ModeratedUser150120149

Since no license is required, if a person gets a speeding ticket while riding a bike what do the points count against? Is a speeding citation just a meaningless thing as applied to bikers so just ignore it?

Among our crew here someone must know the answer.

Beverly

I know from experience that the same rules of the road apply to cyclists here in Ohio. A friend did an improper lane change on her bike and ran into the side of a car....she received a ticket for it. I don't think I would ignore it.

stapfam

Here in the UK I had a friend get caught speeding. The police could not believe that a bike could do 35mph in a 30 on the flat so were more interested in the bike than the offence. I have been warned by the police that even though I do not have a speedometer- doing 50mph downhill in a 30 is not strictly legal.

BUT- A policeman can stop and issue you with a ticket over here for speeding on a bike. He will need proof but with the radar traps- cars with cameras tied to the speedo and radar fitted- he can get that.

Kurt Erlenbach

It depends on the law of the state where you (or your friend) lives. In Florida, a ticket given to a cyclist will cost you money, but not license points.

Getting a speeding ticket on my bike is my goal in life. If I got one, I'd contest it and then make sure everyone in court knew I got a speeding ticket on my bike.

Lightingguy

My understanding of NY State law is the cyclist merely pays a fine, there are no points against a license. Mostly as the "drivers" license is for motor vehicle use, which you are not doing when riding a bike.

Steve B.

JohnDThompson 

I've often wondered how you can be charged with speeding if you're not required to have a speedometer.

N.B. I don't have any computers on my bikes, not that I go fast enough to get a speeding ticket in the first place.

Allegheny Jet

I've tried to get speeding tickets while on a bike. I will frame the ticket and put in on the wall in our family room. I do draw the line regarding tickets in school zones or involving school buses. I do have some standards.

khutch

I doubt that the answer varies much by state. In Illinois a traffic ticket of any kind is also a summons to appear in traffic court (unless you are an out of state driver, then you can just plead guilty and pay the fine by mail). So you will go to court which you will find to be a complete kangaroo court where you will be convicted and fined. If you have a valid driver's license I am quite sure that the points will be assessed against your driver's license and your auto insurance company will be notified. If you have no driver's license then those sticks cannot be used to beat you. Now generally in Illinois you would have the opportunity to plead guilty in return for a "supervision" that will generally last 6 months to a year. If you complete the supervision period without another violation you get no points and your insurance company is not notified. As part of the supervision you will be required to attend a remedial drivers education course which generally is a one evening classroom session that you will pay upwards of $100 for in addition to the the fine which is probably going to be $75 plus "court fees" which are generally $25. So you are looking at around $200 and I doubt the fact that you are a cyclist will save you from any of this since you are expected to obey the same laws as a motorist and have been convicted of failure to do so. If that strikes you as "meaningless" then yeah, try getting a ticket every day!

Oh, I see, you want to "ignore" the ticket. If you fail to appear in court Officer Friendly will pay you a visit at your home a day or two later and he will not be in a good mood. I'd guess you would double the above costs and multiply the inconvenience factor by 10 if you tried that stunt.

Now, while I do not suggest that you treat a traffic citation as a meaningless trifle to be ignored, I do have to respect anyone who manages to get a speeding ticket on a bike as long as it is done at a time and location where others are not endangered. Shame on you if you blow through a school speed zone. Kudos to you if you manage to break a 30 mph limit on flat ground away from pedestrian congestion! If you do the crime, be prepared to pay the fine, and then hang the framed court papers on your wall as a badge of honor. I believe that local cyclists have told me there is a downhill stretch of county road leading into Lake Geneva, Wisconsin, where the local officers of the law have apprehended speeding cyclists. It is steep enough and the speed limit is low enough that it is not difficult for a cyclist to go fast enough to draw the attention of the blue lights. I don't know if that is just a story people tell or if there have been actual tickets issued to cyclists. I suspect the story has some basis in fact even if it is only one cyclist and one ticket. In most cases I think the police are unlikely to even put the radar gun on you and if you are over the limit you are unlikely to be far enough over the limit to prod them into action unless the novelty of the thing just appeals to them.

