Caffeine, fatigue, and withdrawal
03-05-17, 02:59 AM
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Caffeine, fatigue, and withdrawal
A couple of things transpired to give me the message that I needed to do something about my caffeine intake - multiple healthcare providers telling me what I already knew - it's really excessive. I have been sleeping very restlessly and waking multiple times during the night, feel pretty drained many times, and using more and more of it to push myself to keep going but seeing diminishing returns from it.
So, the ugly truth is ... I was consuming up to a case (144 ounces, more than a gallon) of diet soda a day, plus 2 to 4 sugar-free energy drinks every day ... plus the occasional caffeine pill (200 mgs) some days. Over the past few weeks I've used energy shots some evenings, taking it on the commute home, to get a boost to do things at home. When I started taking two energy shots a few hours apart I said "whoa!" to myself.
On Tuesday I had my annual physical. In the last year, I've dropped 42 pounds based on their records. But it has been much more of a struggle than it should have been. My PCP said she was more concerned about the appetite stimuating effects of the artificial sweeteners I'm consuming in all that. Her comment was that she sees positive results in her diabetic patients when she convinces them to cut back on artificial sweeteners. I'm not diabetic or pre-diabetic - labs were pre-drawn prior and my A1-C was 5.1, fasting blood glucose was 73.
So, timing was appropriate, I had a "last Monster" very early Ash Wednesday then quit cold turkey for Lent. Instead of diet soda, I bought supplies for Week 1 - 7 gallons of distilled water, packets of dehydrated True Lime powder, and a couple of cases of Pelligrino for the fizz. A gallon a day of real water is my minimum goal.
Results have been interesting. Going into my 5th day of a constant headache front center of my forehead, but NSAIDs keep it minimal. Despite the water, my legs have swollen a lot with edema, probably due to loss of the diuretic effect. Overall though, nothing like I expected to feel - counterintuitively, I seem to have more energy, had a couple of really good evenings at home getting into my annual deep cleaning for Spring. Still waking at night but less and experiencing REM sleep more, since I have had dreams, which I wasn't prior hardly at all.
Tempted a couple of times but sticking with it!
So, the ugly truth is ... I was consuming up to a case (144 ounces, more than a gallon) of diet soda a day, plus 2 to 4 sugar-free energy drinks every day ... plus the occasional caffeine pill (200 mgs) some days. Over the past few weeks I've used energy shots some evenings, taking it on the commute home, to get a boost to do things at home. When I started taking two energy shots a few hours apart I said "whoa!" to myself.
On Tuesday I had my annual physical. In the last year, I've dropped 42 pounds based on their records. But it has been much more of a struggle than it should have been. My PCP said she was more concerned about the appetite stimuating effects of the artificial sweeteners I'm consuming in all that. Her comment was that she sees positive results in her diabetic patients when she convinces them to cut back on artificial sweeteners. I'm not diabetic or pre-diabetic - labs were pre-drawn prior and my A1-C was 5.1, fasting blood glucose was 73.
So, timing was appropriate, I had a "last Monster" very early Ash Wednesday then quit cold turkey for Lent. Instead of diet soda, I bought supplies for Week 1 - 7 gallons of distilled water, packets of dehydrated True Lime powder, and a couple of cases of Pelligrino for the fizz. A gallon a day of real water is my minimum goal.
Results have been interesting. Going into my 5th day of a constant headache front center of my forehead, but NSAIDs keep it minimal. Despite the water, my legs have swollen a lot with edema, probably due to loss of the diuretic effect. Overall though, nothing like I expected to feel - counterintuitively, I seem to have more energy, had a couple of really good evenings at home getting into my annual deep cleaning for Spring. Still waking at night but less and experiencing REM sleep more, since I have had dreams, which I wasn't prior hardly at all.
Tempted a couple of times but sticking with it!
03-05-17, 06:28 AM
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It took a lot to be so frank about your habits. The energy drinks you are staying away from have made me sorta manic in the past and interrupted my sleep patterns. I am a 65 and diabetic and have avoided sugar and diet sodas like the plague for the past few months and I am losing weight, having better sleep and generally feel better. The best thing I have done however is using portion control to assist in controlling my blood sugar. That and I no longer eat after 5PM. Many my age tell me that they eat considerably less than they did when younger and I have found this to be beneficial in achieving my health standards. I drink a lot of tap water too, cannot buy into the thinking that what comes out of the tap is that much worse. OK, I am cheap too.
