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Are Sore Legs Due To Age?

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Are Sore Legs Due To Age?

Old 11-27-19, 12:37 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
If you're at all like me, and think that "ride less" is simply not an acceptable solution, you need more protein. One to two grams per kilogram of body weight per day.

I went through the same thing, sore quads all day, every day, even on and after rest days. Upped my protein quite a bit, particularly after bigger rides/efforts. Significant difference.
what he said.
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Old 11-27-19, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by John_V View Post
Lots of good information here that may or may not solve your problem so I'll put in my two cents worth. It also may or may not solve your problem. Since I retired in 2011, I have been riding about 6 days a week and riding between 40 and 60 miles per ride. Unfortunately, this year has not been a very good year for riding and my normal 10,000+ miles/years has dropped to just over 7,000 miles to date. At 73, I'm quite a bit older than you and still able to do my mileage without any pain in my legs.I don't do any of the things suggested above other than make sure I'm well hydrated and drink electrolytes as needed. One thing I did notice is that a few years ago, it started getting harder and harder to pedal my bike to obtain the same output that I was doing previously and that led to occasional tired legs after rides longer than 60 miles.

This will probably cause a firestorm of pros and cons on the subject but last year (for Father's Day) my wife got me a set of titanium jockey wheels with ceramic bearings. This made a noticeable difference on the amount of effort needed to pedal the bike. So much so that I also replaced my bottom bracket bearings to ceramic and it was the best thing I ever did. Before the naysayers get started, you don't have to spend tons of money on ceramic bearings unless you opt to go with Ceramic Speed bearings. I purchased two Enduro,ceramic hybrid bearings from Wheels Mfg for $70.00/set. They're Grade 5 ceramic bearings with titanium nitrite coated races. While my wife spent quite a bit more on the SLF Motion jockey wheels, I ordered a pair of ceramic jockey wheels for my backup bike from OmniRacer for $49.95 (also Grade 5 and titanium nitrite coated). While these aren't quite as smooth as the SLF Motion jockey wheels, they made a noticeable difference on the backup bike.

In October, I completed my 6th Cross Florida Ride of 220 miles. It consisted of a 60 and back to back 80 mile days and over 3,000 ft of climbing over the length of the ride. For Florida, that's a lot of climbing. At the end of the ride, my legs felt as they did before I started the ride on day one. Pedaling is easier and smoother with less fatigue on the legs to obtain the same results that I was getting prior to changing bearings. My backup bike has a Hawk Racing bottom bracket on it; and while it's an awesome product, and they claim their BB is just as good as ceramic, it doesn't even come close.

This is my experience and you can take it for what it's worth but it's also something to consider, and maybe try, if nothing else seems to work for you.

PS: After getting ceramic bearings for my bike, I put a ceramic bottom bracket and a set of ceramic jockey wheels on my wife's recumbent trike and she has been thanking me ever since. I bought hers from OmniRace.
I like ceramic bearings a lot and agree that they make a difference in the performance of drivetrain and wheels. Letís say for the sake of argument that changing all bearings to ceramic saves 10 watts, which is a lot, if you put in the same pedal force as before, the load on your legs remains unchanged. If you take the power savings and reduce force in your legs for the same speed performance, then less leg fatigue makes sense.

Of course, one could just make 10 watts less and reduce leg fatigue but that will reduce speed and keep the standard bearings.
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Old 11-27-19, 02:03 PM
  #28  
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Insufficient data.

First, you need to specify the location (as precisely as possible) of the pain.Then describe the type of pain you're experiencing, i.e. throbbing, sharp, dull, etc. . Second, how long have you had it? Third, is there anything that has changed in your life or routine? And finally, have you had this problem before? Pain can indicate an injury or be the result of strenuous training.
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Old 11-28-19, 07:47 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
..., if you put in the same pedal force as before, the load on your legs remains unchanged. If you take the power savings and reduce force in your legs for the same speed performance, then less leg fatigue makes sense.

