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Edge 830 question

Old 07-28-20, 09:14 AM
  #1  
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Edge 830 question

I just upgraded to an Edge 830 from an Edge 305 (quite a jump). I got the 830 last Saturday, right in the midst of the Garmin service issue so I couldn't get through the setup until services were restored Monday morning, 2 days later. I have 1 ride with it under my belt since I was able to get it setup.

I have auto-pause enabled and find the data uploaded to Connect differs from the data uploaded by my Garmin Vivoactive HR watch. Specifically, the time the 830 uploaded looks like the total time of the ride, not the moving time.

When I checked the data that was automatically uploaded to Strava from the 830, it showed the both the proper moving and total time of the ride.

I'm used to using manual start and stop of my ride by pushing the timer button on the Edge 305 and set it up the same on the 830. Same on the Vivo HR watch. I don't use auto start, just auto pause.

Both devices report 3 times: Time, moving time, and elapsed time. The watch time and moving time are very close. Vivo watch shows time 2:07:36, moving time 2:06:11, elapsed time 2:23:42.

The 830 time and elapsed time are the same, and for this ride, differ from the moving time by about 16 minutes. 830 time: 2:23:46, moving time 2:07:58, elapsed time: 2:23:46.

As you can see, the moving time and elapsed times are very close between the 2 devices. But the time from the 830 differs from the Vivo HR by about 16 minutes... basically the difference between elapsed and moving times... or so it appears to me.

I'm not quite sure of the difference between time and moving time as shown above either.

Do I have a setting wrong? Or is the 830 reporting incorrectly? Or is the Connect site still messed up from the attack?
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Old 07-28-20, 09:52 AM
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Never compare two or more things if it's going to trouble you that they disagree somewhat.
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Old 07-28-20, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Iride01 View Post
Never compare two or more things if it's going to trouble you that they disagree somewhat.
Not exactly the response I'm looking for. Thanks anyway.

By comparision, my old Edge 305 and the Vivo HR provide similar times. The Connect time doesn't seem right and I'm not sure if it's something from the 830 or something on the Connect site that generates that bogus time. Especially since Strava seems to get it right on the data coming from the 830.
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Old 07-28-20, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by speedlever View Post
Not exactly the response I'm looking for. Thanks anyway.

By comparision, my old Edge 305 and the Vivo HR provide similar times. The Connect time doesn't seem right and I'm not sure if it's something from the 830 or something on the Connect site that generates that bogus time. Especially since Strava seems to get it right on the data coming from the 830.
I suspect autopause is not enabled on the 830.

There’s an option to change pause the timer when your speed drops below some number.
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Old 07-28-20, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
I suspect autopause is not enabled on the 830.

There’s an option to change pause the timer when your speed drops below some number.
I'm pretty sure I had it enabled. But I've been futzing with it as I learn it so maybe I didn't. Or maybe the update just before the ride changed something. IAC, I have custom auto-pause enabled at 4.5 mph now.

I'll keep an eye on it and see if it normalizes next ride. There are a ton of features to consider... much more than the old Edge 305! So it would be easy to overlook something.
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Old 07-28-20, 11:48 AM
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I've had my 830 since they were released last year and with the auto-pause enabled it has always recorded the moving time which is shown in the summary at the top of the CG ride page. It also records the total time which is shown down below in the ride details. Double check it is enabled.

I've run the 830 along with an old 500 simultaneously when comparing power meters and they were within a few seconds of each other.
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Old 07-28-20, 05:48 PM
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As others have said, I would check to make sure auto-pause is actually enabled. Even more importantly, next time you ride, look at the 830 itself. The timer should stop when you stop. If the timer keeps running then it means autopause isn't set properly.
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Old 07-28-20, 10:14 PM
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I have verified custom autopause is enabled. I'll keep an eye on it next ride and hopefully that will be the end of the story. If not, I'll post back here.
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Old 07-29-20, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by speedlever View Post
I have verified custom autopause is enabled. I'll keep an eye on it next ride and hopefully that will be the end of the story. If not, I'll post back here.
If your old edge 305 still works, take it too. My son has both an 820 and a Vivoactive HR. They do disagree sometimes. But he uses the 820 for ride data.

Sometimes on my Edge 500 I'll be playing around with it in the house and will forget to clear the timer before I go for a ride. Though you'd be able to tell that by the start time of your activity.

