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How much do you "discount" cycling workouts?

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How much do you "discount" cycling workouts?

Old 02-10-14, 08:55 PM
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gradedgraydad
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How much do you "discount" cycling workouts?

How much of a published workout (like the ones posted in Bicycling magazine) do you 50+ guys do? Those workouts are designed for 20-35 year old athletes.

I recently did 25 (5, 10, 10) minutes of a 4X10 minute interval workout, opting to finish with something in the tank, and trying to stay out of the overuse/injury zone. I'm new to cycling workouts, but not to running ones.

Do you guys aim for 50% or 75% of the workout or what?

Thanks!
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Old 02-10-14, 09:00 PM
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I don't do those workouts at all. I just ride what I want to ride at the pace I want to ride it and don't give it much thought beyond that.

I guess they have to publish those things and they may have a purpose for some but I've found them not applicable to the riding I do, or at least for the reasons I ride.

Your mileage my Vary, of course, but I wouldn't advise spending to much time with those kinds of work out guides.

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Old 02-10-14, 09:36 PM
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I must confess I like riding hard and pushing my limits. Specifically I want to excel at climbing. My previous running took me to 3rd place in a national masters championship track meet. While I have toned down my intensity which has materialized in taking training less seriously, the workouts I undertake I want to make sure they count.
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Old 02-10-14, 09:45 PM
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I agree with Rick. I totally ignored any and all structured training regimens in my late 50's, and was a very strong rider. I figured that I was too old to take off winters, I was highly motivated, and I viewed my riding as a continuous cycle of improvement. Most of my rides were fartlek style outings, interspersed with massive endurance or power sessions. The power sessions came mainly during the winter on a Keiser spin bike with endurance during the summer, on the road. I never raced, but rode with many others who did, and have had many absolutely sublime days on my bike.

I'm not a runner, but one of my kids was a runner and swimmer in high school. During that time I was a student of training techniques. I appreciate the need for structure for a lot of people, but if you're attuned to your body, willing to continuously bounce off physical limits and still allow your body to recover, it's pretty amazing what you can accomplish. Lots of really cool information at Australian Institute of Sport site that can be integrated into your athletic brain.
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Old 02-10-14, 10:55 PM
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I suck. I'm slow. Really slow.
But I want to do double centuries.
So I do Time Crunched Cyclist workouts.They are based on my own starting point, (watts and heart rate) so there is no need to adjust. I do sometimes ramp up the progression more slowly over weeks.
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Old 02-11-14, 04:40 AM
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Originally Posted by gradedgraydad View Post
How much of a published workout (like the ones posted in Bicycling magazine) do you 50+ guys do? Those workouts are designed for 20-35 year old athletes…

Do you guys aim for 50% or 75% of the workout or what?
I’m more a mileage junkie than a speed demon, and I get my fix from a 10-Week Century Training schedule published long ago in Bicycling Magazine totaling 1516 miles in 10 weeks. In past years, I've done about 90% of the expected miles, but last year, exclusively due to work demands, I did about 50%. The flesh was indeed willing, but the spirit was weak.

Originally Posted by Rick@OCRR View Post
I don't do those workouts at all. I just ride what I want to ride at the pace I want to ride it and don't give it much thought beyond that.

I guess they have to publish those things and they may have a purpose for some but I've found them not applicable to the riding I do, or at least for the reasons I ride.
I describe myself as a "destination cyclist"; I don't ride for its own sake, but for a reason, be it a destination (usually as a year round cycling commuter) or a mileage goal. The destination/goal encourages me to ride more, and reap the further benefits.

Nonetheless, cycling is a joy, and not a chore. To paraphrase a saying* about walking:

"Now shall I walk, or shall I ride? / ‘Ride' Pleasure said; ‘Walk’ Joy replied." to

"Now shall I drive, or shall I ride? / ‘Drive' Pleasure said; ‘Ride’ Joy replied."

(*W.H. Davies, as quoted by Colin Fletcher in "The Complete Walker.":

"...Which of ye two
Will kindest be?
Pleasure laughed sweet,
But Joy kissed me.")

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 02-11-14 at 05:32 AM.
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Old 02-11-14, 06:15 AM
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GGD, welcome to the 50+, if you are wanting to do some racing at some point you might want to pose your question on workouts in master's racing forum, too. There are some good folks there with solid training programs that are time tested. If it is a matter of training for fitness, as I think of my riding purpose, some of those that are doing winter training sessions, indoors, have structured programs as well as those doing programs like Curtis is using, are posting their results and thoughts here.

