jlstrat

I am currently running a pair of Mavic A719s with most tires at 700 x 28m, although I've also used Gator Skin 700 x 28 tires. If I switched to Mavic Open Pros and tires at, say, 700 x 23 would I notice an increase in speed. I was thinking of building a second set of wheels with a tighter gear cluster, maybe 12-28 as opposed to the 11-34 I use now. I ride a Lightspeed Blue Ridge cross bike that I have set up pretty much as a touring bike. I'd like to keep up with some of my faster friends, but maybe it has more to do with genetics and body type than equipment. Comments appreciated.

Rick@OCRR

I have a Mavic Open Pro on the front of my commuter bike; seems to be an adequate rim, no problems with a 700 x 25 Gatorskin mounted.

Rick / OCRR

fietsbob

Air resistance is greatest on the rider . that won't change.

GaIslander

I run 32 hole Mavic Open Pros with 700 x 25 Conti Gatorskins. I keep up with anybody on my Saturday Group ride. They are a little slower than the Shimano C 35 wheels and 700 x 23 Conti Gatorskins. Your plan to go with the Open Pros and 700 x 23s would work well.

obed7

will NOT make you faster. Work on the motor.

bruce19

I've come to the point in life where this is more true for me than ever. The marginal gains in weight reduction, aero gear, light wheels, etc. seem pertinent only if you are competing. For those of us who are recreational riders it's not very important. Just my opinion.

John E

And mine, as well, which is why I am content to ride my classics. I took a 2-1/2 hour ride up the coast highway today, and since I already had the mountain bike out, I just rode it instead of taking down one of the road bikes. The choice of bike probably cost me about 1 mph in average speed, which is simply not a concern.

John E

Whatever wheelset you choose, if you care about reliability and durability, stick with 32 or 36 spokes per wheel. Leave the reduced spoke counts for the sponsored racers. Jobst Brandt had a good writeup on why 36 was the standard spoke count for many years, and why it is still the best choice.

Lanceoldstrong

After more thatn 43,000 miles on several sets of 23 mm gp4000s tires, I just made the switch to the same tire in 25 mm, a scant 120 miles ago.

I notice no change in speed at all. I do notice what advisers told me for years. My 190 pounds experience a more comfortable and less buzzy ride on the 25s, especially on chip seal.

I also like the sure footed feel when I am cornering and descending.

OldsCOOL

You will most definately feel a positive change and quickness in acceleration from the reduction in tire weight going down to the 23's. However, "feel" is not a sure translation into faster times. That much depends on you.

I will echo the comment on getting aero. Train yourself so you feel normal and comfortable in the drops. That is where time is gained. Make it work for you.

I rode heavy Bontrager "B"'s and went to the light and quick Michelin Krylion 23's. My first ride was exhillerating.

SlowAndSlower

+1 on "feel" faster et al. Performance has Open Pro Ultegra wheels on sale. Personal aside, I find my Mavic Ksyrium and Aksiums just fine and prefer 25mm tires.

bruce19

Since getting back on the bike I've noticed two weird things. I seemed to ride faster and more easily once I got in shape and lost 15 lbs. How's that possible? I didn't get a new wheelset or a new CF bike. I'm confused.

StanSeven

Open Pros aren't known for speed so much. They, at least used to be, a reliable basic rim. The problem is quality has dropped in recent years with lots of stories of cracks and problems with the spoke holes deterioting.

Wheels make you faster in to ways - deep aero shape and lightness. Aero makes you faster on the flats and rolling hills. Lightness makes you faster climbing and accelerating. Do if you want to gain speed via wheels, it's a matter of choosing between aero and weight depending on your terrain.

23s make you feel faster but there's evidence that many 25s have slightly lower rolling resistance.

All this of course represent marginal gains like a couple minutes over an hour of riding for aero and a couple seconds per minute of climbing for light rims. Many feel it's not worth it. Durability can be a factor too but it really isn't unless you weigh a lot. For most people under 200 lbs you can safely ride just about anything.

h2oxtc

I agree with the sentiments above - improving the motor will have the most significant impact.

Last spring I had the opportunity to play with 4 different wheelsets on one of my road bikes - just for fun. I don't think that any made me particularly faster, however there was definitely a feel that was different between them. Unfortunately, the "test" wasn't very scientific as each wheelset had different tires, so my opinions or conclusions are simply musing.

What I have found from my experience that has made a difference to my speed in so far as hardware is concerned, is the bike frame itself. I have one road bike in particular that you couldn't pay me to ride in a club ride, it's too slow. My best description would be that it seems to suck all the energy out of my ride and not transfer it to forward momentum. My other road bikes again each have their own personality in respect to speed as well.