Of course, one could just make 10 watts less and reduce leg fatigue but that will reduce speed and keep the standard bearings.
This is true! However, to exert the same force with ceramic bearings vs steel bearings, you would have to drop to a smaller cog. This will increase your speed. At least it's held true for me.
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Old 11-28-19, 11:36 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by John_V View Post
This is true! However, to exert the same force with ceramic bearings vs steel bearings, you would have to drop to a smaller cog. This will increase your speed. At least it's held true for me.
I am certainly no guru, but this must be somewhat controversial because, at least one major mfr. has gone back to steel from ceramic because they believe the difference is so minor as to be inconsequential. Also, something to do with ceramic bearings and grease is apparently a headache to maintain. I don't know. Not an expert, but just reading about this, it does seem there is not a consensus. Reminds me a bit of the oval chainring discussion. And the company pushing hardest for ceramic also happens to be a pretty expensive purveyor of ceramic products. I suppose I would be willing to try out some new jockey wheels, but I am not going to go spend $1000 on a fancy new BB plus oversized pulleys if there is not a clear scientific benefit and especially if it will make my shifting worse. As a retired researcher, I really, really wish there was more actual science around some of these products to help us better make decisions. It's mostly marketing. Oh well.
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Old 11-28-19, 10:07 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
I am certainly no guru, but this must be somewhat controversial because, at least one major mfr. has gone back to steel from ceramic because they believe the difference is so minor as to be inconsequential. Also, something to do with ceramic bearings and grease is apparently a headache to maintain. I don't know. Not an expert, but just reading about this, it does seem there is not a consensus. Reminds me a bit of the oval chainring discussion. And the company pushing hardest for ceramic also happens to be a pretty expensive purveyor of ceramic products. I suppose I would be willing to try out some new jockey wheels, but I am not going to go spend $1000 on a fancy new BB plus oversized pulleys if there is not a clear scientific benefit and especially if it will make my shifting worse. As a retired researcher, I really, really wish there was more actual science around some of these products to help us better make decisions. It's mostly marketing. Oh well.
Well, there is!

Start here: https://www.bikeradar.com/news/frict...in-efficiency/

Jason Smith started friction-facts.com as described above. However my guess is that the business plan didn't quite work out. The website was sold to folks who turned it into an Amazon affiliate. Check it out, friction-facts.com
The data and etc. he sold to ceramicspeed.com. Smith used to sell his reports for $5/ea. and probably didn't have that many buyers. HOWEVER, ceramicspeed seem to be good guys, and some of Smith's reports are now available for free on their website, some as PDFs, see:
https://www.ceramicspeed.com/en/cycl...-data-reports/

As you will see, these claims of super speed from ceramic bearings are, as suspected. BS. Most probably new clean components will have less friction than worn dirty ones. So change your jockey wheels from time to times, select ones with ball bearings, and keep your chain clean and lubed. Looks like I could save a watt by going from Finish Line Ceramic to Rock n' Roll Gold. ChainL wasn't as good as my Ceramic. Click the link and learn.
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Old 11-29-19, 06:18 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
Well, there is!

Start here: https://www.bikeradar.com/news/frict...in-efficiency/

Jason Smith started friction-facts.com as described above. However my guess is that the business plan didn't quite work out. The website was sold to folks who turned it into an Amazon affiliate. Check it out, friction-facts.com
The data and etc. he sold to ceramicspeed.com. Smith used to sell his reports for $5/ea. and probably didn't have that many buyers. HOWEVER, ceramicspeed seem to be good guys, and some of Smith's reports are now available for free on their website, some as PDFs, see:
https://www.ceramicspeed.com/en/cycl...-data-reports/

As you will see, these claims of super speed from ceramic bearings are, as suspected. BS. Most probably new clean components will have less friction than worn dirty ones. So change your jockey wheels from time to times, select ones with ball bearings, and keep your chain clean and lubed. Looks like I could save a watt by going from Finish Line Ceramic to Rock n' Roll Gold. ChainL wasn't as good as my Ceramic. Click the link and learn.
Thanks very much for the thoughts and the links, CFB, I really appreciate it. Yeah, I just coincidentally cleaned my drivetrain and re-lubed the chain with my current lube, Mucoff's Hydrodynamic, which I bought because it was on sale at REI for 5 bucks. I like it just fine. My bike is a year and a-half old and has maybe 12,000 miles on it in a very wet climate. I baby it. I did notice the jockey wheels were very grimy when this all first came up, so they received extra attention. My cassette wasn't too bad, but I completely cleaned it anyway. The bike is basically silent now, which I appreciate. But not really sure I could say it is faster. I only average around 15 mph overall--it is quite hilly here and I am getting older. I will hit 30 mph on the flats when there is room to do so, but I'm no racer.

