My best riding times is always been after a few days of rest. My heart rate is up and my average mph is greater. I would go with resting.

I've improved my fitness dramatically over the past year, reducing my resting HR by something like 30bpm. I've certainly also improved the power I can put out without pushing my HR up, but when I do push hard, I've set new HR records. My max is at least 10 beats higher than I had thought it was a year ago. When I'm unable to push my HR up, it is always the results of fatigue: either towards the end of long hard ride/race, after a series of hard days, or from a lack of nutrition and rest. That last one really bit me hard once - I was flat out unable to complete a workout. I couldn't get my HR up no matter what; my body just would not respond. Hard lesson on eating and sleeping!

I've learned that, when Hermes offers an opinion, it's a good idea to give it a lot of weight. Of course, he's probably just passing on his uber-fast wife's thoughts. :-)

I'd love to hear what your HR does in response to an intense intervals session. If it zooms right up there, you generate great results, and it pops right back down, then you are not fatigued. If, however, your HR doesn't respond to the intervals, by getting close to the max you've seen in the past, then you know something is "off". I've learned to pay attention anytime my HR doesn't do what I expect it to do. Either direction can be a sign of fatigue, and there is a fine line between maximizing your training, and crossing over into 'dead-cyclist-riding' land.

Wow, did you ever ring bells in my little noggin!

First - I don't always get the rest I need, and I have seen and felt the results, and they are never good.

Second - I worry about my weight, a lot, sometimes to the detriment of not eating right or enough. I've seen those results, and - well, "bonk early, bonk often".

I did notice on the 65 mile ride I did Saturday that my heartrate definitely dropped later in the ride and would not come up - and I felt the result, as in "tired".

I will try your suggestions and report back!

Oh, I've already decided that Hermes knows of what he speaks! I owe him!

Losing/controlling weight and training hard are a tough combo to balance! I think a lot of folks lose weight in the off season, and then let it creep back up during the season as they ensure they are getting enough fuel. I now really pig out the for the couple of days before a long hard ride. I've gained 3-4 pounds during these past few weeks of race prep. Lower riding volume (even at higher intensity) and more eating = weight gain.

But one of the advantages of training hard, and knowing you need to fuel your efforts, is that it forces you to eat the right stuff. I would never commit blasphemy by criticizing pie rides :innocent:, but other than the pie, you can't eat junk and expect to perform well riding the bike. So you maximize the benefit of what you put in your stomach.

"The right stuff" is my bane! I'm still trying to decide what that is as well as how much to eat.

I have a similar regimen. A week prior to a triathlon or a long ride I'll eat "more" and add much more protein (I tend to avoid protein). I do gain a couple of pounds (and fret and fret and FRET over doing it!), but it always dissolves in the week after the event.

In the off season I gain weight, three to four pounds, and loose it during the season - but, I'm a girl and my metabolism, fat layering and muscle mass is different than yours.

Ahhh, I see we're drifting afield of my original question, but in the process we're uncovering some of my (training) errors! Maybe I'll get to be a better climber (and faster sprinter) after all!

AZT, I am nothing without her.

For me to get a high or max heart rate, I need adrenaline, competition and fresh legs. The other factor is cadence. A slower cadence climbing equals lower heart rate. Hence, heart rate is a very rough to poor indicator of anything other than how fast your heart is beating. Heart rate trends over time are more relevant and how you feel very important.

I attended a racing club meeting last night and we had a speaker from Echelon Grand Fondo. They promote a couple of very cool local Grand Fondos. After his sales pitch, he talked about nutrition, weight loss and cycling. Here we have a skinny bike racer talking to a bunch of skinny bike racers on how to lose another 10 pounds. Anyway, you got the picture.

The key takeaway was do not eat for at least 3 hours before you ride. If you get up in the morning and are going on a ride or race, you do not need to eat anything and it is better if you do not. Just drink water and eat 200 calories per hour on the bike. Cyclists eat way to much. There is no eating after 8PM at night and absolutely no alcohol after 8PM. Isn't that special.

This is not the first time I heard the do not eat anything in the morning before cycling. We got the same lecture from a nutritionist who plans meals for RAAM. The theory is when you wake up in the morning, you are fully stocked and you have plenty of glycogen for a couple of hours. If you do not eat anything, the body selects fat burning and is very efficient. And there is no blood diverted for digestion leaving more available for power production.

This morning I did a track workout and decided not to eat anything. I was a little hungry at first but it passed and I did my efforts with minimal caloric intake. I must admit, I felt pretty good and the efforts seemed easy although they were not.

That's interesting. I generally don't ride for at least 3 hours after eating and I find that I still have enough in the tank unless I'm climbing a lot of hills. I generally don't eat or I eat very little while riding (usually a granola bar or something in the 200 calorie range) every hour and I find that I'm not hungry at all when I'm done. I actually tend to eat less through the day on the days when I'm riding.

Am I fitter ? Yes.
Has my avg. HR gone down with time? Yes.
Have I taken off any more weight even though I'm eating less ? Nope. Those last 10 pounds are going to be stubborn ones. I think I should have a jersey made up that says:

"By all means carry a spare when you ride and I don't mean the one around your middle."

