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Sore Quads

Old 11-09-23, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by SW84
So it does "end" pain. (pun)
Amongst other things, yes!
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Old 11-09-23, 05:21 PM
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Sore quad muscles are usually a sign that the saddle is too low for the rider. I have to make sure that I have fully warmed up my leg muscles when making any adjustments to seat height. I start with a height that is about 6mm too high and then progressively lower it until it is just right.
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Old 11-09-23, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Calsun
Sore quad muscles are usually a sign that the saddle is too low for the rider.
I can relate to this!
I recently brought home my first bmx at 63(my wife though I was nutz) and swapped in a 330mm seat post to boot around in the neighbourhood. I find I'm peddling more while standing and only sit when the quads get tired......
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Old 11-10-23, 05:26 AM
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Terry,
You've been hammering away since early Sept. Your quads damn well should be sore! 😜
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Old 11-10-23, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by BTinNYC
Terry,
You've been hammering away since early Sept. Your quads damn well should be sore! 😜
Yeah, that might have something to do with it.
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Old 11-10-23, 11:12 AM
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The internet cure for this is one cap bee pollen per day. But what it cures is more like a slow recovery process due to aging. I did it for my last ten years of commuting because I would never recover until Sunday after taking Saturday off. So it helped me in that instance when I was doing 2 a day x 13 miles. Then when I became a full-time remote worker and only riding once a day it was not so critical and eventually I dropped it after about 5 years and remained OK without. But, maybe worth a try for you for one bottle of capsules.
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Old 11-14-23, 06:52 PM
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Even when trying to use my glutes more, my quads always seem to take the brunt of the workout. My solution these days is If I'm on a tour or something, I back off overall some. Otherwise, I just accept it as the cost of training.
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Old 11-14-23, 09:18 PM
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Generally speaking, as one ages, there is some loss of muscle mass - I know it’s true in my case. Under these circumstances if level of exercises does not reduce, one should expect muscles to exhaust. If the pain is more a consequence of lactic acid build up, as might be the case based on someone’s comment about carbohydrate consumption midstream providing some relief. This pain is usually not long lasting. By the next day it should be much less and training on alternate days or alternating between heavy and light training should bring things under a good control.

The other possibility is exertion modality that resembles long distance runners; this is quite different where muscle structure changes over time in response to sustained training. Number of mitochondria per cell physically increase. And bulk of the energy used in exercise is generated by mitochondria through burning fat after initial depletion of stored glycogen (a polymeric form of glucose stored in liver and muscle, which doesn’t last for extended periods of exercising but perfect in vigorous but short period, like sprinting). If you think that you fit the latter category (long distance runners) and if your muscles are hurting considerably for long periods of time, you may have caused some tears in fibers but don’t worry, they heal. You do have to back off judiciously to let them heal. Eat well balanced nutritious diet and while not exercising actively, engage in activities that will improve blood flow to your muscles, such as a message.

The suggestion/theory of someone to eat protein degrading enzyme digesting a single amino acid (something proteases cannot do), which might make it all better, is quite magical. But such is the nature of things with free advice on the internet, you get what you pay for - often even lesser, including my own - so be diligent in researching and understanding.
[Once proteases enter your stomach and then guts, they themselves are broken down to short peptides or individual amino acids (in simple terms, think of enzymes and proteins as a long chemically linked chains of amino acids (monomeric unit). In order for our body to use all dietary proteins, it must be degraded to pass through the intestine to reach blood stream and only amino acids or very short peptides (two or few amino acids linked together) can pass through the intestine.]

I wasn’t able to open the page about the dietary supplement so I can’t comment on it. But be warned that majority of these things are not really necessary. Their suppliers create a need for their product through advertising by using liberal doses of half-truths to outright lies. None of these products have been put through rigorous testing in double blinded studies at multiple centers by unbiased groups of scientist without any conflict of interests, and they have not been approved by the FDA.

Oh, wait… most of the above can be equally well said about the drugs that are approved by the FDA. Well, never mind… 😉

Swimming and bicycling is almost an ideal combination.
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Old 11-18-23, 09:36 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
So has anyone noticed that their quads tend to be more sore than they were when they were younger?

I've noticed lately that my quads are always slightly sore. Nothing significant, but I don't remember having constantly sore quads when I was in my 40s, even though I was definitely doing more climbing back then.
Any update or resolution?
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Old 11-18-23, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by rsbob
Any update or resolution?
Much less sore this week, probably because I’m doing less riding. About half as much.
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Old 11-25-23, 09:14 PM
  #36  
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Thanks Terry, now I have sore quads.

Strava is telling me I need to take 48 hours off, and my legs agree. Did 40 today with 2K climbing and just didn’t have any snap other than when I really forced them. But then I haven’t taken a day off in two weeks so am due. Back to taking walks.
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Old 11-27-23, 10:00 AM
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I find that fueling a lot on my rides helps, even for 1hr rides - 1 bottle with ~50-60g of carbs/hr. Better recovery doing this too.
Other thing that helps my quads a lot is a brief pass with a percussive massager in the evening (usually riding in the AM). Not too long in one spot or the muscles are actually more sore the next day. Deep, even pressure, up and down the length of the quad, covering the whole muscle across the front and outside. I really notice it the next day if I forget to do it.
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Old 11-27-23, 10:09 AM
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not sure if anyone with sore quads are on a statin but the other day I was with my wife at her appointment (she gets a cancer maintenance infusion) and one of the side effects is sore muscles and she has had more quad muscle soreness recently and the Dr told her to stop taking her statin drug for a week or so because statins can cause quad soreness. She said you would know pretty quickly if that was the issue.
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Old 11-28-23, 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted by prj71
Yes. I'm 52 and started noticing it 2 years ago. Did not have the issue in my 40's.

