Bluetooth/Smartphone/Tablet or Garmin?
 

Those of you that have smartphones/tablets with sensors - how stable do they run? Any connection issues/device lock ups? I am thinking about that route = cheaper, but I want a rugged set up that is reliable. To that point the Garmin units might be better. What say all?

Up until a few weeks ago, I was using an iPhone 5c for almost two years. I had it connected to a Wahoo Tickr HRM and a Wahoo speed/cadence sensor. I also use a Wahoo RFLKT to view the ride data so I don't have to keep the phone's screen on to see the data. With the 5c, I was using about 10% battery life per hour. I recently upgraded to the iPhone 6SE using the same configuration and, so far, I'm using less than 5% per hour. I'm running Cyclemeter as the app and since I started using my phone, I've not had had many issues with dropping connections. Occasionally, I get a dropped connection when the battery to the RFLKT or one of the sensors is low, because there are no warnings on the sensors and the RFLKT doesn't always display the low battery warning. Cyclemeter shows the % of battery life left on the sensors and the RFLKT but I don't always check.

Thanks for the info John. I am thinking I might be better off in general with a stand-alone unit that isn't tieing up my phone. I have an iphone 6 as a work phone and the battery life stinks. I have to keep it plugged in all day, only a few months old. My personal phone is an iphone 4s with the original battery. It lasts a lot longer than the new 6 does.. For backpacking and other outdoor activities I track my trips with the GaiaGPS app. I have it both on my iphone 4s and an android tablet. It works great. Generally I ride with the tablet screen on the map - I like the bigger screen and I like the android platform better. Though, if I can do both the map and my computer data all in one device that would be great - and a waterproof device at that so I don't have to worry about a shower on a day tour/ride.

I am looking at the Garmin 520. Does anyone know if the bugs with the turn-by-turn directions not working all the time has been fixed? A lot of reviews say they just plain don't work, or the device does not have that feature at all, however the video in the following link describes them working some times and the unit menu has an option to turn the directions on or off? The video is ~9 months old so I assume there have been some software updates between then and now - maybe that open up that feature for more solid operation?


There is also mention in that video about stava live segments not working real well. Has that been addressed since? I have a basic membership to strava. I am not sure that I will get anything out of the live segments, of course I would have to upgrade to premium for that functionality also. I don't race and I don't "train" in the sense of beating times on segments and rides. I am more of a long distance leisurely rider doing a lot of self-supported day tours. I like to keep track of my averagencadence, distance, average speed, ride time, sometimes max speed, and GPS track. The rest of the "training" features aren't very meaningful right now.

At first I tried the Garmin Edge Touring. Didn't like the device -- unreliable and finicky.

I now use a Samsung S5 when I want navigation (Locus Pro for planned itineraries and occasionally Google Maps depending on the circumstances) and a Bontrager Node 1.1 for basic metrics (speed, cadence, distance, HR) fed by ANT+ sensors (the phone can display all at once, but is not 100% reliable, and useless as a total odometer). It is easy to build a route on a smartphone, even underway, even offline; theoretically possible on a Garmin device if you are extremely patient and do not mind "creative" routing.

As far as I am concerned, there is no comparison between a repurposed smartphone and a Garmin computer, if you want navigation assistance, with the possible exception of rain, when it becomes next to impossible to interact with a smartphone (rain drops acting as finger presses).

Having ANT+ sensors gives me the opportunity to wear a GPS watch (Garmin 910XT) to capture/upload data. I might have used it as a computer head instead of the Node1.1. It might even provide ultra basic navigation directions (I use a GPS watch when hiking).

I just found the handheld Garmin units support the remote sensors also. I'd be curious if anyone has any experience with this type of set up? If they support the remote sensors I would think they would be able to track averages for speed/cadence along with calculated distance based on the sensors and not GPS? That may be a more versatile route, though I like using the GaiaGPS app for hiking with my iphone or tablet.

When using a speed sensor, the Garmins will use that data in place of GPS to generate speed and distance (plus all related metrics) as well as the final tracked data that gets uploaded.

Hard to recommend a Garmin over a Wahoo with smartphone. The Wahoo is essentially grabbing data off the Wahoo app on the phone, so uses the phone extensively (if I understand the function correctly). The idea is to get a head unit that can use the in-place smartphone capabilities, without having to mount a $600 iPhone on the handlebar. My biggest complaint about the Elemnt is it's $300 and doesn't offer a color screen, which I find useful on my Garmin 810. Garmin software can be funky as well and they are less helpful fixing many known issues.

The Garmin 520 is not a mapping or turn-by-turn unit. It can do it, sort of, but not the same way as an 800/810/820/1000, which have built in maps and offer better functionality for navigation.

All that said, I opted for an 810 in place of using my iPhone 6S on the h-bar. For one thing I would have wanted a protective case like a Lifeproof, which is $100 and I hate the Lifeproof or Otterbox Defender for using the phone off the bike. As well the screens on an iPhone didn't work with gloves (Garmin touch screens do). And I don't want the phone battery running down on a ride and then having to charge it during the day. I don't have the battery issues with my 6S that QC8 has and think he has a bad phone.

My 810 is a nice unit and was well worth the $279 I paid in April. It's crashed 3 times but all fixable and I know why and how to avoid. I do a lot or pre-made courses in Connect, and do TBT routes. It works well. The after the ride save via BT to Connect has been flawless for me in 6 mos. of extensive use, as has the ability to create a course, then BT port to the unit, all on a unit that had known issues, so I've been lucky and happy with the unit.

Personally, I prefer not to use my iPhone for the battery reasons everyone has mentioned. I have a Garmin 820 and like it, but I don't use any remote sensors (yet).