Still I wouldn't expect to two devices to totally agree. Especially if you aren't controlling both the stop and start time of each at every stop. Which I wouldn't even attempt to do. Just because one device sees you as stopped, doesn't mean the other will if it's signal is wonky for a few seconds or even minutes.

When I ride with two devices and look at the track plots, it's striking how different they show my position. Especially in dense wet foliage after a rain shower. My very much older Garmin handheld I used as a backup GPS when sailing is much more accurate almost any time. The Edge 500 better than my phone, but not quite as good as my son's 820.
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Old 07-29-20, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Iride01 View Post
If your old edge 305 still works, take it too. My son has both an 820 and a Vivoactive HR. They do disagree sometimes. But he uses the 820 for ride data.

Sometimes on my Edge 500 I'll be playing around with it in the house and will forget to clear the timer before I go for a ride. Though you'd be able to tell that by the start time of your activity.

Still I wouldn't expect to two devices to totally agree. Especially if you aren't controlling both the stop and start time of each at every stop. Which I wouldn't even attempt to do. Just because one device sees you as stopped, doesn't mean the other will if it's signal is wonky for a few seconds or even minutes.

When I ride with two devices and look at the track plots, it's striking how different they show my position. Especially in dense wet foliage after a rain shower. My very much older Garmin handheld I used as a backup GPS when sailing is much more accurate almost any time. The Edge 500 better than my phone, but not quite as good as my son's 820.
I'm been pleased with how closely the Edge 305 and the Vivoactive HR watch tracked each other in both times and distances. If the Vivo HR tracked cadence, I could just about do away with the computer. Except that I don't like having to look at my wrist for info during a ride. I much prefer keeping my hands on the bars and looking at the computer.

My 305 decided to join the narcolepsy failure crowd last time I used it. Lost all the data it was recording up to that point in my ride. Fortunately, my Vivo HR watch was running and I got the data from it. Track plots and all closely align so far between the 305 and Vivo HR. Too soon to tell with the 830. Only 1 ride on it thus far.

What puzzles me about the 830 time discrepancy is that Strava picked up the accurate moving time and elapsed time from the 830 while Garmin Connect seemed to use elapsed time for moving time as well as elapsed time. If I still see that discrepancy next ride with the 830, I'll see about running the 305 alongside as well and hope it stays awake.
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Old 07-29-20, 12:41 PM
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When I used Garmin Connect many many years ago, they were generally using the actual accumulated values for many of the data points that you will also see on your device. Strava and others derive, to varying degrees, their own accumulated totals from calculation of times and other data contained with each logged track point in the log file you upload.

It's also possible that your 305 doesn't provide all of the same data in it's log file as do later versions of the Edge. I'm not the one to say, but I think there is more ride and fitness information that can be handled by a .fit file format, than in the other file formats common for GPS devices.
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Old 07-29-20, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Iride01 View Post
When I used Garmin Connect many many years ago, they were generally using the actual accumulated values for many of the data points that you will also see on your device. Strava and others derive, to varying degrees, their own accumulated totals from calculation of times and other data contained with each logged track point in the log file you upload.

It's also possible that your 305 doesn't provide all of the same data in it's log file as do later versions of the Edge. I'm not the one to say, but I think there is more ride and fitness information that can be handled by a .fit file format, than in the other file formats common for GPS devices.
That may be. Any idea what type of files the Vivoactive HR uses? The data from it is consistent with the 305.

And in all fairness to the 830, I've only been able to take it for 1 ride since it arrived last Saturday, 4 days ago. So I'm still pretty green with it.
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Old 07-29-20, 07:35 PM
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You can connect them all to your PC or Mac and using your file explorer, browse to the /garmin/activities folder and see. On some models it's the /garmin/activity folder. On your 305, it might be entirely different, but probably easy enough to figure out. For the 830 and Vivo anything it probably is a .fit file.

For your 305, I'm not sure. I think it was .tcx that they used for some of the devices much older than the edge 500. But any fitness/cycling device older than the edge 500 I wouldn't know about. My much older garmin handheld used .gpx to record logs. Both .gpx and .tcx are simple text files with a mark up language in them similar to what HTML files looks like.

If you never deleted any of the rides from your 305, it's entirely possible the memory is so full that it doesn't have enough free space to function properly. Sort of like your PC or Mac when it's disk fills up.
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Old 07-29-20, 10:52 PM
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Yeah, when I plug the 305 into my PC, it doesn't even show up in Windows Explorer. I hear the USB connect/disconnect tones, but no joy seeing the files.