There are some fairly reasonably priced ceramic jockey wheels out there. I may buy a set and give them a whirl, since mine are looking a bit dated. But they won't be CeramicSpeed because their cheapest 11T wheels are $269. And that UFO chain is $160. As I say, nobody but CeramicSpeed seems to be really pushing hard to tell this story. I will be more than happy to but a whole new, fancy RD pulley system and BB and chain just as soon as someone else can verify their numbers. Thanks again for the links.
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Old 11-29-19, 06:32 AM
  #33  
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Hydration and rest are my first two thoughts, in that order. Listen to your body.
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Old 11-29-19, 03:32 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
..... As you will see, these claims of super speed from ceramic bearings are, as suspected. BS. Most probably new clean components will have less friction than worn dirty ones. So change your jockey wheels from time to times, select ones with ball bearings, and keep your chain clean and lubed. Looks like I could save a watt by going from Finish Line Ceramic to Rock n' Roll Gold. ChainL wasn't as good as my Ceramic. Click the link and learn.
There's pretty much nothing, other than an electric motor, that you can put on a bike to make the bike faster than what the engine can handle. At most, I gained about 1 mph average speed difference with the ceramic bearings. However, at my age, big increases in speed wasn't the reason I went to ceramic bearings. Ease of pedaling was and they do a fantastic job of it. On my 60+ mile rides, they make such a difference that my legs are extremely happy at the end of the rides. I have to agree that all the stuff coming from way overpriced Ceramic Speed is pretty much all advertising hype.There are too many manufacturers of ceramic bearings, at reasonable prices, that are just as good.
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Old 12-06-19, 11:12 PM
  #35  
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For my sore knees I have been finding that strength training in the form of climbing staircases up a small (350m) mountain and at my place of work, sometimes carrying weight, aiming to climb as many steps at once as possible (3 at work) helps.
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Old 05-03-21, 05:38 PM
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Aha. For my sore knees, I have found that changing my pedalling technique to use my glutes (butt muscles) at the bottom of the pedal cycle to pull my pedals backwards from about 5pm in the cycle, rather than mash, means that I do not put pressure on my knees hardly at all, so I am hopeful I will be able to keep cycling into my 70s, if I so lucky as to be still alive. Details here.

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Old 05-05-21, 09:58 AM
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not due to age. conditioning
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Old 05-06-21, 10:00 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Reynolds 531 View Post
My secret to good legs is Spinach Salads.

Direct correlation.
Don't eat a spinach salad = Legs Hurt
Eat spinach salad = Legs Don't Hurt.

Nothing else seems to make a difference. More protein, less protein. Protein after, no protein after. Salt, No salt.
You like Olive Oil with your spinach? Do you have an anchor tattoo on forearms? Sorry, couldn't resist. But seriously, just don't ride as far if your body doesn't like it!
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Old 05-06-21, 12:20 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider View Post
not due to age. conditioning
This.

Go look on Strava at Tinker Juarez's profile. He's 60 years old.
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Old 05-06-21, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
This.

Go look on Strava at Tinker Juarez's profile. He's 60 years old.
Talent makes a huge difference. I have a pet theory that a great deal of the difference between elites and us ordinary duffers is recovery ability. Anyone can train hard. The ability to train hard day after day is what makes the difference and gets riders' Chronic Training Load up to 100 or so. I have trouble getting it up to 60.
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Old 05-06-21, 12:44 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Go look on Strava at Tinker Juarez's profile. He's 60 years old.
Or check out Ned Overend. AKA "Deadly Nedly". He's 66.
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Old 05-06-21, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
Hey, guys and gals. I'm 55 and I ride about maybe 160 miles a week. That is broken up into one ride of about 65 miles or so on a weekend day and the rest spread out over usually 4 other days. 2 rest days, 1 after the long ride, the other in the middle of the week. My biggest climbs around here have around 2000 ft. of elevation gain and the max grade so far, since I started RWGPS a few months ago, was 15.4%. Still a lot of what I do is pretty flat.

