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Bikes and Dogs

Old 05-08-10, 05:33 AM
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Torgrot
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Bikes and Dogs

Well my dear sister was out for an evening ride this last week and was attacked by a pack of four dogs. Despite being bitten several times, she managed to get far enough away to stop and call the poliice. They transported her to the hospital and she was released. She has three minor bites and one severe bite. The owners are have played switch the dog, probably because the one that bit her the most was a Pit Bull. If they can't find the dog she will have to get rabies shots. She was riding on rural roads in Indiana and of course the attack happened in one county and she fled to another county. Now every one is pointing at the other to do something about it.

She wants to know how do you stop the dogs? Most sprays are not effective, the vet suggested a gun, but I don't know where she could mount a shotgun on her bike. I was wondering if one of those compressed air horns, like they use for evacuation drills might work? Any other suggestions?
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Old 05-08-10, 05:40 AM
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That sucks, don't really have any suggestions, except perhaps a cheap camera mounted to get evidence? A gun might work, but tbh I don't have any experience of the problem.
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Old 05-08-10, 05:45 AM
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pepper sprey
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Old 05-08-10, 05:48 AM
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Thankfully, dog attacks of that severity are very rare in these parts. The horn might help with the dogs but I would definitely be talking to a lawyer about the owner.
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Old 05-08-10, 05:58 AM
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Mrs. Grouch and I were riding with another tandem couple when a fairly large sized dog came out to tell us we were crossing his turf. The other stoker pointed some kind of small gizmo at the dog that emitted a high frequency squeek. The dog acted like he had run into a glass wall, turned around and walked back in the direction he had come from. I don't know what, exactly the gizmo was and, while it worked once, that's the only time I've ever seen one. I have no way of knowing how reliable it actually is.

I know that a lot of people swear by pepper spray's in various strengths but I've never seen anybody use one successfully from a bike. On the other hand, I have very little experience with pepper sprays.

The idea of trying to use a gun against a moving target while you're riding a bicycle and while you're upset because you're under attack strikes me as utterly stupid. I'm thinking that it probably isn't going to work and, even if it does, it's going to create a whole new set of problems for yourself.
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Old 05-08-10, 06:03 AM
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Get a small portable air horn. You can get them the size just bigger than chap stick. When they get close, hit em with it. My neighbors annoying dogs won't even come near my side of the fence anymore and it worked at my inlaws house also. They came charging to the fence and right as they got close I hit it. Never seen 2 animals turn tail and run so fast in my life
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Old 05-08-10, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
Mrs. Grouch and I were riding with another tandem couple when a fairly large sized dog came out to tell us we were crossing his turf. The other stoker pointed some kind of small gizmo at the dog that emitted a high frequency squeek. The dog acted like he had run into a glass wall, turned around and walked back in the direction he had come from. I don't know what, exactly the gizmo was and, while it worked once, that's the only time I've ever seen one. I have no way of knowing how reliable it actually is.
DO you think it might have been this: https://www.tbotech.com/dogchaser.htm

Don't know if it would really work but looks interesting
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Old 05-08-10, 06:35 AM
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Of all the things I have seen used on dogs, nothing that needed to be aimed from a moving bike at an aggressive dog ever worked. Guns, sprays etc... Hence the question about the air horn. I am wary of the claims of ultrasonic devices, no not wary, I think that is just bs. It takes power to make noise and you just can't pack enough in a nine volt battery. I am sorry, I am more than a little angry with people who have animals that they don't control and don't take personal responsibility for.
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Old 05-08-10, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by cyclinfool View Post
DO you think it might have been this: https://www.tbotech.com/dogchaser.htm

Don't know if it would really work but looks interesting
Might be. It looks like it's about the right size.

As smoothly and casually as the other stoker pulled it out leads me to believe they'd used it before and they had confidence it was going to work. Like I say, however, that's the only time I've seen one work. So far as I'm concerned it's one-for-one but that's not a very big sample size.
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Old 05-08-10, 08:49 AM
  #10  
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In the electric business, our meter readers are now carrying a stun baton that is the size of a flashlight and runs on batteries. They have reported that they don't actually have to stun the dog. In most instances, they discharge the device which makes a loud electrical sound and the dogs (even pit bulls) don't want to have anything to do with it. They're also fairly inexpensive.
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Old 05-08-10, 09:13 AM
  #11  
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I've tried various strategies on dogs and wound up getting bitten seven times (none serious) in the process. One pit bull jumped for my throat but missed.

IMO, the most effective strategy if you can't outrun a dog is to stop and get off the bike, and use it as a weapon/shield between you and the dog. This is very good for a single dog, but difficult with a circling pack of dogs. Many dogs will run away if you pick up a rock (or just pretend, if none available) and make a throwing motion. Be careful when you get back on the bike, some dogs will stop the attack when you get off, only to resume as soon as you start rolling again.

Yelling or air horns can be effective, but not sure fire. Spraying with water or pepper spray is difficult from a moving bike. Practice is recommended, especially with pepper spray.

