Digital Gee

Out riding today, and passed an LBS I hadn't seen before. Stopped to oogle some road bikes, and discovered this is the Giant dealer in the area. Okay, cool.

Salesguy was helpful, asking good questions, not pushing, etc. We then discussed my current steed and riding habits, and he said to me one of the things he would recommend strongly was that I upgraded my platform pedals and get some decent bike shoes.

He went on to say that riding in sneakers (do they still call them that?) on platforms, aside from wasting energy and getting no pull, just all push, I could be setting myself up for an injury, because the shoes were too soft and/or flexible, and over time, I could be harming the bones in my feet.

He didn't seem pushy about that point either; he was just pointing out that the store had lots of shoe / pedal options when I decided to get a road bike.

So -- is there some truth to this, and should I be doing something about it whether or not I move to a road bike, or was he blowing smoke? My feet don't hurt, once in a while they get tingly (especially the left) but I just shake 'em and it goes away.

Your opinions / experience?

zonatandem

Tennis/sneakers are OK for occasional riding. However a decent pair of specific cycling shoes will make a difference. Just like riding shorts/gloves make a difference so will a pair of stiffer soled cycling shoes.

Stevie47

Hey DG...

I can't really imagine you would be risking injury by riding platforms considering the "abuse" a foot goes through when walking or heaven forbid, running! On the other hand, I was SHOCKED when I first tried clipless though. The feeling of increased power, the feeling of being more connected (literally) to the bike was way cooler than I would have ever believed. So I went to the dark side, yes. And I, like most folks fell once before I figured out how to get out when I needed.

So, as they say...."Free advice, worth every cent"

Steve

Old Hammer Boy

Gary,

I agree with the guy at the bike shop, at least partially. We walk on our feet day in and day out, but I don't believe we put such a concentrated load over as small an area as occurs during hard peddling. And if I were to run a fair distance without proper, shock absorbing shoes, I'm sure my feet would be in a world of hurt, too. Of course if one "light foots" it on the pedals, I don't think there would be a problem, but if you decide to hammer, it's hard to beat a good quality pair of cycling shoes that are firmly clicked into pedal clips. In my opinion, the two best advancements in bicycles in the last 10 years or so are clipless pedals and brifters.

GrannyGear

Foot damage seems "iffy" unless you are inclined by having a "weak" foot or some previous injury. But soft soles do "bend" a bit....you may lose something in mechanical efficiency. I wear regular cycling shoes unless I'm schmoozing down to the grocery store....and even then my preference is an old pair of stiff soled touring shoes.

Once you get used to them, stiffer soled cycling specific shoes become natural and feel more.. "powerful?"...I can't imagine riding 60 miles in regular athletic shoes...but you've done it no problem D.G. Something more for you to think about...but then we start getting close to the platform/toeclip/clipless issue...an old chestnut around here!

abarkley

I would encourage you to go the clipless pedals and cycling shoes route. I started 3 weeks ago and they are a big improvement. I expect the shop told you about the two basic types, either with a cleat that stands proud of the sole or one that is recessed into it. The latter are more typically for MTB's but work if you do 'social' road cycling and need to walk about a bit too.

I concentated on a good fit too. It was suggested to me that I wear my cycling socks when trying on. I didn't follow the advice that you allow an extra 1/2 size to allow 'foot swelling' and I can't say I have suffered because of this.

Fortunately, the perfect fit for me was the cheapest Shimano rugged style MTB shoe and I paired these with the bottom of the range SPD pedals. Absolutely no problems so far.

The pedals are not difficult (usually) but the binding mechanism is so smooth and well positioned that I have locked myself back in at moments when I certainly didn't want to be. They are an enourmous improvement on the clip/strap pedals that I disposed of - the leg wounds from that episode are still healing.

Al

berts

There may be some truth to it especially if you hammer 50 mile rides at 20 mph or do a lot of climbing. Blowing smoke? I don't think so, I would also advise anyone who is serious about riding to wear them. No guarantee that the tingling will go away with the cycling shoes.
Advantages:
Enables more efficient power transfer
More comfortable for riding due to design and hard sole
Distributes pressure more evenly over whole foot

Disadvantages:
Can't walk on them

I personally would not ride without them, but then all my riding is out of town on highways for sport - none of it is in town for chores, etc. Even my biweekly commute is a ride through the desert on highways with no stops, a shower and change at my workplace and a convenient ride home with the bus where I stoke my bike in the ample baggage compartment.

cc_rider

Until a few years ago I rode with sneakers in toe clips. That was ok when a long ride (for me) was a 25 miler.
When I got more serious about cycling and started extending my rides to 50+ miles, I realized that my feet would wear out around 30 miles / 2 hours. Would sometimes take a day or two to get back to normal.
Now I regularly ride metric distance and longer, with mtb shoes and toe clips, with no foot problems. Since I need something walkable the Shimano mtb works well.
Bike shoes might not be necessary for everyone, but they helped me.
If it hurts or tingles, you should probably do something.