My bike is a more aggressive geometry recent-make BMC (SLR02). It is not exactly light with the factory Aksiums, but once it gets going, it can move. I only recently started using Ulysses (along with RWGPS) to get a better sense of my speeds. It is hard to tell without something like a good speedometer app, as I live in town and there are a ton of stop lights and stop signs. Can't just look at total time and distance. Anyhoo, Ulysses is cool. It looks like, based on this app, anyway, that I am probably averaging about 14.5 mph over all routes and all terrain when moving. My max speed on flats was 31 mph--can't tell you what it is on descent yet, cuz I have to put my phone away so I don't crash. Just ordered a phone mount I seem to like (Nite Ize--looks extremely secure, unlike the Quad Lock. Just my take.). So, I will be able to know more about how fast I am going on different terrain soon.

Okay. So, the problem is that my legs have recently become super sore, sort of continuously. Even after a day off, they hurt like mad. Quads almost exclusively. Hammies are fine. Calves are great. Had the bike professionally fit. I do not really hurt while cycling, for whatever reason. Just barely the slightest bit sore while in the saddle. But just getting out of a chair in my apt.is a chore. It hurts. And I have a high pain tolerance. I walked on a tibial plateau fracture for three weeks before we figured out what it was.

But I am concerned. Do you think I am doing something wrong on the bike? Do I need to pay the 8 zillion dollars for another 10-hour fit? Any and all counsel is greatly appreciated. I am at a loss. Thanks a million!

AGE=SORE LEGS SORE EVERYTHING seriously you are riding quite a few miles. After I safety bar squat my legs are sore for days then trap bar deadlifts will make them legs scream for mama. Unless itís a pain that is telling you something is wrong my best guess would be dial it back some for awhile. I ride less since I resumed clanking iron. Just my opinion you know yourself best.
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Old 05-07-21, 06:24 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Or check out Ned Overend. AKA "Deadly Nedly". He's 66.
Tinker's elevation gain on rides is just out of this world.

https://www.strava.com/athletes/9101304
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Old 05-07-21, 09:16 AM
  #44  
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Statins drugs have caused soreness in my legs. Since the doctor put me on them will be going in next week to see what can be done to help wit this.
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Old 05-08-21, 08:10 AM
  #45  
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At 83 I virtually never have sore legs or knees. OTOH I normally only ride every other day. Recovery days take care of a lot of problems people have.
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Old 05-08-21, 10:13 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by prj71 View Post
Tinker's elevation gain on rides is just out of this world.

https://www.strava.com/athletes/9101304
Those are some big climbing rides, but I wouldn't consider them out of this world.

I worked on lots of climbing volume in 2004. My average ride had 4400' of climbing, ended the year with ~1.2 million feet.
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Old 05-08-21, 05:31 PM
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Among the other suggestions here, one thing to consider is that you might be magnesium deficient. And as we get older, and workout hard, it can happen very easily. In fact, most people are mag deficient, especially as you age. Just do some googling about it. I take additional magnesium and I believe it really helps with muscle aches, pains, recovery. And you're riding hard it sounds like.
Also, I only recently, at 61, discovered the benefits of CBD. Wow, it's changed things a lot for me. I get mine from Floyds of Leadville. I'm sold on this stuff.
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Old 05-08-21, 06:32 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by rydabent View Post
At 83 I virtually never have sore legs or knees. OTOH I normally only ride every other day. Recovery days take care of a lot of problems people have.
I think I need to practice this .
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Old 05-09-21, 02:23 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
It would seem like a couple of days of rest per week would be enough...until it isn't. As I got better at cycling, my mental focus increased. I could put in more effort for longer periods of time. At some point, there is an equilibrium where one needs a rest week not just a day off or one will not recover enough.

If one needs rest, one should take it. If ones legs are sore and a couple of days per week is not enough, try a week off the bike. A protocol used by many athletes that train hard is 3 weeks on and one week off.
Trust all advice from Hermes. At your age I was riding up to 250 miles a week, my legs were never sore and I never took any pain relievers. My life (work, family) would occasionally cause me to take a week off, and I always thought that my fitness benefitted from those breaks. Like others said, take a hard look at your diet and riding nutrition, it can make a huge difference. Also, get a deep tissue massage or two by the best masseuse in your area. This will sort out any knots or tightness that may be causing you problems and you can follow up with self massage (vibration gun/rollers) on your own. 55 is not old.
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Old 05-09-21, 02:30 PM
  #50  
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It does seem to take longer to recover now than it used to (I'm 57), and (as added insult) conditioning seems to fade a bit more quickly, as well.
Paying more attention to sleep and nutrition pays dividends for me, as well.
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