Ken

cyclinfool

Where I went to college the campus speed limit on many streets was 15mph - they routinely pulled over cyclist.

DnvrFox

Colorado does NOT assess points, but fines as if you were a morotist.

(12) (a) Any person who violates any provision of this section commits a class 2 misdemeanor traffic offense; except that section 42-2-127 shall not apply.
(b) Any person riding a bicycle who violates any provision of this article other than this section which is applicable to such a vehicle and for which a penalty is specified shall be subject to the same specified penalty as any other vehicle; except that section 42-2-127 shall not apply.

42-2-127 is the section assessing points against a driver's license

ModeratedUser150120149

Why should I plead guilty if I'm not?

I don't think it is an unheard of feat to break urban speed limits of 15 to 25mph on a road bike or a recumbent. Most of them are on streets that have little or no traffic and in some I know no buildings either. They just happen to fall in an area that has a blanket speed limit. Along comes the biker who happens to encounter a LE taking a break in what he thought was an out of the way place.

I think what CO does is probably the norm. After all a bike is a vehicle with no operator's license required.

Ignore it or not? Lots and lots of drivers don't have licenses and successfully drive for years until fate brings them to law enforcement attention from someother event.

ahsposo 

One of my most proud moments as a cyclist was bombing through my college campus just at the lunch hour, this was a slight down hill with a tail wind, and I attracted the attention of the Pinkerton-in-a-Cushman that was supposed to be giving out parking tickets. He decided to give chase in his three wheeled contraption, lights and siren yes sir, as I made my way to the student center. This is right down the main drag of our campus and this hot pursuit became the spectacle of the day.

The best part for me was a professor of mine heard the siren, turned, and saw the finale of the action. It gave him such a laugh (he literally rolled on the ground) that I not only was guaranteed a pass in his totally difficult Music Theory class (I had no business being in this class) but I got a great apartment sitting gig (he had an amazing place) out of it. An adrenalized Barney Fife gave me this lecture about safety that attracted a most appreciative crowd. Like a toothless dog after he "caught" me he had no idea what to do with me. He could write a citation for illegal parking but he couldn't give a speeding ticket.

I got pulled one other time on a military post for speeding. 40 in a 25 zone. Big tail wind. MP was not any where near as funny as the rent-a-cop but had no more idea what to do with me. Stern lecture and no appreciative audience.

khutch

As a car driver I have, shall we say, a certain amount of experience with the traffic law enforcement system. I cannot honestly say that I have ever been pulled over unjustly. Never. And I suppose that is why traffic courts behave pretty much as kangaroo courts. Traffic officers rarely hand out tickets without cause. But, if you don't want to plead guilty you certainly do not have to plead guilty in Illinois. If you are an out of state resident you are welcome to appear in court on your scheduled court date and plead as you wish. Good luck with that! If you are an Illinois resident you do not have the option to plead guilty and skip the court date.

I don't believe there are any public streets near me with limits below 30mph and if there are they are 25mph. School speed limits are only active on school days and when children are present but they will be in the 15 to 20mph range. It is possible for a cyclist to exceed any of those limits. In my case I need a downgrade to top 30 and there is a street with sufficient slope near my home where I routinely do that. You'd have to be going close to 40 to get a ticket in a 30mph zone near here and I can't do that even on that street. But the law is the law and it applies to all road users, motorized or not. If you are exceeding the speed limit on your bicycle you have no reason whatsoever to complain if you are ticketed.

You can ignore speed limits just as motor vehicle operators can ignore licensing and insurance laws. You can ignore them day in and day out with total impunity. Until the day you are stopped and ticketed. You can ignore road regulations all you want but you cannot ignore the ticket. The ticket is a legal notice you must obey. The system will track you down and make you pay if you try to ignore a ticket. The OP, perhaps in jest, posited that since he could be assessed no "points" that traffic tickets had no teeth. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Traffic tickets are armed with plenty of teeth and they are the primary means of punishing traffic offenders. Point systems are merely secondary punishments for drivers/riders who are so bad that the normal tickets, fines, court costs, and driver's classes are insufficient to encourage better behavior. Basically if you are running afoul of your state's point system you really should be banned from the road.