I have used the mobile phone to track travelled distance and speed, but the battery juice drains a lot. Hence, I had to give up the idea of using the phone. I bought Fitbit surge which logs the accurate speed of the user. You can view the speed in the Fitbit dashboard.

On long rides, I keep a small external battery in my tool bag and run the charging cable to my phone which is on the handlebar. (My tool bag is under my saddle.) This past Sunday, I rode 60 miles. At the end, my phone's battery was still at 100%. Not only is it convenient not to discharge the phone's battery, it is good for the phone's battery's life. Discharging and recharging wears it down.

I used an iPhone 5c for just over 2 years that had three BlueThooth sensors connected to it. After doing some tweaking to the individual apps and phone settings, I was using 10% battery life/hour. Earlier this month, we upgraded all our phones to iPhone 6SE. I still use my iPhone as a bike computer with the same three BT sensors connected to it and now use less than 5% battery life/hour. If done right, you don't need multiple devices to accomplish the same thing you can do with a phone. I don't have anything against standalone GPS devices but since I carry my phone with me anyway, it just makes no sense to me to have a duplication of service and have to spend more money to do so.

[MENTION=67936]John V[/MENTION], your approach makes sense, and I'm using it. But before committing (how big a commitment is it, anyway) to using a smartphone app, it pays to address the issue of battery life management. Being able to call for help is more important than tracking my ride, so I don't want the app to drain the battery and render the phone useless. I think I've got the problem under control, and there are various ways to do it.

Actually high heat and high voltage (i.e., charging to, and storing at, 100%) are the most taxing to lithium ion batteries.

How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries - Battery University

This triangulates with a military study on different cycling habits with 18650 cells - clicky

Thank you for that article, [MENTION=74388]reppans[/MENTION].

I think ultimately the deal breakers that made me go Garmin was I didn't want the phone I use all day for dozens of things, get damaged on a bike. I would have wanted to put an Otterbox or Lifeproof heavy duty case on the phone while riding , yet hate these cases for everyday use, so would have needed to install into the case, then remove, which is a PITA. As well the Garmin touch screens work while wearing gloves which is VERY useful, if like touch screens.

Never found a good solution yet agree with John V about why use 2 devices. The only argument to that is you would carry a phone even if using a basic Cateye, so no real difference except you have less to deal with getting the phone and battery tweaked to last a day.

I been using using bicycle app on my Android phone. They are OK and do the job.

Now I use Garmin 520 with RPM and Cadence sensor. This is much better but not necessary.

I always carry my phone at the back saddle. I might get alarm call or important call from my aging parent. Who knows you might need a Uber ride when you are 30 miles out.

I've used both Garmin and an iPhone app extensively. For regular speed, distance, cadence etc... I don't think it matters much. You can get past battery drain with an extra battery or something like the RFLKT. The iPhone/smartphone has it all over the Garmin for display - not even close. Also the mapping on a phone tends to be better. Even when riding with my Garmin Edge 1000, if I get lost, I get out the phone to figure out what to do.

That said, Garmin or Wahoo have it all over the phone when it comes to calorie burn, power meter integration and other more performance based features. For example, the calorie burn in a ride in Cyclemeter (which I think is the best of the best of smartphone apps) is 2X what I actually see when using a powermeter and about 40% less than Garmin's calculated results. So that's a huge difference and worth noting. Truthfully, the calorie computation from anything other than a system with a power meter is almost worse than worthless.

So I think if you are just going to use it for general purpose ride metrics, then the phone is fine. Pair it up with the excellent BT capable sensors from Wahoo and you're in business. If you are after more performance data and accuracy in calorie burn, then the computers are better and plan on adding a power meter.

J.

Agree! For those who use power meters, most of the phone apps fall short of being accurate. For anything else, I also think they outdo a stand alone GPS computer. But for some reason, the battery life issue always seems to come up. Battery life on phones were terrible when the cycling apps first came out because you had to keep the screen on to see your ride metrics. Power consumption on phones has become much better since then. Optimizing the apps on your phone to keep them from using resources in the background, when they aren't used, adds even more battery life to your phone. Keeping the screen turned off and using a display unit like the Wahoo RFLKT conserves even more battery life.

This weekend I did a three day, cross state ride from the east to west coast of Florida. I'm using an iPhone 6SE and have three BT devices/sensors attached, one of which is a RFLKT. Friday's ride was 60 miles and took 6.5 hours (including stopped time) to complete. My remaining battery life, without having to charge it during the ride, was 73%. Saturday and Sunday's ride were both 80 mile rides lasting 8 hours each. Remaining battery life, without charging, was 67% each day. So my question to those who say they need their phones for emergencies is, "Just how much battery life does someone need to make an emergency phone call?"

Exactly.

The whole "I need my phone for emergency calls!" thing is a red herring.

If you desperately need your phone, carry a small battery charger for it with you, they're cheap, light and will get you out of any jam. I've had my phone run out of juice randomly because some app decided to burn through my battery (not cycling related), so if you really need the insurance, you should be carrying one of these batteries.

I've also ridden centuries on using my iPhone to record GPS and BLE sensor data, and still had plenty of juice at the end of the ride.

[QUOTE=dr_lha;19159420..... I've also ridden centuries on using my iPhone to record GPS and BLE sensor data, and still had plenty of juice at the end of the ride.[/QUOTE]

When my iPhone 5c was still fairly new, I did a century with a friend of mine and I still had 40% battery life left. His Garmin 500 was charged the night before and he ended up with just under 30%. I really don't have anything against Garmins or other stand-alone GPS computers other than it's a very expensive way of doing something that you can do with the phone that you are carrying around anyway.