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What are you eating? (Slightly OT)

Old 02-28-13, 06:58 AM
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What are you eating? (Slightly OT)

We are having a food scare in Europe at present and it is to do with processed meat. It would appear that "Some" of the processed meats contain Horsemeat. It is not unsafe or dangerous but if you buy a beef product- you expect it to be beef.

This has made me wonder about some of the other things we buy over here that are apparently healthy. There is the obvious point about contaminated foods and this can happen to any foodstuffs. One of the things we had over here a few years ago was fruit being treated to keep it fresh. Apples had a wax type film covering them to keep them fresher on the shelf and another current problem is pre-packed salads being washed in Chlorine to kill off any bugs. The washing will keep the bagged product looking fresh for up to 10 days but as soon as opened- they wilt within a couple of days.

So there is a big resurgence in local producers and farmers markets that can trace their product direct to the farm that produced it. I know with me- I like to grow as many vegetables in my own garden as I can but even I cannot grow enough to keep us going for the whole year so we have started using the farmers markets more.

But it got me thinking. Not that I use many but in cycling I use gels- power-bars and drink supplements. It has taken me a while to find the ones that do not affect me but looking down the list of ingredients there seem to be a "Lot" of E Numbers and artificial products used in the formula that I am eating and drinking. I have no idea what they are- what they are doing to my body and whether any of them are harmful in the long term. Then there are the "Healthier" products that I have noted on the supermarket shelves. Low sugar Sodas that although do they not have the fattening sugar in them- have other sweeteners that in the long term are harmful or have side effects that you really don'y want.

Perhaps it is the meat scare that is making me look at what I am eating- or am I getting paranoid about something I should not be worrying about? And more important-Do we really know what we are eating from within the modern Food chain?
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Old 02-28-13, 07:19 AM
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since last may 2012 i have for the most part avoided any processed food (some exceptions around the holidays). i have cooked (grilled) nearly all meals since then. we buy / cook from the perimeter of the grocery store - real (uncooked) meat, chicken, fish, port, eggs, real bacon. i do have some cheese (cheddar, swiss) also. then just about any green vegetable i want as well as stawberries, blueberries, as well as almonds and other type nuts. no bread, gluten, starches, nor dairy (other than the cheese and a small amount of greek yogurt). there is so much "real" food available and it does not take much time to prepare - so much better tasting and nutritious. sure makes a difference in how i feel and i never feel deprived and very rarely hungry. the infrequent times we do eat at a restarant, even if i eat what appears to be "real" food, i always have a stomach ache and feel like **** the next day. oh yea, lots of water; when you cook for yourself you actually have to pay attention to make sure you get enough salt(unlike eating out where everything is bathed in salt).

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Old 02-28-13, 08:07 AM
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Buying food you haven't produced yourself requires some trust whether it's produced by a large corporate farm a 1000 miles away or the small local farm down the road. I buy as much local products as possible. When the mood strikes for a hamburger I buy a small cut of top or bottom round local beef and grind it myself.
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Old 02-28-13, 08:41 AM
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I don't eat many processed or convenience foods, simply because I enjoy cooking. It would never occur to me to eat a frozen lasagne (one of the first things discovered to have horsemeat in Britain) when I can make one myself, that's far better, in about the same amount of time.

That's not to say I'm ignorant of the fact that in, say a lasagne I make, that the pasta and cheese are processed food products, and the tomatoes come from a can this time of year and were put inside the can at a factory, and the meat, well even if you buy at a butcher, it wasn't freshly slaughtered out back by the guy selling it to you. At best I perform only final assembly.

In season I buy locally grown produce, but it's hard to buy in something less than family quantities. A CSA drops off at the library where I work. I'd have a hard time getting a share home with me, let alone eating it before either it rots or the next week's share comes along.

So I buy at the farm markets on the way home. There's one I pass on Tuesdays, and another on Thursdays. But, this being Upstate New York, that really only covers about four months starting in July. I still have to eat in the other eight months.

Although I know how to do it, living in an apartment, I don't have storage space to can anything myself. Even canning a couple of bushels of tomatoes would be a challenge in my kitchen, even if I could store them.

Meanwhile I try not to feel guilty when the oranges at the store have traveled here from South Africa.

But a co-worker keeps chickens, so I get a dozen eggs ever couple of weeks.

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Old 02-28-13, 10:12 AM
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I was surprised to hear the problems in the European food supply system.

I do not trust the American food supply system either... It has a very low level of transparency (that is not by accident) and the problems are seen anytime there is a food scare -- it is nearly impossible to track the contaminated food back to it's source. But, after the scare, everybody forgets and goes back to assuming that the food they are eating is safe...

