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Prostate problems

Old 04-07-15, 03:36 PM
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Prostate problems

Hi. Now that I have your attention, I have a question for you. I turn 50 in a couple months, and am heading out on a cross country tour in less than 3 months time. Today, I visited my doctor just to go over the results of my blood work. My PSA is up to 3.9 (1.2 higher than October). Doc tells me that riding my bike can/and will elevate PSA due to the increased stimulation of the prostate while riding. WHAT?! He wants another test done in about 2 1/2 months-just before I leave. Depending on the results, he may refer me to a urologist.

So my over 50 friends, what experiences have you had? If you don't mind sharing. At my october visit, my LDL was high, and I have brought that down considerably, and raised HDL. BP fine. I am a pretty healthy guy-nearly a vegetarian, don't eat fried foods, and generally stay away from those food that are unhealthy. I don't smoke and only consume 3-4 drinks per week (wine or rum). I don't use tobacco products. Spun all winter, And now ride my bike 100+ miles per week outside-finally!

Any suggestions as far as supplements that have worked for you? Currently take milk thistle, nettle, and Saw Palmetto- 1 of each 3 times a day. Thank you.
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Old 04-07-15, 04:00 PM
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Don't wait - see the Urologist right away, and get it over with. He/she is more able to manage it anyway! Honestly, it's no big deal, and lots of meds help that issue.
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Old 04-07-15, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Wanderer
Don't wait - see the Urologist right away, and get it over with. He/she is more able to manage it anyway! Honestly, it's no big deal, and lots of meds help that issue.
Don't play around, even though your numbers are low, just go to the urologist.

As I type this, I have and ice pack between my legs and will do so for 24 hours. WHY...because I just had Bilateral Orchiectomy surgery. 95% production of testosterone is gone, will start radiation shortly and small amount of hormone for the remaining testosterone. WHY......because at almost 65, Ironman finisher, 5' 8.5", 140lbs, never smoked, drink less than you, eat meat one a month-maybe, 6,000+ miles last year, resting heart rate while awaiting surgery today of 32bpm, blah-blah-blah-----I am now living with Prostate Cancer after being diagnosed 3 weeks ago.

Don't play games, I didn't but still got nailed.

Good luck.

p.s.-just backed out of this coming Sunday's Ironman70.3Florida because of the surgery.
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Old 04-07-15, 06:45 PM
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Prayers, OTG........ sucks to get old!
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Old 04-07-15, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Wanderer
Prayers, OTG........ sucks to get old!
Prayers OTG, but it sucks not to get old also.
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Old 04-07-15, 07:13 PM
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Point well taken..... LOL
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Old 04-07-15, 07:29 PM
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I'm sure you're aware of this, but PSA tests are extremely controversial. The data is quite clear that for every single aggressive cancer brought to light by a PSA test, many (some data indicates 50+) are harmed by unnecessary intervention to control cancers that wouldn't, on their own, have caused problems within the lifespan of the patient. I'd to a LOT of reading about this before you start down this road. Personally speaking, I tell my doctor to skip the PSA during my physicals. The current data is that those taking the PSA tests don't live any longer than those who don't.

In general, working to bring down "bad" test numbers and raise "good" test numbers with drugs or aggressive herbal therapies doesn't work. The numbers may get better but the data doesn't show that it does any good in reducing risk.

- Mark

Last edited by markjenn; 04-07-15 at 07:34 PM.
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Old 04-07-15, 07:40 PM
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I'm not concerned about a cancer scare really. Prostate is larger than "normal" according to Doc. I'm not out of range just at the high end for my age. I appreciate everyone's advice. Urologist will most likely take biopsy. That's where I have a problem. No abnormalities felt on the prostate. Its smooth, and supple. That's what they want, minus the enlargement. There is a gamble gonna be taken here, right? I'm either going to be right or wrong. This is a problem. Last guy I know that had a biopsy was dead 2 weeks later. Gotta wonder about medical science sometimes.
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Old 04-07-15, 08:53 PM
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The PSA numbers are just a guide. The number isn't as important as the rate of increase.

Four years ago around this time of year, mine was still well within the 'normal' range for my age (52 at the time), but had doubled from 1.6 to 3.3 in just one year. My doc wanted to retest the PSA in six weeks. Retest = 3.9 - Still spiking upwards. Scheduled needle biopsy a week later. Cancer confirmed in the right half of the prostate. Consulted with Urologist/surgeon and my wife did a lot of research. I opted to have a radical prostatectomy (removed it entirely) as soon as I could arrange which was six more weeks wait. Post surgical examination showed that the whole prostate was now involved and the severity was much greater compared to what the needle biopsy showed just two months earlier.