Ken

Lightingguy

That's pretty funny. Come take a drive in NYC some time. The Highway Patrol ROUTINELY pulls over and tickets motorists without due cause. It's happened to me twice. There are websites dedicated to the issue. Most NYC Cops, IMO are complete unprofessional *******s. About the only ones that are not, ride horses.

SB

chuckb

One our LBS' (Contes Arington) has a ride that everyone calls the Conte's Hills Ride every Tuesday night during spring/summer. There's a great downhill section on Military Rd, where we make multiple passes and I manage to set off the "your speed is" radar sign everytime; I typically manage 35-40 in a 30 zone. I'd LOVE to get a speeding ticket there, so I could go to court, frame it, etc.

oilman_15106

A great new source of revenue for all the bankrupt states and municipalities!

khutch

Ok, perhaps it is not a statement that applies across the US uniformly. I have never been pulled over when I did not deserve to be. I have frequently not been pulled over when I did deserve to be. I have driven a fair amount in New York State, I have never driven in New York City.

Curiously I do not know if Illinois even has a point system any more. I can find some web references to it, I can find nothing about it in the online state codes or the Secretary of State's website. Perhaps we had one and then scrapped it. I can find the following discussion of driver's license suspensions in Illinois in the online State Code of Law:

" (625 ILCS 5/6‑206) (from Ch. 95 1/2, par. 6‑206)
Sec. 6‑206. Discretionary authority to suspend or revoke license or permit; Right to a hearing.
(a) The Secretary of State is authorized to suspend or revoke the driving privileges of any person without preliminary hearing upon a showing of the person's records or other sufficient evidence that the person:
1. Has committed an offense for which mandatory revocation of a driver's license or permit is required upon conviction;
2. Has been convicted of not less than 3 offenses
against traffic regulations governing the movement of vehicles committed within any 12 month period. No revocation or suspension shall be entered more than 6 months after the date of last conviction; "



I am only quoting the first few lines of that section which goes on at some length describing other circumstances which can result in a suspension. The provision that people most commonly run afoul of is section 2, three traffic convictions in a 12 month period. Note that there is no exclusion of bicycle convictions. In fact the word bicycle is not mentioned in this entire section of the code which details the laws and regulations regarding suspensions and revocations of an Illinois driver's license. I think you have to assume that in Illinois you could lose your driver's license by repeatedly being ticketed for speeding, ignoring stop signs, etc, while on your bicycle. I'm not saying it is likely, just that the law appears to allow it.

Ken

Wogster

I think it depends on what you present as identification, when pulled over. If your not required to provide a drivers licence, then don't. If you provide a drivers licence, and the LEO puts that number on the ticket, then you could find that bicycle or no, it goes on your driving record, even if it's noted on the ticket that you were on a bicycle at the time. If tickets are punched into a computer by the officer, then printed, your probably safe. If it's hand written, the data entry drone is probably only going to makes sure the licence number, citation number, offence code and speed are correct, and it's going on your driving record. This can be expunged, but it may be very difficult, and expensive.

Lightingguy

All true and the ***** is how many people carry any sort of official ID with a picture that's NOT their drivers license ?. I've heard of folks here in NYC that don't have drivers licenses and when stopped by a cop - for correct reasons or not, get hauled in to the precinct, often WITHOUT their bike, which is usually just left on the side of the road, often not locked. The cops at the precinct then do the whole 9 yards, finger print, etc... until they can determine identity.

Like I said..... NYC cops are a-holes !.

SB

trackhub

In MA, the law was changed last year. Any civil violations that you are found responsible (Guilty) for while bicycling, will not become part of your driving record. You need not produce a driver's license on demand of an officer, when cycling. This is all in chapter 85, section 11C of the general laws. Linkage.

In lieu of a driver's license, I don't know what officers would find "acceptable". I'm sure a state issued ID card* would be fine, but beyond that? Anyone care to speculate?

*As in most states, the MA Registry of Motor Vehicles, (That's our DMV, for you west coasters) will issue an identification card to persons who need an ID, but don't have a license.

Lighteningguy, I have heard so much about the NYPD's attitude toward cyclists, all of it bad. Oh well, at least in NYC, we now know what happens to schoolyard bullies when they grow up.