03-05-17, 06:32 AM
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Way to go!
A couple of things transpired to give me the message that I needed to do something about my caffeine intake - multiple healthcare providers telling me what I already knew - it's really excessive. I have been sleeping very restlessly and waking multiple times during the night, feel pretty drained many times, and using more and more of it to push myself to keep going but seeing diminishing returns from it.
So, the ugly truth is ... I was consuming up to a case (144 ounces, more than a gallon) of diet soda a day, plus 2 to 4 sugar-free energy drinks every day ... plus the occasional caffeine pill (200 mgs) some days. Over the past few weeks I've used energy shots some evenings, taking it on the commute home, to get a boost to do things at home. When I started taking two energy shots a few hours apart I said "whoa!" to myself.
On Tuesday I had my annual physical. In the last year, I've dropped 42 pounds based on their records. But it has been much more of a struggle than it should have been. My PCP said she was more concerned about the appetite stimuating effects of the artificial sweeteners I'm consuming in all that. Her comment was that she sees positive results in her diabetic patients when she convinces them to cut back on artificial sweeteners. I'm not diabetic or pre-diabetic - labs were pre-drawn prior and my A1-C was 5.1, fasting blood glucose was 73.
So, timing was appropriate, I had a "last Monster" very early Ash Wednesday then quit cold turkey for Lent. Instead of diet soda, I bought supplies for Week 1 - 7 gallons of distilled water, packets of dehydrated True Lime powder, and a couple of cases of Pelligrino for the fizz. A gallon a day of real water is my minimum goal.
Results have been interesting. Going into my 5th day of a constant headache front center of my forehead, but NSAIDs keep it minimal. Despite the water, my legs have swollen a lot with edema, probably due to loss of the diuretic effect. Overall though, nothing like I expected to feel - counterintuitively, I seem to have more energy, had a couple of really good evenings at home getting into my annual deep cleaning for Spring. Still waking at night but less and experiencing REM sleep more, since I have had dreams, which I wasn't prior hardly at all.
Tempted a couple of times but sticking with it!
So, the ugly truth is ... I was consuming up to a case (144 ounces, more than a gallon) of diet soda a day, plus 2 to 4 sugar-free energy drinks every day ... plus the occasional caffeine pill (200 mgs) some days. Over the past few weeks I've used energy shots some evenings, taking it on the commute home, to get a boost to do things at home. When I started taking two energy shots a few hours apart I said "whoa!" to myself.
On Tuesday I had my annual physical. In the last year, I've dropped 42 pounds based on their records. But it has been much more of a struggle than it should have been. My PCP said she was more concerned about the appetite stimuating effects of the artificial sweeteners I'm consuming in all that. Her comment was that she sees positive results in her diabetic patients when she convinces them to cut back on artificial sweeteners. I'm not diabetic or pre-diabetic - labs were pre-drawn prior and my A1-C was 5.1, fasting blood glucose was 73.
So, timing was appropriate, I had a "last Monster" very early Ash Wednesday then quit cold turkey for Lent. Instead of diet soda, I bought supplies for Week 1 - 7 gallons of distilled water, packets of dehydrated True Lime powder, and a couple of cases of Pelligrino for the fizz. A gallon a day of real water is my minimum goal.
Results have been interesting. Going into my 5th day of a constant headache front center of my forehead, but NSAIDs keep it minimal. Despite the water, my legs have swollen a lot with edema, probably due to loss of the diuretic effect. Overall though, nothing like I expected to feel - counterintuitively, I seem to have more energy, had a couple of really good evenings at home getting into my annual deep cleaning for Spring. Still waking at night but less and experiencing REM sleep more, since I have had dreams, which I wasn't prior hardly at all.
Tempted a couple of times but sticking with it!
That amount of diet soda was really worrisome. Have you seen the dentist lately? All soda is bad for teeth, with or without the sugar.
03-05-17, 07:38 AM
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... So, timing was appropriate, I had a "last Monster" very early Ash Wednesday then quit cold turkey for Lent. Instead of diet soda, I bought supplies for Week 1 - 7 gallons of distilled water, packets of dehydrated True Lime powder, and a couple of cases of Pelligrino for the fizz. A gallon a day of real water is my minimum goal.