I never knew that Prostate Cancer ran in my family. My maternal grandfather died of it (there were not many treatment options in the 1950s), and all of my male cousins on my mothers side also have it. As far as I know, I'm the only one that opted for the complete removal. Since my particular case seemed to be on the aggressive side, I'm glad I made the decision that I did. I didn't want the spectre hanging over my head.

Results not typical, your mileage may vary, and all of the other weasel-word disclaimers... It is YOUR decision. Make an informed choice!!!
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Old 04-07-15, 09:08 PM
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Before jumping to conclusions get retested. In case you don't know, you are not supposed to ride your bike or ejaculate at least 48 hours prior.
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Old 04-07-15, 09:19 PM
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I edited and submitted 2500 medical cases to the FDA several years ago, regarding men who had undergone heavy metal chelation (see my post on my recovery--not prostate but paralysis diagnosed as MS but the etiologies are the same, i.e., mercury poisoning from dental amalgams (primary), fish, vaccines w Thimerosal Hg preservative. I saw hundreds of cases, preparing them for submission, of guys whose PSAs had dropped (with no conventional treatments) to 1-2 or less, after removal of amalgams (ONLY with an IAOMT biological dentist) and then chelation under Klinghardt (website). Doctors do not realize the toxicity of the Dentists who plug our mouths full of Hg (leaking 3 ways, quantifiable) who still cling to a technology fraudulently "grandfathered" in by our FDA--dating to the 1820s by blacksmiths in France mixing molten coins to fill teeth. I came back from the dead, literally. Cheers from MN
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Old 04-07-15, 09:34 PM
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I edited and submitted 2500 medical cases of men with PSAs which dropped below 4 to the FDA several years ago, assisting a Dentist in the DC area: all of the men had undergone heavy metal chelation (see my post on my recovery--not prostate but paralysis of MS--the etiologies are the same, i.e., mercury poisoning principally from dental amalgams (89% of body burden), fish, and vaccines w Thimerosal Hg preservative.
Stunned by hundreds of cases, preparing them for submission, of guys whose PSAs had dropped (with no conventional treatments) to 1-2 or less--and stayed there--after removal of amalgams (ONLY with an IAOMT biological dentist, no exceptions) and then chelation under Klinghardt protocols (website). Doctors do not realize the toxicity that Dentists plug into our mouths including lethal Hg (leaking 3 ways, quantifiable) who still cling to a technology fraudulently "grandfathered" in by our FDA (that is not scientific), dating to the 1820s' blacksmiths in France mixing molten coins from their pockets in cauldrons to fill teeth as they changed horses' shoes.
I came back from the dead, literally. If you keep the mercury leaking 24/7 in your mouth, no conventional treatment will succeed to cure you. Moreover, there is no science that prostate cancer is genetic or inherited: it is environmental, and that includes your mouth, the most strategic location in which to poison you. The Hg is attracted to sexual organs due to high levels of sulphur, forming a bond. I have a website being updated, will be online this month with 50,000 peer-reviewed articles.
Start reading! Cheers from MN
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Old 04-08-15, 03:16 AM
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I had the same issue of a rising PSA and my primary physician sent me to a urologist who did additional tests. I returned in 6 months and the PSA declined and has been down since the original test. In addition I started taking saw palmetto that another physician suggested and found that it relieved some of the symptoms. The funny part is that the urologist also takes it and said it does work. The urologist also said riding can aggrevate the prostate.

Good luck.
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Old 04-08-15, 04:52 AM
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Originally Posted by markjenn
I'm sure you're aware of this, but PSA tests are extremely controversial. The data is quite clear that for every single aggressive cancer brought to light by a PSA test, many (some data indicates 50+) are harmed by unnecessary intervention to control cancers that wouldn't, on their own, have caused problems within the lifespan of the patient. I'd to a LOT of reading about this before you start down this road. Personally speaking, I tell my doctor to skip the PSA during my physicals. The current data is that those taking the PSA tests don't live any longer than those who don't.

In general, working to bring down "bad" test numbers and raise "good" test numbers with drugs or aggressive herbal therapies doesn't work. The numbers may get better but the data doesn't show that it does any good in reducing risk.

