Originally Posted by Chuck M (Post 23132903)

My Ring and Simplisafe batteries die like salted slugs in very cold weather. If I were tough enough to find out, I'd think my Bontrager lights would go well over two hours in this weather but I don't know how much over.

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23132908)

At temp like today (low -5, high 9), using a 4 battery pack in my jacket, I can comfortably go for about 1.5-2 hr. But I wouldn’t want to use the battery a second day without charging it again. [These are good quality Samsung batteries with a controller circuit built into each battery.]

If I place the battery at the ambient temp, I’m sure it will get less time out of them.

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23132880)

I find it puzzling, to say the least, that someone who is buying a new Tesla by spending (or borrowing) ~$60,000 or more would not have enough common sense to familiarize himself or herself with characteristics of its battery and how to charge it properly.

As far as commuting goes, every one I know who owns one of these contraptions, plug it in their garage after they return home. Some of them have charging facility at their work (provided for free by their employers), they take advantage of those chargers.

Fast chargers are not terribly good for the battery in the long run and most of friends use them only when they absolutely have to… such as on trips that are longer than a couple of hundred miles. [In fact, only one person I know drove a Tesla from San Francisco to Chicago as an experiment and didn’t like the experience much.]

I think a hybrid is still the most practical option. A Prius is good and gives about 50-55 MPG. If one wishes for a little more comfort for longer drives, Lexus ES Hybrid is decent. [ A little worse MPG for extra comfort and features of convenience.]

Originally Posted by steelbikeguy (Post 23132975)

for fun(?), or at least some education, you can put your lights in the fridge or freezer, and see how long they run. Let them sit in there for an hour or two before beginning the test, in order to allow the internal parts to fully cool off.

Steve in Peoria (thermal tests were a routine part of designing electronics for me back in the old days)

Originally Posted by Canker (Post 23132995)

One of the other "problems" is they aren't $60k anymore so more people are buying them. The base model 3 is $35-37k and until the start of this year qualified for the $7500 tax credit and the chevy bolt starts around $28k and still qualifies for the $7500 credit. The Bolt is one of the cheapest new cars you can buy period, is one of the most popular ride share cars, hertz has a butt load of them and rents then to ride share people, and best of all they have the slowest DC fast charging speed of about any car available( they are one of the worst offenders tying up dc fast chargers). I don't own an EV yet myself but this maybe the year since used prices are finally coming down to reality. I'm waiting to see what happens when most of the other makes gain access to Tesla's Super Charger network this year. I can charge for free at work, 120v at home till I get around to setting up a 240v option, and don't drive much day to day anyway.

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23132880)

I find it puzzling, to say the least, that someone who is buying a new Tesla by spending (or borrowing) ~$60,000 or more would not have enough common sense to familiarize himself or herself with characteristics of its battery and how to charge it properly.
...
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Originally Posted by noglider (Post 23130748)

[MENTION=203914]Tourist in MSN[/MENTION], my spouse owned two cars, a Prius for commuting and a Honda Element for hauling. They died about a month apart. She replaced both with the Tesla. It's big enough for hauling construction supplies, but it's not as convenient for hauling bikes as the Element. I'll eventually get a bike rack. I don't plan to buy any motor vehicles. Maybe in the next year or two, I'll get an e-bike.

Anyway, electric cars aren't for everyone, but it's working out well for us. The car is never inside. It's disappointing to see the battery drain when it's not even being driven, especially in the cold, but everything has its downsides and cost of doing business. I've heard maintenance costs on this car are not actually low: the tires are expensive, and she already damaged one and needed to replace it. I hear body work is super expensive. But fuel costs, even in the cold, are lower than a gas car. We have a hookup on our barn at our weekend house, so we "fill up" there cheaply. We have solar panels, so electric costs are quite low there. But that's 95 miles from our home in the City. She's found that Tesla Supercharger stations work well for her when she's en route somewhere, usually in New Jersey. I think they charge up to 40 cents per kwh. Charging in Manhattan is stupidly expensive for the energy, and they charge for parking, too. Lucky for my spouse that she doesn't need to charge in Manhattan.