Both the 830 and the Vivoactive HR show up in Windows Explorer, as expected. The 305 must just be an odd bird.

Last edited by speedlever; 07-29-20 at 10:58 PM.
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Old 07-30-20, 12:17 PM
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Update: I did a 75 mile ride today and ran the Vivoactive HR watch alongside the Edge 830. This time, the times look good. So I must not have set auto-pause initially like I thought I did.

Vivo HR 75.19 miles time 4:52:48
Edge 830 75.15 miles time 4:52:00

All is well!

But this brings me to another question. I have another cell phone that I carry when I ride (different from my main phone). I have Garmin Connect installed on both that phone and my daily driver. Data (from the watch) doesn't get uplinked until I sync the watch with my daily driver. Can I not have my devices connected to more than one phone at a time? I think my 830 syncs as soon as it connects to my home wifi when I return from a ride.
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Old 07-30-20, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by speedlever View Post
But this brings me to another question. I have another cell phone that I carry when I ride (different from my main phone). I have Garmin Connect installed on both that phone and my daily driver. Data (from the watch) doesn't get uplinked until I sync the watch with my daily driver. Can I not have my devices connected to more than one phone at a time? I think my 830 syncs as soon as it connects to my home wifi when I return from a ride.
The Edges can sync using BT and the Connect app on the phone. They can also use WiFi. They try to sync as soon as they can.

Is your watch using WiFi?

Last edited by njkayaker; 07-30-20 at 01:38 PM.
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Old 07-30-20, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
The Edges can sync using BT and the Connect app on the phone. They can also use WiFi.

Is your watch using WiFi?
No, I don't believe so. I don't think the Vivoactive HR has wifi. Only BT.

If that's the case, is BT restricted to only 1 connection at a time?

Edit: a quick Google search tells me the app will only connect and sync one device at a time.

I think this is from Garmin's auto section, but perhaps it applies to all?

"

Connecting Multiple Phones with a Bluetooth-Compatible Automotive Device

If your Garmin device is compatible with Bluetooth, the Bluetooth functions (such as Live Traffic and phone calls) may only be used with one phone at a time. Although you cannot connect more than one phone at a time to the device, you can save multiple phones on the Garmin GPS as friendly devices.

If more than one friendly device is within range of your Garmin GPS, the GPS connects to the phone with which it was most recently connected. If you wish to pair the Garmin device to a particular phone, it is recommended to disable Bluetooth on the other phone while using the device. "

https://support.garmin.com/en-US/?fa...Cm98v5CMATDw3A

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Old 07-30-20, 01:42 PM
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That's kinda of a bummer because I used the Vivo HR for multiple purposes... from sleep and other activity tracking, to cycling. But with the 830, I probably don't need it for cycling any longer.
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Old 07-30-20, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by speedlever View Post
I think this is from Garmin's auto section, but perhaps it applies to all?
No (probably).

Is the watch paired with both phones?
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Old 07-30-20, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by speedlever View Post
Yeah, when I plug the 305 into my PC, it doesn't even show up in Windows Explorer. I hear the USB connect/disconnect tones, but no joy seeing the files.

Both the 830 and the Vivoactive HR show up in Windows Explorer, as expected. The 305 must just be an odd bird.
It is just plain old. Vintage 2006 electronics, coming up on 15 years ancient. The original iPhone didn't even exist back then.

I'm not even sure if BITD it read as a mass storage device. You needed Garmin MapSource and garmin TrainingCenter to do anything with it (both of which were EOL long ago). You're talking Windows XP SP2 era electronics with driver/device specifications long since EOL'd by Garmin and Microsoft.
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Old 07-30-20, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
It is just plain old. Vintage 2006 electronics, coming up on 15 years ancient. The original iPhone didn't even exist back then.

I'm not even sure if BITD it read as a mass storage device. You needed Garmin MapSource and garmin TrainingCenter to do anything with it (both of which were EOL long ago). You're talking Windows XP SP2 era electronics with driver/device specifications long since EOL'd by Garmin and Microsoft.
I suppose I should count my blessings that it lasted as long as it did. Still boots up, but after that last ride when the display blanked and it lost the data, I don't trust it. The 830 has been a nice upgrade.
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Old 07-30-20, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
No (probably).

Is the watch paired with both phones?
it was originally paired with the old phone that I now take on rides. I got a new phone back in April and paired it with that. It must have dropped the BT connection to the old phone when I paired it to the new phone.
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