- Mark
+1 on this
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Old 04-08-15, 05:19 AM
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I'm 59 and have a family history with cancer. My PSA went up a point. Still below 4. Had the biopsy and 3 of the 12 samples came back showing cancer. One of the 3 is somewhat aggressive. Prostate not enlarged etc etc. I see the surgeron on the 15th. You pay your money, you make your choices and live with the outcome. Hope your situation is just a fluke.
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Old 04-08-15, 05:34 AM
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I also have prostate cancer in my genes, and do have an enlarged prostate. I have an annual physical every year, and the usual digital check. Normal for 45 years, and suddenly enlarged for the last 5. I already have a Urologist due to kidney stones, so he took over for that as well, and managed it back to normal size with meds. Helps me pee better, too!

Biopsy is not always needed, but it's better to have it watched regularly.

Don't hesitate, see a Urologist.
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Old 04-08-15, 05:42 AM
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Old 04-08-15, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by MARAIS
I edited and submitted 2500 medical cases of men with PSAs which dropped below 4 to the FDA several years ago, assisting a Dentist in the DC area: all of the men had undergone heavy metal chelation (see my post on my recovery--not prostate but paralysis of MS--the etiologies are the same, i.e., mercury poisoning principally from dental amalgams (89% of body burden), fish, and vaccines w Thimerosal Hg preservative.
Stunned by hundreds of cases, preparing them for submission, of guys whose PSAs had dropped (with no conventional treatments) to 1-2 or less--and stayed there--after removal of amalgams (ONLY with an IAOMT biological dentist, no exceptions) and then chelation under Klinghardt protocols (website). Doctors do not realize the toxicity that Dentists plug into our mouths including lethal Hg (leaking 3 ways, quantifiable) who still cling to a technology fraudulently "grandfathered" in by our FDA (that is not scientific), dating to the 1820s' blacksmiths in France mixing molten coins from their pockets in cauldrons to fill teeth as they changed horses' shoes.
I came back from the dead, literally. If you keep the mercury leaking 24/7 in your mouth, no conventional treatment will succeed to cure you. Moreover, there is no science that prostate cancer is genetic or inherited: it is environmental, and that includes your mouth, the most strategic location in which to poison you. The Hg is attracted to sexual organs due to high levels of sulphur, forming a bond. I have a website being updated, will be online this month with 50,000 peer-reviewed articles.
Start reading! Cheers from MN
The whole Hg fillings thing is controversial, although this certainly gives me an even bigger reason to be glad I grew up cavity-free. I have warned the rest of the family to avoid amalgam, since there are numerous alternatives these days.

However, there is ample evidence that some of the BRCA (breast cancer) gene mutations make men more prone to prostate cancer, which does run in some families.

So, I agree with one point you made and disagree with another.
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Old 04-08-15, 10:27 AM
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Since you are going to be doing a cross country ride, I would highly recommend a recumbent bike or trike. You would not have all the pressure and irritation on the never never land of the prostate. More and more long distance riders are going to bents for the comfort, and the fact that they have an all around view of the country instead of their front wheel.
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Old 04-08-15, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by LuckySailor
I'm not concerned about a cancer scare...

The PSA is a terrible test... But I order them on my patients all the time. We really don't have a good test at all so I run the PSA, do the rectal exam, and question my patient's family history. In my practice an elevated PSA gets you to the urologist period.

Biopsy... Biopsy... Biopsy... And then cross your fingers...

For all practical matters remember that we "Do not go gentle into that good night"...
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Old 04-08-15, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by rydabent
Since you are going to be doing a cross country ride, I would highly recommend a recumbent bike or trike. You would not have all the pressure and irritation on the never never land of the prostate. More and more long distance riders are going to bents for the comfort, and the fact that they have an all around view of the country instead of their front wheel.
I would certainly give more consideration to riding a bent. I gave it some thought a year or so back-before I spent the 5 grand on my new ride. No way that I can justify dropping 3 more on a bent. I feel comfortable on the Trek 520.


An earlier contributor posted not to ejaculate or ride a bike for a couple days before the test. I did not know this. Also, my doctor knew that I was planning on doing this cross country ride. But failed to mention either of these things not to do before the blood test. So hopefully the elevation is because of the fact that I am nearly 100% sure I had gotten laid the night before and I ride for sure 4 times a week.
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Old 04-08-15, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by zandoval
The PSA is a terrible test... But I order them on my patients all the time. We really don't have a good test at all so I run the PSA, do the rectal exam, and question my patient's family history. In my practice an elevated PSA gets you to the urologist period.

Biopsy... Biopsy... Biopsy... And then cross your fingers...
But the biopsy isn't a benign procedure and it also has a high risk of false positives.