I don't care for Bicycling Magazine in particular, and most of their training seems to be slanted towards the casual, sometimes rider that is fashionable now in some circles. My personal source for a structure in training are Joe Friel's, Cycling Past 50 and The Cyclist Training Bible, he has worked in training athletes in cycling for many years and is big in the older cyclist training, now. Best of luck with your riding and training, stick around the forum, too.

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Old 02-11-14, 06:20 AM
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I do 100%.

However, I established a baseline with a field test, so I don't expect to hold 300W for 30 minutes. I do what my specific workout program asks me to do. You might check out the 42 thread.
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Old 02-11-14, 06:24 AM
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I just go to the gym and activate the Spinning Video function on the spin bike. Punch in all the data (but I put age as 55 instead of 67) then I do what the guy on the screen tells me to do.
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Old 02-11-14, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Rick@OCRR View Post
I don't do those workouts at all. I just ride what I want to ride at the pace I want to ride it and don't give it much thought beyond that.

I guess they have to publish those things and they may have a purpose for some but I've found them not applicable to the riding I do, or at least for the reasons I ride.

Your mileage my Vary, of course, but I wouldn't advise spending to much time with those kinds of work out guides.

Rick / OCRR
I do pretty much the same. Get the pipes cleared, sweat and feel it in the legs. I will absess over conditioning when getting back on the hills and the bike I love.
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Old 02-11-14, 03:54 PM
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Sometimes I force myself to do some rather sissyfied intervals on my Wednesday rides but I don't really go by anybodies training regimen for those. Problem is working second shift and making myself get up in time to ride throughout the week. So I only force myself on Wednesdays. It really only comprises of hitting slightly heavier gears for awhile and shifting back to recover on 20 -30 mile rides.

My longer rides are on the weekends and I pace myself more steadily on those. If I had time to ride more I'd be in better shape for real intervals but that's about as far as I feel I can safely push it for now after 11 years off......moral of my post.....don't take 11 years off.
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Old 02-11-14, 04:07 PM
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I'm no expert, but my understanding is if you want to reap the benefit of interval training you really do need to perform the full set (eg 4 sets of 10 minutes in your example).
If you want to avoid injury and over exertion, the idea is to reduce the intensity.
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Old 02-11-14, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mercator View Post
I'm no expert, but my understanding is if you want to reap the benefit of interval training you really do need to perform the full set (eg 4 sets of 10 minutes in your example).
If you want to avoid injury and over exertion, the idea is to reduce the intensity.
Well I pretty much hit the gears where I can keep my cadence up to what I normally ride at (I'm a relatively high cadence rider) and when I feel it dropping off I shift down 2 or 3 sprockets (6 speed FW). I'm not racing the clock, for ET on the whole ride, and 4 to 6 cycles is about what I manage to keep actually, but for a little lesser time for now. It probably ain't right but I do think it helps me hold the intermediate heavier gear on my long rides. Like I said though, if I had more riding time I'd invest more into it.

I'm also not spinning during the winter but taking the opportunity to do some dumbbell work, including squats, instead. Load bearing is something I need to do some of at my age and I don't feel my conditioning at this point in my comeback is quite ready to mix weights and cardio for the time being.

Last edited by Zinger; 02-11-14 at 06:53 PM.
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Old 02-17-14, 06:54 PM
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4 X 10 minute reps that felt good tonight! I set the effort using by heartrate. I made a conscious effort to keep the effort constant which meant heartrate crept up during the reps.

I hit the weight room last Thursday, did a 2 hour trainer ride yesterday and I'm feeling strong. I'm looking forward to some Texas riding late this week.
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Old 02-17-14, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Rick@OCRR View Post
I don't do those workouts at all. I just ride what I want to ride at the pace I want to ride it and don't give it much thought beyond that.

I guess they have to publish those things and they may have a purpose for some but I've found them not applicable to the riding I do, or at least for the reasons I ride.

Your mileage my Vary, of course, but I wouldn't advise spending to much time with those kinds of work out guides.

Rick / OCRR
^ That's me in a nutshell. I came at cycling from a touring perspective, not racing or fitness. So any rubber side down day with good friends is what I'm after. The rest is gravy.

No, make that ice cream.
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Old 02-17-14, 07:16 PM
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I'm new to cycling but not training having worked as a sports conditioning coach for many years. This winter i have enjoyed planning my workouts that I perform on an indoor trainer. (I have modest goals and have been using info from Base Training for Cyclists by Chapple to plan my training.)