I recently read that wasp & hornet spray is more effective than pepper, sprays farther, and is cheaper. I would think this might damage the mutt, if that bothers you.

If there is auto traffic, you can time your passing to use a car as a shield or distraction for the dog.

Kicking is good if the dog attacks from the side, but quite difficult if he comes from behind. Carrying a stick is difficult but was pretty effective the few times I could find one when needed and tried it. If you carry a frame pump, it could be used, but isn't very heavy.

I want to try a paint ball gun, but I don't have one and they would probably be hard to carry.

If you take the suggestion to get a camera, be sure to post the video of you getting bitten. That would be classic.
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Old 05-08-10, 09:23 AM
  #12  
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Trying to unpack a pistol while doing some evasive riding is a recipe for disaster. I vote for the air horn, stun baton or pepper spray. Seems that the air horn might also attract help if needed. Could it be mounted on the handle bar via a light holder?

Give our best to your sister with hopes that she heals up quick and no fear of riding in the future.
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Old 05-08-10, 09:52 AM
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Just this morning, I had a dog take chase on my commute home. I gave a 5-second blast on my AirZound horn, and the dog gave up. Since the cities around here have passed ordinances against loose dogs, it has been a long time since I have heard the sound of barking/claws on the road/dog tags jangling that signal a dog on the chase, but the horn seemed to work today.
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Old 05-08-10, 10:25 AM
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I see people who are frequent walkers carrying large sticks or clubs. This one guy carries a club with a metal ball on the end. I suppose you could carry a collapsible baton in a holster. You would need to practice taking it out and using it while riding though.Dont let you neighbors see you doing that they will think you've flipped your lid. Some people claim that a squirt gun full of ammonia works but again how do you draw that while trying to ride away.

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Old 05-08-10, 10:56 AM
  #15  
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If you decide to use a stick or frame pump to swing at dogs, just be sure where the arc of the swing takes it. Sticks have a way of finding the spokes of a wheel and you could end up flat on your back with dogs all around.
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Old 05-08-10, 03:41 PM
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Torgrot,

Sorry to hear that your sister was attacked and bitten. Glad that she is alive to tell the tale.
From the sounds of it, could have been life threatening.

Several years ago, walking to the library, I was attacked on the street by a small size female pit bull. Fortunately for me, when the dog jumped up to bite me on the gut, she bounced off. My injury would no doubt have been much worse had the dog been bigger with bigger jaws.

I called the cops, the canine enforcement officer looked for and did not find the dog.
If the cops there have id on some or all of the dogs I would waste no time and sue each of the owners in small claims court.
What is the dollar limit in your jurisdiction for small claims ($7500 in California)
GIVE-EM-HELL!

What works?
I undersatand that "Wasp Spray" is very effective.
I know from using it on my house that it gives good range.


The doctor that treated me at county counciled me that rabies is very rare, she further suggested that a rabies shot was not necessary. I took her advice and suffered no ill effect. I expect if rabies is common in your area then the shots, however painful would be indicated.

Jeff, still fat
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Old 05-08-10, 06:54 PM
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Batons and clubs require you to swing at the dog. Pepper spray does not. If I see an attack coming, I can hold the spray can while keeping my hand close to the normal handlebar position. I have sprayed dogs while the owner watched without the owner knowing I sprayed their mutt.

I'll bet I have sprayed over 20 dogs with Halt and it has always worked for me. Maybe you all just need a little bit of good old target practice. I haven't had any problem hitting dogs in the face. I did once put my bike into a serious wobble when I tried to spray a dog with my water bottle. That was before I started carrying Halt.
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Old 05-08-10, 07:03 PM
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BEAR SPRAY. Developed to be used in the wilderness where you would encounter a bear. It can be used faster than you can unshoulder your gun especially if you are surprised by a bear. Usually you know a dog comming at you and that gives you time to react. Just velcro the spray to the haldle bars. Bear spray shoots much further than pepper spray.

Google it and check it out. I like the Counter Assualt brand. Not cheap but cheaper than medical care for a dog bite or a fall or a damaged bike.

A last thought. I saw where someone thought wasp and hornet spray would work. That kind of spray is a POISON and is formulated to KILL wasps and hornets on contact. By using it on a dog, even one attacking you, you could make yourself liable for injuries to the dog.

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Old 05-08-10, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by TrailDogger View Post
BEAR SPRAY. Developed to be used in the wilderness where you would encounter a bear. It can be used faster than you can unshoulder your gun especially if you are surprised by a bear. Usually you know a dog comming at you and that gives you time to react. Just velcro the spray to the haldle bars. Bear spray shoots much further than pepper spray.

Google it and check it out. I like the Counter Assualt brand. Not cheap but cheaper than medical care for a dog bite or a fall or a damaged bike.