For myself, I am a vegetarian -- so that makes it a little easier to only "Eat those foods that grandma would recognize as food". Things such as vege's, beans, eggs, whole grains and so on... I do drink milk (which is probably loaded with hormones and all sorts of other nasty stuff) -- but you do what you can.
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Old 02-28-13, 10:22 AM
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Less if possible and hopefully no horse meat.
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Old 02-28-13, 10:37 AM
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My sons spent their Christmas break from college touring around Europe last year. They told me of all the "interesting" foods they had sampled along the way. Younger son said he had a horse steak (not sure which country they were in at the time) and it was the best steak he'd ever had.
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Old 02-28-13, 11:02 AM
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Far too many countries refuse to import American beef because it is considered unsafe...

From Reuters:

Russia set to halt imports of U.S. beef, pork
https://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...8B611420121207

from the article:
"Ractopamine is used as a feed additive to make meat leaner, but countries such as China have banned its use despite scientific evidence that it is safe. The United Nations has agreed on acceptable levels of the drug.

The U.S. Meat Export Federation told its members by email that since the U.S. Department of Agriculture had no testing and certification program in place for ractopamine, the Russian requirement could effectively halt U.S. pork and beef exports to the country by Saturday."

... and then there is "Mad Cow" disease to which the USDA tells us: "Don't Worry. Be Happy!" But the Europeans say: "We're not going to eat it!"
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Old 02-28-13, 12:36 PM
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Growing up as a child my father was concerned that we would get too far removed from food sources with the growth of chain markets. Hence, before we could eat any meat, we were required to witness how that meat came to be. Learning to hunt and fish we were always held to the standard that if you killed it, you were going to eat it. I came to like fishing more for that reason alone. You can almost always return the live fish back in the water. Not so once you pull the trigger. We also had a large bountiful garden that provided enough to put away for the winter months. Today, at 85 years of age, his garden is as large and bountiful as ever. All of this has resulted in our current household buying local produce when available and doing lots of research about the other things we eat. Finally, because I spent a good number of years living in my maternal grandmother’s home (she was a professional chef), I’ve got a fairly wide range of things that I’ll eat. Horse meat is not a problem for me. When I'm most concerned about food, is when riding centuries. The "homemade" food at rest stops and at the end of the ride concern me a wee bit.
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Old 02-28-13, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by stapfam
We are having a foodscare in Europe at present and it is to dowith processed meat. It would appear that "Some" of the processedmeats contain Horsemeat. It is not unsafe or dangerous but if you buy a beefproduct- you expect it to be beef.


I have fewer problems with the meat being horse,or even kangaroo, as there was a scandal involving that down under a few years ago, than I have with the way most beef is raised in the U.S, and W. Europe and Britain. Unsanitary feedlots and high protean diets that combine to make the cattle sick, unless pumped up with antibiotics, have made me swear off “industrial beef”. I buy only organic, grass fed beef, and since it is expensive, less of it. Not a bad thing since I have cholesterol issues. This is a double benefit in that the flesh of grass fed beef is lower in saturated fat than feed lot beef.

Originally Posted by stapfam
I know with me- I like togrow as many vegetables in my own garden as I can but even I cannot grow enoughto keep us going for the whole year so we have started using the farmersmarkets more.
My brother in law does this, but he is retired. I have a job, so I hit the farmers markets.

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Old 02-28-13, 03:04 PM
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Im thinking some horse meat jerky and M&Ms in a handle bar bag would be just the ticket for those long rides......
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Old 02-28-13, 03:07 PM
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Don't eat mammals. But if I did I would rather eat horse than cow. Cows are smarter and friendlier.
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Old 03-01-13, 02:01 AM
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I know that to keep energy levels correct for the exertions of cycling- you should eat well- eat the right foods and eat enough of them. Problem is trying to find those good foods and I am afraid that even buying from the "Good" suppliers- you still do not know what you are eating. But on those hard and long rides I find that I need supplements to keep energy levels up. Just done a hard hill and feeling tired- take a gel or a power bar- keep a drink bottle with energy supplement in it and keep snacking from the supply of fruit and carbs that you carry in your pockets.

I can do something about my normal diet and I do my best to eat correctly. But it is those High energy products that I take on the rides.Just looked at a gel pack and sugars- salt- fruit and caffeine I recognise. Then underneath the main ingredients there is a list that are in very small letters that has the list of preservatives and a list of other things that I do not recognise. Lots of "E" numbers and words I could not pronounce if I tried. What the hell are they? and what will they do to my system?