I'm not entirely sold on clipless (yet), but I may try it on my next bike. Speedplay Frogs are tempting.

HopedaleHills

Just last week I installed a set of Crank Bros Candies on my Trek and can't believe the difference they make. I went with a MTB type shoe, the Specicialized Sonoma, they are very 'sneaker like' and feel great on your feet, and only about $80.00. I was getting hotspots on the bottom of my feet with sneakers and platforms. I have had very little trouble clipping in and out. In fact I find it much harder to clip in than clip out. At one point on Sunday it must have taken me a good half mile to get both feet clipped in. I've done about 30 miles with them and haven't fallen, yet! Did I just jinx myself?

TaosWoman

Ok here's my 2 cents. About a year ago my brother starts complaing that his feet keep going numb. I asked him what he wears when he rides his bike. He lives in Thailand and tells me that 99 percent of the time he lives in sandals including his bike rides.

I suggested he get better shoes preferably bike shoes. Well now it's a year later and he's been off the bike due to another injury and was telling me that his feet are getting better. It seems in the past year he left the sandals behind but moved on to sneakers.

Last week he sends me an email and asked about bike shoes. So yes I do think bike shoes make a difference.

Retro Grouch 

I don't know if it will hurt your feet or not. I do know that I've yet to meet anybody who, once they got acclimated to using clipless pedals, wanted to go back.

Pat

Digital,

Well, this has led to an interesting discussion has it not?

My experience of riding bikes with sneakers goes way back when the basic pedals were "rat traps" with "toe clips". It was even before clipless pedals.

In my experience, even with the rat traps with their sharp edges, sneakers were OK for short (less than 1.5 hours) and not very strenuous rides.

When I got into better shape, I bought a pair of cycling shoes. In those, preclipless days, shoes had cleats that slipped over the edge of the pedal and sort of helped give stability. The shoes themselves having rigid soles helped greatly in power transfer and ,being rigid, protected the feet from the edge of the rat trap pedals from biting through the sole and creating a pressure point on the foot.

After some years, clipless pedals came out and I switched to those. They gave a somewhat better connection than the old cycling shows with old cleats but it was not a really big improvment.

I have tried 2 systems of clipless pedals: SPD (mountain) and LOOK. They both have advantages and disadvantagees versus each other and vs the sneaker route.

advantages VS Sneakers - much better contact with the pedal
- much better foot protection
- much better power transfer

disadvantages vs sneakers - not really good for walking
- until you get used to them, you are likely to have a few falls. This happens when you come to a stop sign, stop and say "OH S***!!!" as you recall you have not clipped out and you slowly keel over and hit the pavement. A way to protect against this is to initially practice clipping in and clipping out until it gets to be automatic when you come to a stop.

LOOK VS SPD

LOOK - bigger area of cleat to pedal contact and better power conversion
- pretty terrible to walk in and easy to fall on waxed tile
- considered "serious" in roadie circles
- when the cleats get dirty, you can find it very hard to clip out
- cleats wear out and have to be replaced
SPD - you can actually walk in them fairly well
- has shoes that are actually pretty good for casual walking or even short hikes
- cleats do not wear out

I would advise you to give serious consideration to clippless pedals and bike shoes and I would also suggest going SPD unless you get really serious on performance road riding.

Pat

p8rider

DG - Up until this Dec I always rode wearing my Stan Smith's. I never had a problem. I had people warn me about softness of sole and getting hot spots, but never felt any particular problem and so going with the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" philosophy I just pedaled onward, a happy camper.
As you know in Dec. I got the Trek 5200. Along with this came Look clipless pedals and Diadora shoes. I must say in the last few months of riding, that the bike shoes are superior to the Stan Smith's. They are much firmer and more comfortable. Perhpas it's a case of "what you don't know can't hurt you", but now that I know the difference, I want to ride with good cycling shoes.
Lastly I still use the Stan Smith's when I ride with my children on our excursions through the neighborhoods. That's when I ride the P8.

Artkansas 

Harming the bones? Oh Puleeez! How long did your ancestors walk around before shoes were invented? You don't need shoes. You could even bicycle bare footed if you like.

He's a clever bicycle salesman not a podiatrist. He doesn't have to be pushy. He knows its the kind of argument that with doubts, eats away internally like acid.