For winter training with limited time and to fight the boredom of indoor training planning my workouts has kept me motivated. I hope to continue to plan and execute workouts once I can get outside.
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Old 02-17-14, 08:33 PM
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Back to the OP.

There are just a lot of different types of intervals.

Pedaling so hard that you lapse into coma might be called "Peak and fade". Although invaluable for competitive cyclists, a cyclotourist would only use this type of thing trying to evade some mean-ass dog in chase.

A Steady effort power interval expects you to hold as high wattage you can for two minutes. This may lead to active negotiations between the involved parties: legs, heart, and will.

Super spins are pedaling at as high a cadence as you can for, say three minutes. The gearing is to be low but not so low that you fly out of your seat. I noticed in a low gear at 120 RPM I'm not generating very much wattage.

I hate super spins.

Then there is the steady state: riding quickly but sustainable for 10-60 minutes, as you might in a time trial.

And then there are over-unders, when you right at steady state but break the monotony by going 10% faster on cue.

There are still others, like Tabatas, but if I do those it voids my life insurance.

There's a science as to when you do which type of interval.

I do not know this science, so I turn to page 262 of The Bad Book and do exactly what it tells me to.

Why bother? For one thing, all my riding this year save one or two excursions have been on the indoor trainer because of the New Ice Age. If I had to do the same regimen four days a week for 11 weeks I'd go daft.

The Bad Book says I can get results as good as if not better that others who spend roughly the same amount of time Just Riding Around.

I do not know if that is true, but I'm giving it a try as I have nothing better to do.

My gut tells me I won't have any trouble on the Redbud Century this April, but a 200K randonee on the first of march might be a bit too optimistic.
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Old 02-18-14, 03:21 AM
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^^^
"Over-Unders" sounds so much better than sissyfied intervals.
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Old 02-18-14, 04:47 AM
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Scheduled training as detailed in published materials I do not and care not to do. I don't have the killer drive, the need to be the best in my age bracket in swimming, biking or running. To those who follow the written paths to greatness, I tip my helmet for you. You are a better person than I.

Attempting to keep up with younger, stronger riders is what I try to accomplish when out with the group such as later today or on the Thursday and Saturday rides.

ggdad, your commitment to improve is impressive as is that of the others in this group, so keep at everyone.
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Old 02-18-14, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Zinger View Post
^^^
"Over-Unders" sounds so much better than sissyfied intervals.
Just finished three sets of them. Funny, they didn't feel all that sissified.
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Old 02-18-14, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Dudelsack View Post
If I had to do the same regimen four days a week for 11 weeks I'd go daft.
Too late.

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Old 02-18-14, 06:28 AM
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Originally Posted by qcpmsame View Post
Too late.

Bill
Yeah, waking up at 5AM to do anything other than turning the alarm off and going back to sleep speaks for itself
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Old 02-18-14, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Zinger View Post
^^^
"Over-Unders" sounds so much better than sissyfied intervals.
Over Unders are harder than steady-state.
Example: instead of doing about 92% heart rate (of your max sustainable rate) for 9 minutes, you do 2 at 92, then frikin' kill yourself, trying to hit 100 or more for 1 minute, then do it again. Then again. For nine minutes. That's 3 "overs"

Then rest 5, do the 9 minute hell again, then rest 5 then do it one more time.
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Old 02-18-14, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by cccorlew View Post
Over Unders are harder than steady-state.
Example: instead of doing about 92% heart rate (of your max sustainable rate) for 9 minutes, you do 2 at 92, then frikin' kill yourself, trying to hit 100 or more for 1 minute, then do it again. Then again. For nine minutes. That's 3 "overs"

Then rest 5, do the 9 minute hell again, then rest 5 then do it one more time.
Well the way I do them might not be. I don't really go by my watch that much (except to check my progress in staying power on the heavier gear) and don't have a clue what my heart rate is. I'm kind of going by how I feel at pushing into my limits. And since I don't monitor heart rate I'm probably being cautious which is fine for me. I'm just trying to move up in the gears that I used to use more before my decade layoff. I haven't really gotten my base back yet after one season back on the bike.

On an unrelated topic: As far as mixing cardio and weights, I probably could but I just separate them by season because.......well, I'm kinda lazy.
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Old 02-18-14, 05:03 PM
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In the off season I use Sufferfest workouts and follow as best I can the screen prompts. I also twice weekly do a LBS spin class also striving to match the effort called for. The rest of the year I do not follow a written training plan. I do this because my short and long term goals are for weight loss and increased performance. I race CX in the fall, which is further motivation.
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