I know these supplements work to keep energy levels up on rides but I use them as Emergency rations. Take the gels only when required or when I have run out of my "Normal" food from the pockets so they are not something that I think will affect me in the long term. But it is still disconcerting to think that once again I do not know what I am consuming.
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Old 03-01-13, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by stapfam
I know that to keep energy levels correct for the exertions of cycling- you should eat well- eat the right foods and eat enough of them. Problem is trying to find those good foods and I am afraid that even buying from the "Good" suppliers- you still do not know what you are eating. But on those hard and long rides I find that I need supplements to keep energy levels up. Just done a hard hill and feeling tired- take a gel or a power bar- keep a drink bottle with energy supplement in it and keep snacking from the supply of fruit and carbs that you carry in your pockets.

I can do something about my normal diet and I do my best to eat correctly. But it is those High energy products that I take on the rides.Just looked at a gel pack and sugars- salt- fruit and caffeine I recognise. Then underneath the main ingredients there is a list that are in very small letters that has the list of preservatives and a list of other things that I do not recognise. Lots of "E" numbers and words I could not pronounce if I tried. What the hell are they? and what will they do to my system?

I know these supplements work to keep energy levels up on rides but I use them as Emergency rations. Take the gels only when required or when I have run out of my "Normal" food from the pockets so they are not something that I think will affect me in the long term. But it is still disconcerting to think that once again I do not know what I am consuming.
In most things that make you sick, dose and duration are what determine whether or not you are affected...

So, as long as 90 - 95% of my diet is "good, healthy" stuff, I don't worry too much about the toxins in the remaining 5 or 10%. I would prefer to avoid them, but if that's all that is available, then OK....
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Old 03-01-13, 08:07 AM
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Must be a different breed of cow where you live.
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Old 03-01-13, 08:17 AM
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[QUOTE=So, as long as 90 - 95% of my diet is "good, healthy" stuff, I don't worry too much about the toxins in the remaining 5 or 10%. I would prefer to avoid them, but if that's all that is available, then OK....[/QUOTE]

+1
A guy who rides with us, age 74, vegetarian, very careful with what he eats, very slim, very fit, ex-24-hour record holder suffered sudden cardiac arrest two months ago yesterday while preparing to ride with our group. Luckily the EMC was there in <5 min and he is now back on his bike. So, yes, be wary of what you eat, especially in the US, but also have regular physicals, especially if you have a family history of some health problem or other.( And everyone should know how to do CPR.)
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Old 03-01-13, 08:34 AM
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Pink Slime is not a thing I fear, and horse meat is nutritious, and if the horses are killed anyway... so processed foods don't hold any fear for me.

Nonetheless, I tend to eat healthy more or less in spite of the processing, or lack thereof, of my food, with the basics of more vegetables to meat, and whole grain products rather than refined. I tend to go very lightly on any red meats, in preference to chicken, turkey, and any sort of white fish, and I avoid fried food mostly.

I do mostly avoid any meat that has been ground, or "pressed and formed". No mcnuggets or mcribs for me...

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Old 03-01-13, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by GeorgeBMac
Far too many countries refuse to import American beef because it is considered unsafe...

... and then there is "Mad Cow" disease to which the USDA tells us: "Don't Worry. Be Happy!" But the Europeans say: "We're not going to eat it!"

So much Bhullchit out there,,LOL
I am An American,,,
I eat BEEF, I eat my steaks Rare,,thats a COOL RED CENTER I have done so all my life.
I eat fish, I eat Sushi,
have Killed, cooked, and eaten opossum, rattle snake, Gators, frogs, snailes, squirls(Tree rats), swamp cabbage In the field.
Raised on garden veggies sprayed with seven dust and worse...
I eat PORK, I have been known to chew on RAW pork fat while dressing out a wild hog...
Yep cutting this fat from right under the skin In the field, then popping a big chunk in my mouth,,Mmm good.
Have made Blood sausage using deer Intestines for casings,,,
Raw whale fat keeps eskimo's alive ya know.

I am 54 and have NEVER ONCE been sick from food....
My cholestorol is perfect btw,,,

You want a strong Immune system ?
Exercise it,,,
Go on,,keep buying and using your antibacterial soaps,,not this boy.
It's a proven fact that kids that have Dogs at home get sick less because the animals bring fecal matter into your home
exposing your children to all kinds of germs...
Some times I think the whole world is turning into wimps..

Please forgive me, I do respect everyones views but I always speak my mind being born a free man and all that.

We all should be able to express our opinions,,,

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Old 03-01-13, 03:34 PM
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While somewhat overstated, there is valid scientific truth to what you are saying about our modern over-clean society. (you know there must be something to this when both Fox News and the New York Times articles agree!) It seems the number one reason for our modern problem with allergies stems from the simple fact that our immune system needs targets to attack, and if there aren't any legitimate ones, then it will attack "targets of opportunity" such as foreign proteins like peanuts and pollen, or even our own bodies.