Results have been interesting. Going into my 5th day of a constant headache front center of my forehead, but NSAIDs keep it minimal. Despite the water, my legs have swollen a lot with edema, probably due to loss of the diuretic effect. Overall though, nothing like I expected to feel - counterintuitively, I seem to have more energy, had a couple of really good evenings at home getting into my annual deep cleaning for Spring. Still waking at night but less and experiencing REM sleep more, since I have had dreams, which I wasn't prior hardly at all.
Tempted a couple of times but sticking with it!
Results have been interesting. Going into my 5th day of a constant headache front center of my forehead, but NSAIDs keep it minimal. Despite the water, my legs have swollen a lot with edema, probably due to loss of the diuretic effect. Overall though, nothing like I expected to feel - counterintuitively, I seem to have more energy, had a couple of really good evenings at home getting into my annual deep cleaning for Spring. Still waking at night but less and experiencing REM sleep more, since I have had dreams, which I wasn't prior hardly at all.
Tempted a couple of times but sticking with it!
03-05-17, 07:39 AM
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Wow, what a withdrawal you put yourself through. That takes courage. You are going to like the new you. I drink a few mugs of strong black coffee after breakfast and that's it. Some years back I would have an evening snack with a diet soda or two. When I finally put an end to it the effects on sleep were surprising. Anyways, continue on and I hope the headaches quit soon.
03-05-17, 07:52 AM
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Thank you for sharing your habits & good for you for taking action!
I'm a non coffee drinker, always have been. I don't want to rely on stimulants. I don't drink pop, energy drinks, or juice either, just water. They have no redeeming qualities and I have tons of energy.
Good luck with your diet & your new healthy lifestyle!
I'm a non coffee drinker, always have been. I don't want to rely on stimulants. I don't drink pop, energy drinks, or juice either, just water. They have no redeeming qualities and I have tons of energy.
Good luck with your diet & your new healthy lifestyle!
03-05-17, 08:26 AM
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To limit my caffeine I now take a 20-oz large plastic cup, fill it 80% with water and then put a splash of grapefruit juice in it. It works well and I figured that the reason I was drinking so much coffee was that I was actually thirsty! I am down to 1-2 16 oz coffees a day from 3-4. I have had no withdrawal symptoms.
03-05-17, 09:46 AM
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Wow. We have something in common. No, have never consumed as much caffeine on a regular basis as you used to (I suspect that few do!), but I do consume too much.
The problem for me is that it's a vicious circle. I'm a little sleepy in the afternoon, so I'll have a spot of caffeine, either in the form of a soda or a cup of joe. The problem is, that spot of caffeine makes me sleep a little less soundly than I would otherwise, so the next day, I need even more caffeine to stay awake ... lather, rinse, repeat, dig myself into a deeper hole.
I've also done the "too much soda" thing. I was crewing a bud on the HooDoo 500 a few years ago, and drank pretty much nothing but Mountain Dew for 2 days. Gawd, I love the stuff. All was well until about 4 hours from the end, when I developed flu like symptoms and felt utterly crappy. I mean REALLY crappy. I dunno if it was the BVO (look it up ... bad stuff) or what, but I'll never do that again.
So every Lenten season, I give up something caffeine related ... sometimes giving up caffeine entirely. And every year, I get a nasty headache from it. Oy. The good news is that a little aspirin takes care of that (not Exedrin, though ... that has caffeine in it ... presumably that is the "extra strength" ingredient).
This year, I'm giving up soft drinks of all kind, caffeinated or not. I figure all those artificial sweeteners can't be a good thing either.
Anyway, good luck to you. No advice about how to make it easier on you ... just sayin you're doing the right thing, and I have an inkling about how you feel.
The problem for me is that it's a vicious circle. I'm a little sleepy in the afternoon, so I'll have a spot of caffeine, either in the form of a soda or a cup of joe. The problem is, that spot of caffeine makes me sleep a little less soundly than I would otherwise, so the next day, I need even more caffeine to stay awake ... lather, rinse, repeat, dig myself into a deeper hole.
I've also done the "too much soda" thing. I was crewing a bud on the HooDoo 500 a few years ago, and drank pretty much nothing but Mountain Dew for 2 days. Gawd, I love the stuff. All was well until about 4 hours from the end, when I developed flu like symptoms and felt utterly crappy. I mean REALLY crappy. I dunno if it was the BVO (look it up ... bad stuff) or what, but I'll never do that again.