Uh-oh.

I usually eat as late as 10pm at night due to work. On the mornings of rides, I eat breakfast - granola, yogurt, water, coffee - an hour before the ride, maybe a little earlier. On the mornings of long rides, I eat a half a bagel with peanut butter, once again, about an hour before the ride. During rides I'll eat a banana or a 200 calorie bar of some sort and drink water. After rides, within a half hour of stopping, I'll eat again - usually a salad, more yogurt, more grains of some sort, and perhaps protein.

I'm a mess, aren't I?

Join us in the 50+ racing thread... lots of great info there. And if you figure out how to sprint and climb faster, please let me know.

Oh, I'm NOT a racer! OMG, not at all. It's funny, one of the fellas in the club I ride with thinks I'd be a good velodrome rider. I have NO idea what he bases that notion on!

Hi sarals, are you using your 566 for climbing? If so, how do you like it. I think it's a great bike myself.

It's my only road bike, and I LOVE it! It's comfortable, it's smooth, it's faster than I am, it's beautifully made and finished, and it's a really nice looking bike (like that counts!).

If you ride any distances around here, you're going to encounter climbs. You'd better bring a bike you can climb on! The 566 climbs well, my legs don't.

I'm glad you like it. I wish I could afford the 695, but that's out of my league.

I don't know if I have something going on with my heart as well. I have a RHR of 152, blood pressure is usually 109 over 67. I've been getting readings of 140 over 67. Did you ever hear of anybody that that's happening too?

You have a resting heart rate of 152? That sounds serious. As far as I know, your BP is not out of line, but I can't even begin to qualify that. Go see your doctor, perhaps?

Sorry about that, it is 52. I get nervous talking to woman.:p I am concerned about that 140 reading though. I have an appointment with a cardiologist next week.

No need to be nervous around me. I bite, but not hard! ;~)

No, that's a (far) better number. It seems to me like a nice, fit number. Very good on the appointment with your doc, if anything it's wise to have annual checkups, anyway, especially considering our "avocation".

Eating late is part of the problem when it comes to weight loss (or the lack of it). I'd try to avoid that as much as possible. My eldest son who is 22 gained about 25 pounds that way because he lives like a vampire when he's at school. He was eating way too much in the middle of the night because his body clock was offset by about 12 hours.

He was told that because his metabolic rate decreases at night, he was eating too much at the wrong time of day.

I abide by the "big meal in the morning, small meal at night" school of thought, and it's been working. However, in the last year, as I have really gotten in to improving my "performance" on my bicycle, as well as branching into triathlon (I never knew or expected I'd be an "athlete"), I'm finding my diet is all wrong. I am still trying to sort out what I should be eating, and just how much. I haven't wavered from the "big early, small late" plan, but what I should consume and the amount I'm still working out. The weight gain I have seen - six pounds in the last year - has apparently been mostly muscle. My thighs are noticeably larger, and are much harder, as are my calves. Over the same period my heart rate has come down, but what I have really noticed is how fast I can recover from stress, as I mentioned earlier. I shouldn't worry so much about my weight, but I do. I think that's a common thread for those of us who let our bodies go to seed, and then brought them back - I don't ever want to be there again. Additionally, I have grown to love the way I feel, and I love cycling and even running, now that I can do them without feeling like total crap. That has lead me to where I am now. I'm getting older, well, AM older, but I can still improve, and I want to see just how much I can do, as well as continue to enjoy what this new fitness brings me. And, my love affair with my bike increases along with my fitness gains. I couldn't ask for any more, especially considering I never expected any of this to happen.

Cycling is at once a sense of freedom and motion, and it's fluid and beautiful. The machines are gorgeous, and the people who ride them are just the best. I love where I am now.

Got a little ahead of myself...!

I had an issue with my heart rate, and being winded when I started cycling 3 weeks ago. After a week of no improvement, went to the Dr. and found out it was due to my blood pressure meds. Dr switched me to a new med, it seems to have improved significantly. Dr. also reminded me as I loose weight to check and make sure my BP isn't falling to low. The hope is, as I loose it, the BP will go down.

So what's my excuse? Seems like every winter I gain 10 lbs, Now in the process of working it back off. This doesn't seem to effect my HR but it does effect my speed and enjoyment. I think we all have this problem no matter what our gender. I think it more depends on the type of metabolism and body makeup. Not being an athlete and having that kind of build or body type I have to struggle hard for any gains and the more I gain the harder I have to work to sustain them. Sometimes I turn my head and slack up and then I have to start all over again.

I was being a bit facetious! Of course our weight fluctuations are body type and metabolism, as well as genetics. And now, age plays a big role! Believe me, it's a struggle for me to control my weight (I was 183 pounds a few years ago), and the only thing that does it for me is exercise and of course diet. If one or the other gets out of hand, uh-oh.

I'm not athletic, either. I'm short and I tend towards stocky. Like you, if I let up for more than three or four days, well, it's a week of work to get back what went away. My weight doesn't increase, but my strength decreases.

Oh, to be thirty again! Just musing....