The question of whether to do a PSA test and what to do with the results is not a "one size fits all" question - some will want any disease detected in the body treated at all cost, plan to live to be 90+, and may not care that much about side-effects; others will have different priorities. But with all due respect, do NOT take your doctor's advice without doing your own careful reading and assessment. Doctors, in general, are predisposed to treat disease and to prolong life at all cost, and are not in a good position to make difficult tradeoffs between small reductions in risk vs. huge side-effects of treatment.

Here's what the United States Preventative Services Task Force has to say about PSA tests:

USPSTF Assessment

Although the precise, long-term effect of PSA screening on prostate cancer–specific mortality remains uncertain, existing studies adequately demonstrate that the reduction in prostate cancer mortality after 10 to 14 years is, at most, very small, even for men in what seems to be the optimal age range of 55 to 69 years. There is no apparent reduction in all-cause mortality. In contrast, the harms associated with the diagnosis and treatment of screen-detected cancer are common, occur early, often persist, and include a small but real risk for premature death. Many more men in a screened population will experience the harms of screening and treatment of screen-detected disease than will experience the benefit. The inevitability of overdiagnosis and overtreatment of prostate cancer as a result of screening means that many men will experience the adverse effects of diagnosis and treatment of a disease that would have remained asymptomatic throughout their lives. Assessing the balance of benefits and harms requires weighing a moderate to high probability of early and persistent harm from treatment against the very low probability of preventing a death from prostate cancer in the long term.

The USPSTF concludes that there is moderate certainty that the benefits of PSA-based screening for prostate cancer do not outweigh the harms.


- Mark

Last edited by markjenn; 04-08-15 at 11:54 AM.
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Old 04-08-15, 01:06 PM
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Regardless of your opinion of PSA testing, I would keep an eye on the PSA velocity rather than the numbers themselves. High PSA numbers can occur for various reasons, including infections. However, the rate at which the PSA increases between tests is a more valuable indicator than the number itself.

I'm a prostate cancer survivor. At one of my annual physicals, my PSA was 2.8, higher than what it was at my previous physical, but not enough to be concerned about at the time. At my next physical, it was 4.2 and within 5 months it jumped to 6.8. The jump between the 4.2 and the 6.8 in just 5 months (with no change in lifestyle) told me I had prostate cancer, even before the biopsy and I was right. The biopsy showed a Gleason Score of 8.6 (out of 10) and the cancer had almost worked itself out of the prostate. I was 61 when that happened.

Having been in the medical profession for 25 years, I've read all the pros and cons about PSA testing, including the USPSTF Assessment. What I think some of these reports fail to tell you is the age of the individuals that were tested and included in the studies. PSA testing in individuals over the age of 75 is probably not warranted because many will most likely die of something other than prostate cancer and thus the reason for many of their conclusion. However, I'm still convinced that those that are between 50 and 70 should still have PSA tests done on a regular basis. Too many friends of mine have been diagnosed with prostate cancer at early ages that probably wouldn't be here had they not had regular PSA testing.
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Old 04-08-15, 01:18 PM
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Might also be worth keeping in mind that getting medical advice on here is about as wise as getting advice on fixing your bottom bracket from your urologist (unless he happens to also be a bike mechanic).
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Old 04-08-15, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by rocdoc
Might also be worth keeping in mind that getting medical advice on here is about as wise as getting advice on fixing your bottom bracket from your urologist (unless he happens to also be a bike mechanic).
Na, I don't necessarily agree. I know only one person alive, that I know of, that has had to deal with prostate problems. The other is dead. Community is vital for most of us to survive and all who contribute on this forum are in my "community". I grew up in the states, I now live in Canada-no brothers to talk to, and Dad lives in Florida, and has never had to deal with this issue. Do what you gotta do, hope its nothing too serious-that's what I get. All I am asking for is what your experiences were, and what are your thoughts if you have an opinion. The rest is up to me and only me. My entire adult life, I have worked with mostly women. They don't have this problem to deal with (unless there's a significant other) and the males that I have worked with in the past are not necessarily friends that I would discuss my personal life with. On The Forum, it's your choice if you want to bare your soul and how much. It is private to a degree, and nobody is going to tell my next door neighbour I have prostate problems. I'm semi-retired. I don't have a day job, nor do I work 40+ hours a week anymore. You guys are it! Thanks for your contributions. I really do value your opinions, and have been reading as much as I can. I do appreciate the directions/suggestions.
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