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-   -   Saddle position (https://www.bikeforums.net/fitting-your-bike/1299967-saddle-position.html)

pepperbelly 09-10-24 09:03 PM

Saddle position
 
If I have my saddle too far back could it cause pressure on my perineum? I started having chafing and I’m not sure if it’s my saddle, my bibs or me having ridden a stationary bike at my gym.

Iride01 09-11-24 10:19 AM

The further back it is, the heavier you'll be sitting in the saddle. Or maybe it's better to think of it as you won't be getting as much up force from the power of your legs to lighten your weight in the saddle. So sure, I'd imagine it's possible.

Though if you aren't being pulled forward when you pedal hard then maybe you are in the correct position for the way everything else is currently set. And might need to check things like saddle tilt. Or even need to again play that fun for all game of saddle swap! <grin>

You haven't also switched brands or model of cycling short or bibs have you? I'd think a thicker chamois might put some pressure on your perineal area compared to what you have your saddle tilt set for with a thinner pad. I prefer the thinner chamois that are usually found in the mid to upper price models of bibs/shorts.

pepperbelly 09-11-24 11:04 AM


Originally Posted by Iride01 (Post 23346268)
The further back it is, the heavier you'll be sitting in the saddle. Or maybe it's better to think of it as you won't be getting as much up force from the power of your legs to lighten your weight in the saddle. So sure, I'd imagine it's possible.

Though if you aren't being pulled forward when you pedal hard then maybe you are in the correct position for the way everything else is currently set. And might need to check things like saddle tilt. Or even need to again play that fun for all game of saddle swap! <grin>

You haven't also switched brands or model of cycling short or bibs have you? I'd think a thicker chamois might put some pressure on your perineal area compared to what you have your saddle tilt set for with a thinner pad. I prefer the thinner chamois that are usually found in the mid to upper price models of bibs/shorts.

I have a pair of the basic Black Bibs that seem to be fine. The one that I suspect are giving me a problem are some Primal bibs that do seem to have s thicker chamois. They fit looser than the Black Bibs but are the same size.

cyclezen 11-27-24 10:35 AM


Originally Posted by pepperbelly (Post 23346299)
I have a pair of the basic Black Bibs that seem to be fine. The one that I suspect are giving me a problem are some Primal bibs that do seem to have s thicker chamois. They fit looser than the Black Bibs but are the same size.

If the issue happens as you change from one bib to the other, then prolly an issue of how they fit you, NOT a bike fit issue...
BUT
also do the inseam measurement I suggested in your other thread - report back...
1. Prop your bike up straight 2. put a straight edge across the saddle from nose to one side where your sitzbones would rest (not the trough in the middle of saddle).
3. Measure from Center of the Bottom Bracket , along the seattube length, to the bottom edge of the straight edge
Post both your inseam measurement and the current saddle height measurement - prefer the numbers in cm/mm, but inches can be converted...
Ride On
Yuri

pepperbelly 11-27-24 03:25 PM


Originally Posted by cyclezen (Post 23402866)
If the issue happens as you change from one bib to the other, then prolly an issue of how they fit you, NOT a bike fit issue...
BUT
also do the inseam measurement I suggested in your other thread - report back...
1. Prop your bike up straight 2. put a straight edge across the saddle from nose to one side where your sitzbones would rest (not the trough in the middle of saddle).
3. Measure from Center of the Bottom Bracket , along the seattube length, to the bottom edge of the straight edge
Post both your inseam measurement and the current saddle height measurement - prefer the numbers in cm/mm, but inches can be converted...
Ride On
Yuri

I will have my wife help measure my inseam in the next few days. I tried but I need a larger book. If I did it correctly my inseam is 76.2cm.
The middle if my bottom bracket crank is 73.6cm.
I laid a hardcover book on my saddle and measured to the bottom of that.

Steve B. 11-27-24 03:35 PM


Originally Posted by pepperbelly (Post 23403102)
I will have my wife help measure my inseam in the next few days. I tried but I need a larger book. If I did it correctly my inseam is 76.2cm.
The middle if my bottom bracket crank is 73.6cm.
I laid a hardcover book on my saddle and measured to the bottom of that.

I just cut a slot on a piece of PVC or wooden dowel, end of tape measure on that, helps to have a tape measure that reads metric. My wife helped, showed my inseam at 83cm. The online calculator says multiply your inseam by .883 to get saddle height, set as middle of crank at b0bracket to top of saddle.