So every Lenten season, I give up something caffeine related ... sometimes giving up caffeine entirely. And every year, I get a nasty headache from it. Oy. The good news is that a little aspirin takes care of that (not Exedrin, though ... that has caffeine in it ... presumably that is the "extra strength" ingredient).
This year, I'm giving up soft drinks of all kind, caffeinated or not. I figure all those artificial sweeteners can't be a good thing either.
Anyway, good luck to you. No advice about how to make it easier on you ... just sayin you're doing the right thing, and I have an inkling about how you feel.
Last edited by Biker395; 03-05-17 at 02:31 PM.
03-05-17, 10:26 AM
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I just wanted to add that in college I was smoking two packs a day of unfiltered cigarettes and drinking 8-10 cups of coffee a day. On Yom Kippur, many jews will honor a total fast from sundown to sundown. With prayers and services and if the holiday occurs earlier in the year, that can be 26-28 hours. A total fast, no food OR LIQUIDS including water.
Even at two packs a day I didn't have a problem with nicotine withdrawl for one day, but the caffeine withdrawl head-aches were insane.
Anyway, I quit smoking in 1984, and I drink 2-3 cups of coffee a day with maybe a 20-ounce mountain dew before my improv comedy show once a month.
I have noticed since I turned 50 or so, I am much more sensitive to sugar than I used to be as far as getting the jitters and crashing.
So, congratulations, Dave, on a difficult adjustment. You already seem to have reaped some benefits in regard to energy and sleep. HEre's to continued success and even better health!
03-05-17, 11:25 AM
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Yeah, overhydration. Both the headache and leg swelling are probably related to that. It can be fatal because your brain cells swell up: first coma, then . . .
I use a product which contains an appropriate amount of electrolytes for my daily hydration but no artificial sweeteners. I drink less than a half gallon of it per day. I drink tea and juice with my meals and have 2 cups of coffee/day. I never drink any form of sodas.
I use a product which contains an appropriate amount of electrolytes for my daily hydration but no artificial sweeteners. I drink less than a half gallon of it per day. I drink tea and juice with my meals and have 2 cups of coffee/day. I never drink any form of sodas.
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03-05-17, 12:15 PM
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Well done Dave. The good things you for your body will always be with you but the soda and other junk is soon gone.
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03-05-17, 12:33 PM
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Can't tell from post how much caffeine you were taking in - no mention of coffee, not all diet drinks have any caffeine - caffeine in energy drinks is variable. Those energy drinks do have a variety of other ingredients, some of which may have been large part of problem. Caffeine/coffee by itself in moderate amts is not considered harmful in any way for most folks. Diuretic effect is minimal for most people - comparable to drinking same amounts of any fluids. You were taking in impressively large volumes of diet soda and lotsa energy drinks, for sure!
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03-06-17, 11:59 AM
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Thanks guys! I appreciate the comments, thoughts, and support.
Happy to say, my headache lasted through the weekend, but is finally gone. And it was never serious, just an annoyance.
I sweat heavily when I do a workout, and I do that 5 to 6 times a week, for 1-2 hours each session. So, drinking a gallon a day plus of fluid is pretty normal. The rule is 1/2 to 1 ounce per lb of body weight, at my current weight (176 this morning), a gallon isn't a problem.
I'm not worried about reducing my electrolytes too low - there is so much sodium in food (which I avoid, but everything has it), and I also take a potassium supplement prescribed by my cardiologist and OTC magnesium. The edema -- well, that's why I ended up in a position to be able to say the words "my cardiologist" - I have really horrible veins, and have been treated for almost 4 years for that - I've had 9 or 10 separate procedures, both ablation by laser probe and "vein stripping". It's better than it once was, but I still have some edema.
Just before lunch here, I was sitting at my desk trying to get through something, and actually nodded off for a minute. So it's still an adjustment ... but a much better kind of sleepy feeling, not "bone weary" - and I feel a LOT better overall.
Now that spring is basically here ... I'm planning on doing a LOT of riding mixed into my workout routines.
Happy to say, my headache lasted through the weekend, but is finally gone. And it was never serious, just an annoyance.
I sweat heavily when I do a workout, and I do that 5 to 6 times a week, for 1-2 hours each session. So, drinking a gallon a day plus of fluid is pretty normal. The rule is 1/2 to 1 ounce per lb of body weight, at my current weight (176 this morning), a gallon isn't a problem.
