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Arrgh... Knee and back pain again

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Arrgh... Knee and back pain again

Old 02-26-21, 03:16 AM
  #1  
StargazeCyclist
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Arrgh... Knee and back pain again

I lowered my seat by 3mm. The pedaling was more powerful but I got some minor knee pain at the front and just below the knee cap, and some back pain after the ride (about 30-40km, mainly in the drops). Before that I have done a couple of metric centuries without problem. Should I roll back the change or go another way (I thought my seat was high but I am not very flexible)? Thx


Posing on the bike is hard... anyways I am 167cm tall, 53kg. I ride a Giant TCR, S size, with 165mm crank, 38cm handlebar and ISM saddle.
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Old 02-26-21, 05:34 AM
  #2  
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The ONLY things that hurt are your knees and back? Please tell us your secrets

All joking Aside, your toes on that second photo look hell pointed... That would strain the crap out of my knees
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Old 02-26-21, 08:50 AM
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Yeah, I agree with cube... we need a photo showing the OP with both feet on pedals in a normal riding position. Based on photos provided (with one foot on ground) your saddle is too high and your center of mass is waaaaaaaaay too far forward. Take a look at post #2 from cubewheels and the location of the rider's center of mass (located just below the scapulta) in relation to the top tube, then go back and look at the your photos in the original post.

It also appears that StargazeCyclist 's handlebars are set up at an angle to allow forearms to rest in a manner that violates UCI rules - LOL . Joking aside, that front end looks to be a good part of your problem. Fix that and your saddle height and you should be in a much better position on the bike.
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Old 02-26-21, 08:57 AM
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I've said this dozens of times: IME perhaps HALF of the reason why cycling hurts me is bike fit. everything else is my body conditioning. most cyclists have poor core strength and tight hamstrings. no amount of perfecting your bike fit is going to help when that is the issue. my lower back pain goes away when i start doing planks, bridges, russian twists, deadlifts, lunges, squats, etc. consistently.

your saddle is likely too high and that handlebar looks HUGE (long reach). start with that.s
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Old 02-26-21, 09:23 AM
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I'm not certain why both the OP and the guy in the video are so far forward on their saddle. To me that's wrong for your normal or the majority of your riding. Also not happy with the OP's desire to turn the drop bars into aero bars by putting the STI's so far forward that the forearms can rest on the top of the bars. Saddle height is also impossible to gauge. Does the OP really point toes down so much at the bottom of stroke? Would also be interested in pic with crank forward.

Looking at the position I can only assume is what the OP desires, then I'd think they really want a Time Trial bike and not a Road Bike.
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Old 02-26-21, 09:33 PM
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I think that knee pain is a classic symptom of the seat being too low. 3 mm seems like a short distance, but if you were at the lower limit before the change, it' could be the proverbial straw.
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Old 02-27-21, 12:08 PM
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As said above, photos in your normal cycling position would be better. However, please have a look at my bike fitting primer, here: How can I fitting my bike

Your goal is to look like the photo is post 2, although his back could be a little straighter. Note the angle between his upper arms and his back. That's what correct reach looks like.

Do as much of that as you can, then take more photos, one with pedals in line with seat tube, hands on hoods with slight elbow bend, another with pedals horizontal, hands on hoods, forearms horizontal.

Also, your back is hollow. It should be straight.
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Old 02-28-21, 01:10 AM
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Red face

Originally Posted by Iride01 View Post
Looking at the position I can only assume is what the OP desires, then I'd think they really want a Time Trial bike and not a Road Bike.
What if I indeed want a time trial bike? Does it make any difference in fitting? This arrangement is more controllable than an aero bar, and I am certainly not the only person who wants something like this



I moved the seat back 3mm and did 64km yesterday and it was better. There was no back pain and my left knee didn't complain. The poor man's aero bar was great riding into 30km/h head wind. I am moving back more but it is snowing again.
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Old 02-28-21, 09:18 AM
  #9  
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If you have solved your back pain then and anything else that bothers you then you can have any position you care to have with regards to position. Just make certain it's not giving you less control of your bike. Especially when you are with a group.

If you find your back and shoulders bother you on long rides, then it might be that your "poor man's aero bar" as you call them. Unless you have a really narrow spread on the bars, then your upper arms arm bracing your body's side to side motion too much and making your body too ridged at the shoulders. Having your arms close together on real aero bars lets your body sway a little bit and more parts of your body absorb the jolts and bump than just your shoulders. But again, if you don't have any issues, then that's not a concern for you.

You position in your pic using your poor mans aero bars is no more aero than my normal position with STI's in a normal position and not resting on my forearms. I also get the benefit of having four extra pivot points to absorb forces, wrists and elbows. Elbows help a lot to reduce impact forces going into your body.


https://www.specialized.com/us/en/s-...ext=21015-1000


What if I indeed want a time trial bike?
Then get a TT bike. The geometry of a TT bike is for giving you the best power in a very aero position. However a TT bike is typically only used for short rides. Not for longer rides an endurance geometry bike is made for.

Last edited by Iride01; 02-28-21 at 09:23 AM.
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Old 03-26-21, 11:49 AM
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?

Does op have a tendency to lean on his forearm for comfort?
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Old 03-26-21, 12:33 PM
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I'm not certain why both the OP and the guy in the video are so far forward on their saddle.
ISM saddles look like they have noses but don't. When properly set up, it looks like the rider is far forward while actually riding correctly. IIRC, ISMs could be much shorter than they are, but they added superfluous material at the back to meet UCI requirements. Their docs say that the back 2-3 fingers' width should be visible when riding.
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Old 03-27-21, 10:18 AM
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I moved the saddle back 15mm and up 1mm and that eliminated the back and knee pain. And I have some videos of my position shot.

Aero hoods



https://imgsurf.com/image/7AqR7

Drops



https://imgsurf.com/image/7Av3Y
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Old 03-27-21, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by jma1st3r View Post
?

Does op have a tendency to lean on his forearm for comfort?
Yes, I rest my forearms on the bar about half of the time.
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Old 03-27-21, 10:52 AM
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Leg looks on the verge of being over extended at the bottom of the stroke. But really hard to say with long pants. If it works for you and there aren't any issues then it doesn't matter what any other formulas or wisdom say.

But realize that a five minute ride around a parking lot won't show the issues a 50 mile ride will.
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Old 03-27-21, 12:52 PM
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Looks like seeing a BikeFit Pro would help. But here are some quick tips.
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