As well, throw out aby shorts that are old and stretched. I get maybe 3-4 years out of my cheap PI shorts. I just invested in expensive Assos, they are worth it

pepperbelly 11-27-24 05:23 PM

I must be doing something wrong. When I use the formula multiplying my inseam by .883 it shows that I need to lower my saddle a lot- like 2.5 inches.
It feels a little low now. I just did a short 6 mile lap around a local lake and was paying attention to my legs. At the bottom of the stroke my knee still has a pretty good bend and my quads can really feel it.

cyclezen 11-27-24 07:01 PM


Originally Posted by pepperbelly (Post 23403205)
I must be doing something wrong. When I use the formula multiplying my inseam by .883 it shows that I need to lower my saddle a lot- like 2.5 inches.
It feels a little low now. I just did a short 6 mile lap around a local lake and was paying attention to my legs. At the bottom of the stroke my knee still has a pretty good bend and my quads can really feel it.

Likely you haven't gotten the inseam correct - 76 cm for someone 5'10" is super short legged and super Long Torso.
so, you can try to do the measurement again...
OR, the alternate option is heel on pedal method - My personal experience is this worked on 99% of people I have used this for... as the ballpark starting point - usually within 2-3 mm of what they might settle on.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6161eaea92.jpg
Heel on Pedal - Saddle Height Adjustment - Leg Fully Stretched

This can be done will riding - safely - somewhere without obstacles and traffic.
pedal then coast... put heels on both pedals... pedal in reverse.
If legs are completely stretched with heel lightly contacting pedal - the key is to not have the hips rocking while doing this reverse pedaling.
adjust as appropriate, do it again, until the height is set and you pedal smoothly, heels on pedals, with legs completely extended
This works whether you're riding flats, clipless or even old school toe clips on rattraps.
Ride On
Yuri
But actually knowing a good cycling inseam measurement helps with many other things..
EDIT: Note that being in a 'riding' posture (hands on Bars) is important for the heel on pedal method to work, whether you're static leaning on something, or moving...

Kontact 11-27-24 07:57 PM

I find heel on is low.

Pepperbelly, you have a variety of issues popping up that all come back to the fact that you really haven't fit yourself to the bike. You can do that by taking the time to make good measurement, putting the bike on a level trainer and working through from saddle height, then setback, then bar height, then stem length, then saddle angle. Otherwise you're just chasing your tail.

Old school methods like KOPs and looking for the front hub are okay starting points - much better than just randomly trying stuff.

pepperbelly 11-27-24 08:01 PM


Originally Posted by Kontact (Post 23403340)
I find heel on is low.

Pepperbelly, you have a variety of issues popping up that all come back to the fact that you really haven't fit yourself to the bike. You can do that by taking the time to make good measurement, putting the bike on a level trainer and working through from saddle height, then setback, then bar height, then stem length, then saddle angle. Otherwise you're just chasing your tail.

Old school methods like KOPs and looking for the front hub are okay starting points - much better than just randomly trying stuff.

I think the source of a lot of my problems are the bike I bought used was setup for someone else.
That and since I am inexperienced with bicycles I am adapting to the bike and not dialing it in for me.

Kontact 11-27-24 08:09 PM


Originally Posted by pepperbelly (Post 23403345)
I think the source of a lot of my problems are the bike I bought used was setup for someone else.
That and since I am inexperienced with bicycles I am adapting to the bike and not dialing it in for me.

All bikes start set up for someone else. I have never seen a stock bike in my size that came with the right length stem, bar width or saddle type.

You just need to embrace the fact that bikes don't come ready to ride. They are like those dress slacks that come unhemmed.

Steve B. 11-27-24 09:14 PM

I had an old record of having an 84 cm inseam. That would have put my saddle up at 74cm. Tried that and knew instantly it was too high. Took it down to 73, rode an hour and that seemed OK. Knee pain still there a bit, but will work on that. Then when I got home, had my wife help be remeasure, I’m really at 83 cm, lost a centimeter over some years. That’s a 73 seat height, which is what I rode at today, seemed OK.

Iride01 11-29-24 10:55 AM

Your issue with .883 x inseam might be whether or not you dip your toe at the bottom of the stroke. If you are a toe dipper, that could be the extra inches you feel you are missing.

I've found that my max saddle comfortable height in the summer tends to be 109% of my inseam. But that is for when measuring to the top of the pedal at the bottom of the stroke. Still it's going to depend on whether your not your foot is level, pointed up or pointed down when at the bottom of the stroke. My foot is pretty much level.

Saddle height is one of the things that needs to be very close to correct before you can do most any other assessment of how you fit on a road bike.

Kontact 11-29-24 01:08 PM


Originally Posted by Iride01 (Post 23404260)
Your issue with .883 x inseam might be whether or not you dip your toe at the bottom of the stroke. If you are a toe dipper, that could be the extra inches you feel you are missing.