The tingling you should check out with a podiatrist. But medical considerations aside do you want to upgrade? Maybe. That's an individual call.

Velo Dog

The injury issue, IMO and in my doctor riding pal's opinion, is crap. The LBS guy may believe it or he may just be trying to sell you shoes and pedals, but as the doc says, "If your foot can stand the stress of walking, there's NOTHING in pedaling a bicycle that's going to hurt it."
As for the efficiency of clipless, I have to enter a contrarian view. My two main bikes are pretty decent (Atlantis set up for touring and fire roads, Rambouillet equipped for faster road riding), and I've owned them for four and two years, respectively, so I'm familiar with them. I generally ride the Atlantis (which is also my commuter 2-4 days a week) with platform pedals, toe clips and either athletic shoes or some old mountain bike shoes without cleats, because I like to get off and walk around. The Rambo has Looks and SPDs, which I swap occasionally to equalize wear on the shoes and pedals.
So: Over the years I've done dozens, if not hundreds, of rides on both bikes with every conceivable pedal/shoe combination, distances from three or four miles to centuries. I keep a fairly careful ride log, and I can't find ANY consistent difference in time, speed, perceived exertion, fatigue or anything else between clipless pedals and platforms with toe clips. Lately on the commute I've been using Power Grips, and they don't show any difference, either.
I'm not saying don't use them--use what works or what you like. But you're not going to hurt yourself with platforms, and you're not suddenly going to become Lance-like with a pedal change.

DnvrFox

Amazing how times change.

Near the turn of the century, in Denver, there was a huge cycling community.

Folks rode from Denver to Colorado Springs and back (about 120 miles) in a day on a dirt bike road, using single speed bikes, regular shoes and whatever contraptions they could figure out to wear, the women mostly wearing bloomers and dresses. And they seemed to survive just fine.

Nowadays, most of us would need

special shoes
Lycra
27-30 gears
clipless
etc., etc.

or we wouldn't even consider doing the same length ride!

Digital Gee

Are you referring to the 1890s? The 1910s? or the 1990s?

GrannyGear

When I consider some of the places I went as a kid, the distances, and the road surfaces...on my fat tire Schwinn that weighed as much as me, sometimes in flipflops or even barefoot.................and think of now, I go out armored with cell, CO2, tools, kevlar belts, lycra, clipless, etc. etc.

What ninny I've aged into. Ironic how our conception of "necessity" advances with the cutting edge of technology. Rivendell may hold the truth. Yet, that cell came in handy when I destroyed a tire far from home, etc.etc.

DnvrFox

Well, the turn of THE century, of course!

Around the 1900's.

Other turned centuries simply don't count.

The socially prominent bicycling communities across the country were rapidly displaced by the car culture. Bicycling was THE thing to do at one time. There weree bicycls clubs - actual buildings where folks would visit and stay overnight, bicycle social events, etc.

https://www.ibike.org/library/historytimeline.htm

1890 Mass Production: The bicycle helped make the Gay Nineties what they were. It was a practical investment for the working man as transportation, and gave him a much greater flexibility for leisure. Women would also start riding bicycles in much larger numbers.

1894 Change In Social Order: Betty Bloomer's bloomers become very popular. Ladies, heretofore consigned to riding the heavy adult size tricycles that were only practical for taking a turn around the park, now could ride a much more versatile machine and still keep their legs covered with long skirts. The bicycle craze killed the bustle and the corset, instituted "common-sense dressing" for women and increased their mobility considerably. Victorian women cyclists.* American Music and women bicyclists. Women and bicycles.

1894 The bicycle messenger business started in California when a railway strike halted mail delivery for the Bay Area. An ingenious bicycle shop owner in Fresno came up with the idea to deliver it by bicycle. He set up a relay between Fresno and San Francisco, with 6 riders covering about 30 miles each. The last rider would cover 60 miles.

1894-95 Annie Cohan (a.k.a. Annie Londonderry) bicycles around the world.* Scant information has her leaving Boston in June 1894 on her Sterling bike and finishing her ride in Chicago in Sept 1895.

1895 Ignatz Schwinn and Adolph Arnold formed Arnold, Schwinn & Company to produce bikes.

1896 "Let me tell you what I think of bicycling. I think it has done more to emancipate women than anything else in the world. I stand and rejoice every time I see a woman ride by on a wheel. It gives woman a feeling of freedom and self-reliance." Susan B Anthony

1898
1899
1900 Major Taylor was the American cycling sprint champion, and he topped all European champions as well. Taylor was one of the first black athletes to become a world champion in any sport. (Taylor is celebrated in Andrew Ritchie's the book "Major Taylor", Johns Hopkins University Press, 1996.)* See also: The Major Taylor Association, The Major Taylor Society and The Major Taylor Velodrome.