A last thought. I saw where someone thought wasp and hornet spray would work. That kind of spray is a POISON and is formulated to KILL wasps and hornets on contact. By using it on a dog, even one attacking you, you could make yourself liable for injuries to the dog.
Actually given the circumstance cited by the OP that is a Great result! You injured the dog that injured you. Owner comes forward with dog. Law enforcement seizes dog and tests dog. You now know what medical treatment is appropriate. Also, you now know who to sue for your bills. Plus, in many jurisdictions both the owner and the dog face criminal charges.
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Old 05-08-10, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Latitude65 View Post
Actually given the circumstance cited by the OP that is a Great result! You injured the dog that injured you. Owner comes forward with dog. Law enforcement seizes dog and tests dog. You now know what medical treatment is appropriate. Also, you now know who to sue for your bills. Plus, in many jurisdictions both the owner and the dog face criminal charges.
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Old 05-09-10, 12:07 AM
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I understand - and share - your sister's anger and concern. Sadly, I don't think there's a single solution that will cover all the circumstances in which you'll encounter aggressive dogs. The vast majority will not pursue an attack if you get off the bike and face them down. Those that don't are nothing more than unregistered weapons. Horrifying as her particular circumstances were, I have to say I doubt that they are very common - not that that's much comfort to her.

There was a long and interesting exchange on this subject here. My favourite posts are the description of riding zigzag while being pursued by dogs, and the chap who shouted 'Sit!' to two rottweilers.

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Old 05-09-10, 06:33 AM
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I have read all the items with interest. Most seem to be written by people who have not been attacked by a dog. They seem to be in the vein of "If I were attacked" this is what I would do. I think the issue that most have missed is this was not a single dog. I was surprised by the number that suggested getting off her bike and facing the dogs. I think in the same situation as my sister, surrounded by four snarling, snapping dogs, my only instinct would be to do as she did and pedal my half century ass off as fast and as hard as I could in a near panic.

She was getting ready for a organized ride near her home, on the ride route. A ride she has done a number of times, with out being attacked. She won't be riding this year. Listening to her talk, she may not ever ride again. That is the real tragedy for her. She really loved riding. She wasn't the best or the fastest, but she was out there every chance she could.
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Old 05-09-10, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Torgrot View Post
I have read all the items with interest. Most seem to be written by people who have not been attacked by a dog. They seem to be in the vein of "If I were attacked" this is what I would do. I think the issue that most have missed is this was not a single dog. I was surprised by the number that suggested getting off her bike and facing the dogs. I think in the same situation as my sister, surrounded by four snarling, snapping dogs, my only instinct would be to do as she did and pedal my half century ass off as fast and as hard as I could in a near panic.

She was getting ready for a organized ride near her home, on the ride route. A ride she has done a number of times, with out being attacked. She won't be riding this year. Listening to her talk, she may not ever ride again. That is the real tragedy for her. She really loved riding. She wasn't the best or the fastest, but she was out there every chance she could.
+1,000

Buy her a handlebar clip holder, and some Halt, from Nashbar, teach her how to use it (It will also bolster her "safe" feelings); and, do everything you can to get her back on her bike. You will both be happy you did.

p.s. get in the car, and go "looking" for those curs!!!!!
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Old 05-09-10, 07:42 AM
  #24  
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So sorry to read about this incident. I can't imagine how traumatized your sister must be. My Jack Russell Terrorist will sometimes jump on her sweet Beagle sister, and a dog fight is a fearsome thing to behold...so I know a pack of dogs on attack would be awfully scary.

There were a couple of dogs (pit bulls!) who invariably gave chase when I rode by. It bothered me enough to completely alter my usual route to avoid those houses. I also often ride by a farm where two Australian sheep dogs hang out on the porch. They come running out after me, but as soon as I shout "No!" they stop and head back to the house. Loves me a smart, well-trained dog. If it's a little yapper, I have stopped and so have they. Oftentimes, the little ones just want to chase something, so you take that away.

I hope your sister's body and psyche heal soon.
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Old 05-09-10, 07:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Lauraspark View Post
So sorry to read about this incident. I can't imagine how traumatized your sister must be. My Jack Russell Terrorist will sometimes jump on her sweet Beagle sister, and a dog fight is a fearsome thing to behold...so I know a pack of dogs on attack would be awfully scary.

There were a couple of dogs (pit bulls!) who invariably gave chase when I rode by. It bothered me enough to completely alter my usual route to avoid those houses. I also often ride by a farm where two Australian sheep dogs hang out on the porch. They come running out after me, but as soon as I shout "No!" they stop and head back to the house. Loves me a smart, well-trained dog. If it's a little yapper, I have stopped and so have they. Oftentimes, the little ones just want to chase something, so you take that away.

I hope your sister's body and psyche heal soon.
I think it's mostly about the chase in a majority of cases. I don't get chased often, but when I do it's usually in rural areas and then the chase is most often abandoned at the property line. It's a territorial thing for them.
A pack is different. I worry about those, although I've never been bitten, I've been scared a time or two.
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