Road Fan

And, the Open Pro is known to be a reliable rim - never a bad choice except perhaps for width and weight weenies.

qcpmsame 

You may want to pick up a copy of Jobst Brandt's book on wheel building. The Bicycle Wheel 3rd Edition: Jobst Brandt: 9780960723669: Amazon.com: Books

It helped me to better understand how the wheel should be built, in order to function properly, and reliably. Its been in my library for several years now, I reread it from time to time to refresh my memory about my choices. It is kind of dry and written in an engineering format, be warned, I am used to that type of writing style.

Stapfam used to reply to the various wheel choice or building threads with the caveat, buy a hand built wheel set of the spoke count and components you choose, not a machine built, mass produced set. You cannot get a consistent spoke tension on a completely machine built wheel, I found these to be words of wisdom to choose, and to build by.

Bill

revchuck 

OP - as noted above by others, the Open Pros won't make you faster, but they will be a good, solid wheelset if built well. My set lasted ~14k miles before I saw the beginning of a crack at one spoke hole on the rear, and that was after their second crash (first one in a race, the second a collision with a car that pulled out in front of me) and three editions of a 106 mile road race known for the poor condition of the roads used and including 25 miles of gravel. If I were building a new set of wheels now, though, I'd go with a wider rim. Also, I'd recommend sticking with 25s for tires. There's no advantage to 23s; even the pro teams are transitioning to 25s.

JerrySTL

I ride OPs with 32 spokes and 700x25 Conti GP4000s tires. I weigh about 215 lbs. I'm actually faster on 25s at 100 psi than 23s at 120 psi on longer rides. I ride on a lot of somewhat rough chip and tar roads and the 25s at less pressure don't beat me up as much.

I ride on 700x32s on my touring bike and I'm much slower on it. The touring bike weighs about 10 lbs more; however I'm still slower (2-3 mph) even when riding on flat rides. Some of it still could be the weight. Some of it could be the tires and wheels. However a lot of it is the more upright position. If you are riding a cross bike, that might be the biggest issue. Maybe you should borrow a true road bike and see if you are faster on it.

big john

I don't know what the weight is of your A719 wheelset but I have 36 hole Open Pros with Ultegra hubs and they are around 2000 grams. I can feel the difference using 1600 gram wheels, and I'm 200 pounds.
I used Open Pros for years and I broke the rear rim every 10,000 miles, or so. I think I broke at least 6 of them.

Weight is weight, and taking 2 pounds off can make a difference, especially in rotating weight. To those who say to work on the engine, why not do both?

I can certainly feel the difference between my 22 pound bike and my 18 pound bike.

Mr IGH

You can do so much better with newer design rims these days. The Stans road rims are much stronger and tubeless ready at the same or lighter weight. Some of the Shimano wheels are tubeless ready and low count aero spokes for reasonable cost and overall wheel weight lower than a 32 spoke OP wheelset. I wouldn't buy a new set of wheels that wasn't tubeless ready, the rims are stronger for the same weight and you have the choice to stick with tubes or go tubeless as TR takes over the tyre market.

OldsCOOL

Best money I spent on my Cannondale Criterium Series build a year ago was the 250.00 spent on the Vuelta Corsa Lite wheelset with the very light Vittoria Pro Slick III tires that dropped a quick 2lbs off the rolling stock. And yes, I ride measureably faster on that bike. Very zippy.

h2oxtc

No argument with the "feel the difference". For the sake of discussion however, comparing a 22 lb and 18 lb bike is an unfair comparison. Generally this would imply comparing two completely different bikes in terms of frame design, materials, and components. I can take my 17 lb bike and add 3 water bottles to make it the same weight as my 22 lb bike, and it will still be faster by virtue of the bike's inherent or designed performance.

I found the heavier wheelset, 2kg, that I tested (aka un-scientific musing) carried speed on the flat roads just fine. Accelerating and climbing however they certainly "felt" sluggish as compared to the 1550g wheelset. I also have an older (2008?) open pro wheelset that I use in spring when the roads are still littered with crud. They have been great for me but likely have less than 3000 miles on them.

Why not do both? Sure, I like to upgrade my bikes as well. Mostly just because I want to.

big john

The best reason for upgrades.
For the sake of arguement when I ride my 24 pound touring bike empty it feels a lot different than when I put 25 pounds of stuff on it. On flat ground it's surprisingly little difference once up to speed.

RonH

I'm on my second set of hand built Open Pros (with Ultegra hubs) on my 2001 Litespeed Tuscany. I've been riding on Conti GP4000s for several years. Great ride.

NOS88

I've six sets of Mavic Open Pros 32 spoke on Ultegra hubs - three of the sets I built myself. I've never had a problem with any of them. They are my go to wheel set. Both sons have at least one bike with Open Pros and have had not issues either.

Additional thought.... I usually ride 25s or 28s, but have been able to mount 32's with no issues.