I'm not worried about reducing my electrolytes too low - there is so much sodium in food (which I avoid, but everything has it), and I also take a potassium supplement prescribed by my cardiologist and OTC magnesium. The edema -- well, that's why I ended up in a position to be able to say the words "my cardiologist" - I have really horrible veins, and have been treated for almost 4 years for that - I've had 9 or 10 separate procedures, both ablation by laser probe and "vein stripping". It's better than it once was, but I still have some edema.
Just before lunch here, I was sitting at my desk trying to get through something, and actually nodded off for a minute. So it's still an adjustment ... but a much better kind of sleepy feeling, not "bone weary" - and I feel a LOT better overall.
Now that spring is basically here ... I'm planning on doing a LOT of riding mixed into my workout routines.
03-06-17, 12:36 PM
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So, the ugly truth is ... I was consuming up to a case (144 ounces, more than a gallon) of diet soda a day, plus 2 to 4 sugar-free energy drinks every day ... plus the occasional caffeine pill (200 mgs) some days. Over the past few weeks I've used energy shots some evenings, taking it on the commute home, to get a boost to do things at home. When I started taking two energy shots a few hours apart I said "whoa!" to myself.
On Tuesday I had my annual physical. In the last year, I've dropped 42 pounds based on their records. But it has been much more of a struggle than it should have been. My PCP said she was more concerned about the appetite stimuating effects of the artificial sweeteners I'm consuming in all that. Her comment was that she sees positive results in her diabetic patients when she convinces them to cut back on artificial sweeteners. I'm not diabetic or pre-diabetic - labs were pre-drawn prior and my A1-C was 5.1, fasting blood glucose was 73.
On Tuesday I had my annual physical. In the last year, I've dropped 42 pounds based on their records. But it has been much more of a struggle than it should have been. My PCP said she was more concerned about the appetite stimuating effects of the artificial sweeteners I'm consuming in all that. Her comment was that she sees positive results in her diabetic patients when she convinces them to cut back on artificial sweeteners. I'm not diabetic or pre-diabetic - labs were pre-drawn prior and my A1-C was 5.1, fasting blood glucose was 73.
I've drank a lot of coffee, and quit several times in my life.
No headaches for quite some time.
Be careful, some "headache medicines" like Excedrin contain caffeine. But, perhaps known low doses might help with early weaning. Even some aspirin (or tylenol) formulations will contain caffeine.
When I quit in the past, I can remember some sleepy times, but then there was a honeymoon period within a week or two when I would bounce back and feel reasonably awake.
It has been about 3 or 4 years since my last caffeinated coffee/coke/etc. I'll occasionally have a decaffeinated coffee, but that is rare, and on rarer moments, have about 1/4 cup of coffee. I do like hot chocolate (theobromine
)I do have a bit of a "brain fuzz" feeling, so I've been considering restarting?? But there are probably more reasons not to.
As far as dieting... I used to like espresso coffee + lots of sugar. It was oddly filling.
For those legs... KEEP MOVING.
Perhaps a 20 mile bike ride. Toe clips/Clipless may help by moving the pedals more to the toes and keeping the calf muscles working.
03-06-17, 01:21 PM
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congrats on losing 42 lbs in one year. that's amazing. addictions come in many forms & are no easy trick to quit. some reports are now linking addiction to certain genes. it could be a bigger problem than you think. you might benefit from additional help besides an annual physical. keep up the good work!
03-06-17, 02:09 PM
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congrats on losing 42 lbs in one year. that's amazing. addictions come in many forms & are no easy trick to quit. some reports are now linking addiction to certain genes. it could be a bigger problem than you think. you might benefit from additional help besides an annual physical. keep up the good work!
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03-06-17, 02:53 PM
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03-06-17, 04:45 PM
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Great work on dumping caffeine! It's not easy.
I've done the same thing (although not quite the same level of addiction) over they years but my frequent business travel to Asia always put me back on caffeine in trying to function with jet lag. But I just did my last Asian trip (retiring here in about 90 days) so that's on the schedule to kick it once and for all.
J.
I've done the same thing (although not quite the same level of addiction) over they years but my frequent business travel to Asia always put me back on caffeine in trying to function with jet lag. But I just did my last Asian trip (retiring here in about 90 days) so that's on the schedule to kick it once and for all.
J.
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