Studies on hook worms (and whip worms) and their effect on autoimmune diseases are interesting as well. Then there are the studies on fecal matter transplants and Crohn's Disease, which brings up the point that "good" bacteria are needed, so we should lay off our anti-bacterial craze, which really only breeds resistant "bad" bacteria, while cutting down on the "good" population that naturally keeps the "bad" population in check...

I could go on and on... such as how our overuse of antibiotics and antimicrobials is slowly eliminating our supply of such things that actually work on bacteria and microbes... Eventually we will be back in the same fix as the era before antibiotics were discovered.

That said, Trichinosis, and fear of such, will keep raw meat from my mouth and hands, thank you very much!

Edit: this started as a simple rant on my part, but it somehow turned into a linkfest! Sorry!!!!

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Old 03-01-13, 03:43 PM
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Kinda of reminds me of my college years back in the late 60's early 70's. My wife and I were the typical poor married students looking for ways to cut the cost of eating. It was a time when the price of beef started going up faster than gas today. A local store in Bangor, Me started selling raised horse meat as way for people to eat cheap meat. So we bought a couple of steaks. I grilled them up and we sat down to our first steak dinner since being married. Well the Mr. Ed jokes started and we ended up NOT being able to eat the steaks. Into the trash they went right along with any savings we might have had.

Today, since my CHF I am cutting out as much salt (sodium) in my diet as possible. That means staying away from any fast food, most restaurants, and all processed foods. There goes the "Big Mac". It really isn't a big problem living in FL for most of the year and heading back to NE for the summer months. We are able to get fresh veggies most of year at local farm or produce stands. I am able to reduce my sodium intake to around 500 mg/day with the occasional rise to 1000 or so. My biggest downfall is pizza. However, we make it at home as any out would be over my limit with ONE piece let alone a whole pie.
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Old 03-01-13, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by BlazingPedals
Must be a different breed of cow where you live.
If it came from a grocery store, it is most likely chemical laden, antibiotic bed Frankenbeef. This goes for most of the stuff from Trader Joes and Whole Paycheck too.

I just don't eat Frankenbeef.
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Old 03-01-13, 04:56 PM
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I though that I heard that NY or some state had approved horse meat for sale.

Anyway you guys have covered all bases when it comes to food. I will throw in another comment. I have been told that people who eat wild game have a higher content of cesium 141 in there system. This is caused by the radiation left over from our above ground nuclear testing. I have eaten wild game all my life and when I had my full body count done nothing was mentioned about an increased level of cesium 141.
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Old 03-01-13, 05:04 PM
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there is a ratio Less food inspectors = more cheating on ingredients that the company can get away with.

part of the problem with Hosremeat is they are given more drugs than Lance Armstrong,and Marco Pantani combined.
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Old 03-02-13, 02:07 AM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob
there is a ratio Less food inspectors = more cheating on ingredients that the company can get away with.

part of the problem with Hosremeat is they are given more drugs than Lance Armstrong,and Marco Pantani combined.
This is the problem with Horsemeat and I don't care if I eat it or not but I would prefer not to have the "Illegal" stuff that has not been checked and verified for Drugs. But animal husbandry means that any meat entering the food chain will be Contaminated with drugs in some way. To eliminate Disease in animals there are antibiotics that have been deemed to be safe-Hormones to increase weight of the animal and the food they are fed can come from some most unsavoury sources. The same can be said for Fruit-Vegetables- grain and other commercially produced foods.

You don't really know what you are eating and you will have to a fanatic to ensure that you only eat organic produce. I am afraid that my pocket cannot afford to be that finickity.
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Old 03-02-13, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by stapfam
This is the problem with Horsemeat and I don't care if I eat it or not but I would prefer not to have the "Illegal" stuff that has not been checked and verified for Drugs. But animal husbandry means that any meat entering the food chain will be Contaminated with drugs in some way. To eliminate Disease in animals there are antibiotics that have been deemed to be safe-Hormones to increase weight of the animal and the food they are fed can come from some most unsavoury sources. The same can be said for Fruit-Vegetables- grain and other commercially produced foods.

You don't really know what you are eating and you will have to a fanatic to ensure that you only eat organic produce. I am afraid that my pocket cannot afford to be that finickity
.
I would only add two thoughts:
1) Not even organic is safe. As I remember, one of the last food scares was over "organic" bean sprouts. (But, like you, I can't afford that stuff anyway!)
2) Starting yesterday, because of the sequester, the US is letting go even more food inspectors -- when they didn't have enough to begin with! [That's not a political statement, it's a factual one]

I think the food industry has changed hugely since we were growing up -- but the general public still sees it as the same as it has always been. They don't realize how squeezing every last penny out of the system is pushing it to the very edges of safety -- and sometimes beyond.
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