Last night, we drove from the weekend house to our apartment in Manhattan. It was about 24ºF. We went from 91% charged to 46%, and that's worse than usual, but we can live with it since it's really not expensive. The battery is 75 kwh in theory. One cool thing is that when we plot the trip on the navigator, it estimates the amount of energy left in the battery at the end of the trip. It is extremely accurate. When we set off, it estimated 46%, and that' was exactly the result.

It might work a heck of a lot worse in lower temperatures.

Teslas are becoming viable for an increasing number of people, partly because of the extensive charging network. I see taxis in the City that are Teslas. Taxi drivers wouldn't be driving them if they didn't make economic sense.

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23133185)

Let’s say that a new electric car costs or will cost only $15,000. Does that mean the owners will not bother to learn how the battery of their car works, the only source of energy to make their new car go?

Originally Posted by veganbikes (Post 23130449)

Count me as one of those people. I think it was 2016 or so when I got my first Dynamo but I first looked at them back in 2011-2012 and said "nah too heavy, too this, too that". Silly me. Now with the Supernova M99 Pro DY light I have essentially a car headlight with high beam ability powered by my front wheel moving from my pedaling is there anything better? Granted the light isn't installed yet but soon will be

Originally Posted by Tourist in MSN (Post 23129738)

If you are knowledgeable on this sort of thing, do you have any thoughts on NiMH batteries for cold weather?

I use a lot of those for a variety of things. But rarely use them below freezing.

Originally Posted by MNBikeCommuter (Post 23136900)

I didn't thoroughly read through all the posts, so forgive me if you got your question answered. I ran NiMH batteries in a light maybe twenty years ago. The light detected a drop in voltage and would shut itself off. The first fall, this started happening about 13 miles into a 23 mile commute on cooler mornings, like around freezing. The batteries would cool down and the voltage dropped, and the light thought they were out of juice. Fortunately, the light didn't like the cold either and died that winter. I moved onto lithium ion after that.

Originally Posted by Troul (Post 23133763)

there are people that don't own a washing machine & dryer, because they just ''take it all in'' to the cleaners to have it done. I would not expect anything different when it comes to someone dropping many thousands of dollars on a vehicle & neglects to understand the fundamentals in keeping it operable.

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23138438)

https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/news...-bitter-cold/#

Notice the vague announcement from the company for having done some magical software updates to improve performance in winter. Does this mean that being in CA and TX they are so unaware of the range of temperatures where their EV will be used when it becomes ubiquitous, as they wish, that didn’t foresee this possibility and thought of “addressing this problem” only occurred to them after people were stuck with a dead car for multiple hours!

Hertz bought a large number of Tesla cars and they are apparently loosing money because of unexpectedly higher cost of repairs and maintenance.

Originally Posted by Troul (Post 23138552)

It's bad when the legal system lets a lot of the issues slip thru the cracks, & then ends up dealing with a much larger problem later on down the 'road' .

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23138660)

I am assuming bad refers to how it affects people. Laws are made by politicians, majority of whom are not exactly honest people. So from their perspective, it’s actually good - more opportunities to make more money by arm-twisting and settlements (lawyers) - no admission of guilt, it all works quite nicely. :sad:

Originally Posted by Alan K (Post 23133541)

I agree about taxi drivers picking a car that makes economic sense. In our area, it has become difficult to find a taxi that is not Prius.
In fact, if need something larger like a regular sized family car with large trunk, we have to specifically request a larger car or a Prius will show up. So far, I haven’t seen Tesla taxis here but that doesn’t mean they might not be there - I haven’t used a taxi for almost a year.

Originally Posted by noglider (Post 23142654)

That's weird. In the NYC area, including the suburbs, you normally get something that is grossly oversized such as a maximum-size SUV. I believe the thinking is, "I'm paying so why should I get a ride in anything downscale?" What a horrific waste!