I've found that my max saddle comfortable height in the summer tends to be 109% of my inseam. But that is for when measuring to the top of the pedal at the bottom of the stroke. Still it's going to depend on whether your not your foot is level, pointed up or pointed down when at the bottom of the stroke. My foot is pretty much level.

Saddle height is one of the things that needs to be very close to correct before you can do most any other assessment of how you fit on a road bike.

This seems unlikely given 2.5" and how low the saddle is already for someone 5'10".

Iride01 11-29-24 01:57 PM


Originally Posted by Kontact (Post 23404357)
This seems unlikely given 2.5" and how low the saddle is already for someone 5'10".

What seems unlikely?

And if the OP's saddle is currently at .883 x inseam, then it's not that far off from where I'd think it needs to be, depending on crank length. But that will only be a insignificant amount.

pepperbelly 11-29-24 01:58 PM


Originally Posted by Kontact (Post 23403352)
All bikes start set up for someone else. I have never seen a stock bike in my size that came with the right length stem, bar width or saddle type.

You just need to embrace the fact that bikes don't come ready to ride. They are like those dress slacks that come unhemmed.

I remember having to roll up the legs of my old shrink to fit Levi jeans.

Kontact 11-29-24 01:59 PM


Originally Posted by Iride01 (Post 23404406)
What seems unlikely?

That two pointing explains the difference when it already looks like his saddle is low.

pepperbelly 11-29-24 01:59 PM

My wife is going to help me get accurate height and inseam measurements this weekend.

Iride01 11-29-24 02:13 PM


Originally Posted by Kontact (Post 23404410)
That two pointing explains the difference when it already looks like his saddle is low.

It might add to the OP's perception of it being too low. Especially if the OP has the cleats forward on the shoe and a long foot.

The .883 of the inseam should have the saddle close to where it needs to be. But that will be affected by other things as well as if the OP points their toe down as they near the bottom of their stroke.

Why do you say the saddle is too low for a person that is 5' 10" and has a 30" inseam?

Kontact 11-29-24 02:13 PM


Originally Posted by pepperbelly (Post 23404411)
My wife is going to help me get accurate height and inseam measurements this weekend.

You want an encyclopedia or coffee table art book.

Given your height, I would expect a cycling inseam in the neighborhood of 33".

Kontact 11-29-24 02:15 PM


Originally Posted by Iride01 (Post 23404418)
It might add to the OP's perception of it being too low. Especially if the OP has the cleats forward on the shoe and a long foot.

The .883 of the inseam should have the saddle close to where it needs to be. But that will be affected by other things as well as if the OP points their toe down as they near the bottom of their stroke.

Why do you say the saddle is too low for a person that is 5' 10" and has a 30" inseam?

Because it is unlikely his inseam is 30", and that position is apparently 2.5" taller than 30" x .883.

Iride01 11-29-24 02:20 PM

I have known people over 6 feet to have only a 30" inseam.

But the OP does need to find out for certain. I do agree with this.....

You want an encyclopedia or coffee table art book.
and the OP needs to have one edge of that book against a wall or something vertical and the top edge pulled snug into the crotch.

pepperbelly 11-29-24 02:41 PM


Originally Posted by Iride01 (Post 23404418)
It might add to the OP's perception of it being too low. Especially if the OP has the cleats forward on the shoe and a long foot.

The .883 of the inseam should have the saddle close to where it needs to be. But that will be affected by other things as well as if the OP points their toe down as they near the bottom of their stroke.

Why do you say the saddle is too low for a person that is 5' 10" and has a 30" inseam?

I use flat pedals that have spikes on them.

Steve B. 11-29-24 03:14 PM


Originally Posted by Iride01 (Post 23404423)
I have known people over 6 feet to have only a 30" inseam.

But the OP does need to find out for certain. I do agree with this.....
and the OP needs to have one edge of that book against a wall or something vertical and the top edge pulled snug into the crotch.

Method I learned was while barefoot or in socks, stand on a hard floor, use a wood dowel with a slot for a tape measure, place tape end into slot, pull dowel up into crotch, have somebody look at what the metric measurement is on the floor. Did that, showed 83 cm, which is about what it showed maybe 20 years ago when I first did it.

In any event, a 2nd and longer ride with saddle at 73 cm, no knee pain, height felt just fine. Will keep riding at this height and wait and see,

pepperbelly 11-29-24 03:44 PM


Originally Posted by Kontact (Post 23404419)
You want an encyclopedia or coffee table art book.

Given your height, I would expect a cycling inseam in the neighborhood of 33".

I don’t have an encyclopedia or a coffee table book. I will use the largest book I can find.


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