride, about 53 miles and 3,000 feet of climbing, with the RE I was running on fumes near the end of the ride. I decided that I wanted the ability to go further so got a second RE but have not used it yet on a longer ride.

And now that longer ride will probably not be till next Spring or Summer and I will be even older!!!
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Old 11-18-21, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by IcySwan1
I have a couple of Trek road bikes and enjoy them. I am 70 and find I struggle on hills even in granny gear. I see Trek has the Domane+ in electric. It is, of course, very heavy compared to my old school Domane. Does the weight skew the road bike experience when under pedal power alone, and are there other drop bar road ebike options out there?

Mike

I love my Specialized Turbo Creo SL E5. Light (32 pounds), fast (28 mph), and great range ( over 80 miles and over 120 Mikeís with range extender).
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Old 11-19-21, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by KDGast

I love my Specialized Turbo Creo SL E5. Light (32 pounds), fast (28 mph), and great range ( over 80 miles and over 120 Mikeís with range extender).
My, my, that RED does make a splash. I've got the mundane blue with lime accents. But I am obviously in worse shape as I wrote above, I got 53 miles and 3,000 feet with the range extender but it made the ride more than possible for this old guy.
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Old 01-06-22, 08:20 AM
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Complete ebike under $3k.. though hub-driven, still looks like a good deal..

https://electrek.co/2022/01/05/giant...eyre-electric/

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Old 01-06-22, 10:56 AM
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Well, for 3K, you can get some nice stuff. I think Electric did a nice review of a Yamaha a while back. But if I had that coin, I'd get a Canyon endurance or Grail ebike. Those things are amazing at their price point (and much nicer than the above bike).
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Old 01-06-22, 03:37 PM
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Funny (to me) how 40 pounds is "svelte" (especially with a 250wh battery which should weigh no more than 3 pounds. I have a steel MTB with 48V, 500w rear hub motor that weighs the same 40 or so pounds (36 for the bike and motor, 3.5 for the 52V, 4 ah battery), and I don't consider it svelte.

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Old 01-06-22, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by 2old
Funny (to me) how 40 pounds is "svelte" (especially with a 250wh battery which should weigh no more than 3 pounds. I have a steel MTB with 48V, 500w rear hub motor that weighs the same 40 or so pounds (36 for the bike and motor, 3.5 for the 52V, 4 ah battery), and I don't consider it svelte.
You and me both.

I'm guessing the attitude from marketing is that "svelte" doesn't have any specific or material meaning. Plus if you're used to 70lb moped like ebikes then 40lbs would be a revelation ... a svelte one.
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Old 01-06-22, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by chas58
Well, for 3K, you can get some nice stuff. I think Electric did a nice review of a Yamaha a while back. But if I had that coin, I'd get a Canyon endurance or Grail ebike. Those things are amazing at their price point (and much nicer than the above bike).
Canyon ebikes starts at about $5700, for the purpose of casual riding that's a huge investment when compared to $3k.

Originally Posted by 2old
Funny (to me) how 40 pounds is "svelte" (especially with a 250wh battery which should weigh no more than 3 pounds. I have a steel MTB with 48V, 500w rear hub motor that weighs the same 40 or so pounds (36 for the bike and motor, 3.5 for the 52V, 4 ah battery), and I don't consider it svelte.
If you have fat MTB tires on your steel MTB, that would likely make your bike more sluggish when compared to skinny tires on a gravel ebike.
A valid comparison of "svelte" would have to be determined after you've ridden the ebike with similar equipment & weight.
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