LAriverRat

I got a speeding ticket in 1963 for doing 35 mph+ on my 10 speed on flat ground. The cop paced me, when i went to court the Judge through it out after a few chuckles. I was 18 then and this was my first road bike. I only weighed 145 pounds.

Lightingguy

Yup and I really don't get it. NYC has been doing wonderful things to expand bike paths and especially on-street bike lanes. I am finding them all the time now, when 15 years ago, when I started bike commuting, they were rare. Not that the typical motorists cares a whim for a bike lane, as they park in them like it's their private driveways.

But for all that terrific stuff being done by the Parks Dept., the cops are in the dark ages. I started noticing it around 9/11 when Mayor Rudy took the opportunity to send a message that the "City needs to be protected" with attending new respect and (correctly) thanks given to those doing the defending. IMO the police have since developed an attitude towards the citizens of an overblown sense of worth, perhaps taking the "we're on the front lines defending you" a touch too far, with a real feeling from cops that whatever they do is OK as they're defending the city. That gets carried way too far at times, witnessing the arrests outside Madison Square Garden during the Republican Convention, as well as the entirely hostile attitude towards the Critical Mass rides, that subsequently and seemingly taught all the cops that cyclists are they enemy. I don't agree with CM's and in this city feel that they have been detrimental to the cause. What other city has it's cops park themselves at the foot of a bike lane on a bridge, simply to write tickets to riders for minor infractions (no lights, bell, reflector), etc... Or the incident on St Patty's day where the comish stopped in his motorcade on 5th ave. to help a women that had a collision with a cyclist. The women was laying in the road with a bloody head after the collision. The cops wrote 3 tickets to the cyclists for No Lights, No reflectors and non-working brakes - for a single speed. Mind you that 99% of the cyclists in the city ride bikes with no lights as they never ride at night, but the state law says you have to have them. In this incident - for which I never seen a follow up, the cyclist may well have been in the right and the women could have been jaywalking, but was issued no summons. The cops ASSUMED the cyclist was in the wrong, so wrote him up.

So goes cycling in NYC and sorry for the rant as I now go get changed for my morning bike commute.

SB

Lightingguy

And on today's commute, while RIDING over the Marine Parkway Bridge from Rockaway Beach to Brooklyn, lo and behold a stream of 30 or so NYPD Bike Patrol officers-in-training, including 5 or 6 instructors, each and every one pedaling furiously up the long 1/2 mile incline.

Mind you they had just passed a sign as posted from the Triborough Bridge and Tunnel Authority, prohibiting riding a bicycle on the pedestrian path on the bridge, for the entire 1 mile length. Note that most everyone ignores this rule, and I've never heard of nor seen a TBTA cop giving out a ticket, but had to laugh at the image of them ticketing 40 or so of the NYPD.

SB

Connell

The county in which I live is one of the largest in the country (bigger than Rhode Island) but the bulk of the population lives in a corner, closest to the Denver metro area. The cops get most of their income from one 5-mile stretch of highway and they are infamous for stopping traffic and issuing tickets on the slightest of pretexts. On holiday weekends, you'll routinely see 7 or 8 of them along that stretch.

I've been pulled over for a myriad of reasons, many (although not all) of them fictitious. And I've had them tailgate me with their brights on, hoping I would commit an offense. The last ticket I received ($186) was after the cop followed me for 3 miles while I drove 1 mph below the limit. She claimed I was doing 15 over and when I asked her 'why' I would do that when I was perfectly aware she was behind me, she told me that if my speedo was broken, that was my problem. (I had the speedo calibrated later and it was perfect.) So, I could have used a day's vacation and fought the ticket in court but given that it was my word against her's, who were they going to believe?

Haven't yet received a ticket on a bike yet, but I'll bet if they saw me going over the speed limit, they wouldn't hesitate to issue one.

PhotoJoe 

In 8th grade, got a ticket for a rolling stop at a right turn. Went to court, paid my $8. That cop needed a hobby.

I ride with my family down one specific bike trail. The motors sit on this train, under a tree, running LADAR/RADAR. They clock us regularly, and announce the speed to my girls as they go by. Now, it's a competition to try to increase the speed! They love it.