Taking an HMB supplement has seemed to help a bit.

https://www.nutritionaloutlook.com/v...s-recent-study
I am curious about taking b-hydroxy butyrate - couldn’t open your link - why would taking an intermediate of cholesterol synthesis help?
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Old 11-28-23, 01:40 AM
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Originally Posted by jadmt
not sure if anyone with sore quads are on a statin but the other day I was with my wife at her appointment (she gets a cancer maintenance infusion) and one of the side effects is sore muscles and she has had more quad muscle soreness recently and the Dr told her to stop taking her statin drug for a week or so because statins can cause quad soreness. She said you would know pretty quickly if that was the issue.
Muscle pain is a well-known side-effect of statins when taken at high doses. If taking it is deemed a necessity, always use the minimum dose that is effective enough in reducing cholesterol level.


Given that statins have no significant effect on longevity, its common use is beginning to get questioned since it does have many unpleasant side-effects.
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Old 12-01-23, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Alan K
I am curious about taking b-hydroxy butyrate - couldn’t open your link - why would taking an intermediate of cholesterol synthesis help?
I don't know the science behind HMB. Just know that it works for me.

https://www.nutritionnews.abbott/hea...aging-muscles/
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Old 12-01-23, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by prj71
I don't know the science behind HMB. Just know that it works for me.
There are studies:

[Din et al, 2019]

A double-blind placebo controlled trial into the impacts of HMB supplementation and exercise on free-living muscle protein synthesis, muscle mass and function, in older adults

RET [resistance exercise training] with adjuvant HMB-FA [HMB free acid] supplements in free-living healthy older men did not enhance muscle strength or mass greater than that of RET alone (PLA [placebo]). That said, only HMB-FA increased TLM [thigh lean mass], supported by early increases in chronic MPS [muscle protein synthesis]. As such, chronic HMB-FA supplementation may result in long term benefits in older males[.]

TL;DR HMB didn't make subjects stronger or give them bigger muscles, but it increased lean muscle mass slightly.
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Old 12-01-23, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by terrymorse
There are studies:

[[url=https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261561418324634]Din et al, 2019]

A double-blind placebo controlled trial into the impacts of HMB supplementation and exercise on free-living muscle protein synthesis, muscle mass and function, in older adults

RET [[i]resistance exercise training] with adjuvant HMB-FA [[i]HMB free acid] supplements in free-living healthy older men did not enhance muscle strength or mass greater than that of RET alone (PLA [[i]placebo]). That said, only HMB-FA increased TLM [[i]thigh lean mass], supported by early increases in chronic MPS [[i]muscle protein synthesis]. As such, chronic HMB-FA supplementation may result in long term benefits in older males[.]

TL;DR HMB didn't make subjects stronger or give them bigger muscles, but it increased lean muscle mass slightly.
Thank you for the citation.
I have downloaded the above article and many more that were cited in the above study - will go through them to try and understand the story.

Disclosure: I tend to lean towards a healthy skepticism about synthetic compounds sold as “food supplants” (completely unregulated industry).

In the mean time, the cited study was conducted for a short duration and they state in their conclusion that more studies are needed to assess the long-term effects; it involves only 16 people in 2 groups (8 in test and 8 control); one of the authors works for the company which makes the product. I personally wouldn’t rush to start taking it for the long haul, but I’m somewhat more conservative and may have a little better sense of self-preservation. 😉
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Old 12-01-23, 01:37 PM
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I haven't died yet from HMB.

There is another around here that similar to this one...That's where I learned about HMB.
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Old 12-01-23, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by prj71
I haven't died yet from HMB.

There is another around here that similar to this one...That's where I learned about HMB.
Not everything is lethal immediately. 😉

At this point, I just don’t see enough evidence to know if it is beneficial or not (I’m not done with the literature yet).
And as I mentioned, I happen to be fairly conservative when it comes to putting synthetic chemicals in my body.
I’ll wait and see how the early Guinea pigs, I mean subjects, do in the longer run. 😁
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Old 12-02-23, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by prj71
I haven't died yet from HMB.
Yes but can you live without it ?....Imagine a scenario where your access to supplements would be cut off, what then ?
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Old 12-02-23, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Yes but can you live without it ?....Imagine a scenario where your access to supplements would be cut off, what then ?
I hear they are planning to feed people worms… or was it crickets!
Very nutritious and yummy… taste just like tofu prime steaks with A-1 sauce.
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Old 12-02-23, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Alan K
I hear they are planning to feed people worms… or was it crickets!
Very nutritious and yummy… taste just like tofu prime steaks with A-1 sauce.
Traditionally it has been the other way around. Just desserts?
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Old 12-04-23, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Alan K
Not everything is lethal immediately. 😉

At this point, I just don’t see enough evidence to know if it is beneficial or not (I’m not done with the literature yet).
And as I mentioned, I happen to be fairly conservative when it comes to putting synthetic chemicals in my body.
I’ll wait and see how the early Guinea pigs, I mean subjects, do in the longer run. 😁
You can dive deep into it...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5566641/
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Old 12-04-23, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Yes but can you live without it ?....Imagine a scenario where your access to supplements would be cut off, what then ?
Replace the supplement with foods that have HMB.

https://www.nutritionnews.abbott/hea...aging-muscles/
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