1903 Internal hub gears invented by Sturmey Archer.* By 1930 these were used on bikes manufactured around the world.* There dominance lasted until the 1950s the parallelogram derailleur was introduced. See also Sturmey Archer Bicycle Hubs.

1920 Kids Bikes: The focus of planning and development of the transportation infrastructure was the private automobiles. Bicycles use declined and the bicycle was considered primarily as children's toys. Kids bikes were introduced just after the First World War by several manufacturers, such as Mead, Sears Roebuck, and Montgomery Ward, to revitalize the bike industry (Schwinn made its big splash slightly later), these designs, now called "classic", featured automobile and motorcycle elements to appeal to kids who, presumably, would rather have a motor. If ever a bike needed a motor, this was it. These bikes evolved into the most glamorous, fabulous, ostentatious, heavy designs ever. It is unbelievable today that 14-year-old kids could do the tricks that we did on these 65 pound machines! They were built into the middle 50s, by which time they had taken on design elements of jet aircraft and even rockets. By the 60s, they were becoming leaner and simpler

GrannyGear

Dnvr.......you might know (not that you were living at the time .........there was a journal published some years ago written by a late 19th Century cyclist who left Oakland and crossed the country on a two-wheeler. Talk about Iron Men. Many adventures. Bears, ruffians, etc. I'd love to track down that book. If anybody knows, please post.

tom cotter

Do your feet hurt? If not, I'd go with that.

Sometimes my toes tingle and I wear cycling shoes.

Sometimes my fingers tingle and I wear cycling gloves.

Sometimes my butt tingles and I have a cycling seat.

We're the over 50 crowd, we're suppose to tingle.

The advantage of using cyling shoes has been well documented here, damaging your wallet is the only real danger. Still, put shoes on the list of must buy equipment. The benefits far out weigh the cost.

jppe

Gary-well thought out advice from all. There is no reason to mess with clipless or shoes right now unless you just want to got ahead and get accustomed to them while you're riding now-for sure would not put it on the Pink/Red bike. However if you'd like to go ahead and make that change it would be one less thing to adjust to when you get your road bike. I would recommend that you go with clipless and decent bike shoes when you make the plunge. You'll add speed and efficiency as you learn to use more of the pedal stroke.

stapfam

If you ever get into exercise other than cycling and require a pair of trainers and go to a GOOD sports shop- you will be surprised at the number of different types of footwear for the different exercises. They are not all fashion items that cost $$$$$'s for no other reason than to look good. Different shoes for different uses. The same in cycling. You may not want to go to clipless pedals yet but a proper cycling shoe will increase your pedal stroke and help in protecting the feet. You need a firm sole that does not flex too much. Then there is less power loss on the foot/ pedal and it does work.

I am not trying to talk you into going clipless, as the problems you will cause us with your falling over antics will have most of us in hospital with hernias from laughing too much- But think about getting a proper cycling shoe as your next expense. They do not have to be the roadie type and several manufacturesrs make a cycling shoe that looks like a trainer- and can ge fitted for clipless at a later date.

I use the SPD system of pedal, and now use Shimano shoes (And there are other manufacturers) which look like a trainer, and even with clips fitted do not ruin the Parquet flooring of the cafes we visit. Mind you the mud and stones that we deposit doesn't help much.

no motor?

I regularly wear and prescribe custom made orthotics, but don't wear them in the walking shoes I wear when pedaling. I've yet to have any foot pain/problems, aside from the chain lube that seems to end up on my shoes and socks, in the hour or so I'm out pedaling. And can't see how the pedaling would be any worse on your feet than walking or standing. As for the tingling, nerve problems can show up at the far end and work their way back to the brain - and your tingling could be coming from a number of places. Just like all those folks with hand and wrist pains that think they have Carpal Tunnel Syndrome - and don't.

Raketmensch

Lots of good advice here. My $0.02 is that back before I switched to clipless I had no foot injuries (and in my somewhat younger days I rode a lot of miles in sneakers). I did, however, have problems with foot cramps and numbness on longer rides. The switch to clipless fixed this immediately. More significantly, however, the switch to clipless was, for me, an amazing transformation in the feel of cycling. Cycling is (mechanically) all about using your body to power a machine, and the perceived improvement in power transfer to the pedals was, for me, remarkable.

So you may not be risking foot injury, but I do think you may be missing out on what is (for me -- your mileage may vary!!) one of the nicest upgrades to your cycling experience that you can make.