Originally Posted by berlinonaut (Post 20814771)

Yes, you have been pretty vocal about that fact over the course of the last years. And about your opinion about the Helix as well. I'd say it is a fair assumption that almost everone on this thread got it. Most more than once. Hell, many suffer from an overdose already. No need to constantly repeat it. It does not add more weight to it. In the good old times there used to be a thing called "netiquette" and one thing it adviced to do was "tell something new". Maybe something to think about.

https://xkcd.com/1357/

Originally Posted by Ozonation (Post 20814261)

According to the statistics I could find, about 39% of KS projects actually get funded. Another source cited that 65% of backers agreed that the reward was delivered on time. The other 35% isn't exactly clear, but it appears that the reward was not delivered (as promised presumably), or outright failed to materialize (2009-2015). So, of all the KS campaigns, about 25% get funded and actually go through to a reasonable level of satisfaction.

In 2017, KS reports that the average amount raised by successfully funded KS projects was about $21,700. The median amount for a project was just over $5000. In other words, the majority of most successfully funded projects are probably much smaller scale projects with significantly less complexity than what the Helix aspires to... ever see how many backpacks pop up on KS?

The Helix project is therefore several orders of magnitude greater in difficulty than the average KS project. It raised an incredible amount of money for a KS campaign; suggesting that it tapped into a niche that people wanted. But it's a complex project - not as complex as say, an automobile, but one that is demonstrably more involved than a bag or a belt, etc. And as we've seen over almost four long years of waiting - as others have belabored repeatedly on this forum - maybe Helix bit off more than it could chew; it wasn't being realistic; it should have had a different business plan; it maybe should have had better predesign and premanufacture conceptualization; the list goes on. Maybe, maybe not. I'm not a start up company, or even care to be one, so I can't relate and I won't judge on what should or should not have been done.

But the point is that KS is a risk - period. Sure I get it that people are upset that they invested a significant amount and had to wait so long, but despite what anybody claims, shouts, and yells about... it's a risk. You're buying into some person's vision; there are no guarantees that it will materialize and if it does, it might still change. If you thought you were getting a bike and Helix gave you a unicycle, that would be a different matter. But aside from a few minor changes and a few pounds, backers are getting 98% or more of they paid for. It went from some guy's vision, to prototype, to now this. First iteration. Considering the scope of the Helix project, that seems pretty damn good, especially in an era of firmware updates, OS updates, and perpetual recalls. And the backers got this at an amazing price, titanium or not.

But the bottom line is if you can't accept that risk, then don't invest. This is a niche product in a niche forum - I highly doubt anybody who backed Helix is "hurting over the money" invested; they should have been prepared to lose the money outright. If they invested and thought this was a guaranteed outcome, then they bluntly took a chance they should not have. Given the success rate of KS and the nature of the project relative to others, people should actually be more surprised that Helix seems to have succeeded rather than failed.

Hope for the best; prepare for the worst.

Originally Posted by Ozonation (Post 20814811)

I don't know if I would install a Brooks saddle on the Helix. To be fair, I find the Brooks saddle to be extremely comfortable, but yes, I can see how it might be out of place. However, Brooks does offer ones in black that could work (black goes with everything!), as well as a non-leather, textured version that might work.

Originally Posted by borjita (Post 20814851)

Black would do better! But non-leather? I thought the idea of Brooks was that leather is great because it adapts to your shape after a while.

Originally Posted by Ozonation (Post 20814834)

Damn. Now look what you made me go and do. I went to the Brooks website... and they have a deep red Cambium (non leather) saddle. Ooooo.... if the Helix is a deepish grey, the red would really stand out! Good grief... here I am thinking on how to accessorize a bike only 5 people in the world have.
And... you could get red pedals... and deep red leather wrap for the handles.... oooooo.... this merits some window shopping... :D

Originally Posted by AvnerBen (Post 20814744)

my P6RX Brompton fully equipped (but with Russian-made titanium rack) weighs 13.5kg. This leaves a little over 3kg for equipment, which is not much. It is left to see how much the helix rack and mudguard weigh. With the recently published measurements, I don't expect the saving to be significant, but even half a kilo could be substantial inn bike touring!
BTW, which version of the Cubby do you have: 3 or 4?

Originally Posted by harlond (Post 20814845)

Sure, Kickstarter carries risk. But that doesn't in any way whatever excuse Helix, which didn't deliver what it promised when it promised. Those were Helix's promises, not Kickstarter's. So it's no defense of Helix that the product was offered on Kickstarter.

All that said, I'm really happy that an actual bike has been delivered, and it looks pretty nice, worthy of the Kickstarter price even if it's not exactly what was promised. By no means the disaster that the three-year delay suggested was likely.

Originally Posted by borjita (Post 20814851)

Black would do better! But non-leather? I thought the idea of Brooks was that leather is great because it adapts to your shape after a while.

Originally Posted by 2_i (Post 20814879)

My lock with its bag weigh close to 2kg, so I am actually not that far away.

I had an early version of Chubby 4, before they started making different versions for different bikes. I paid under $500 at the time, i.e. it was a very good deal.

Is the titanium rack something you would advise to look into? Have you got a link to it? I strengthened the original Brompton rack and also put side roller wheels onto it, that really enhance the maneuverability of the folded bike, so I am not very eager to jump onto another rack, but one should always keep the eyes open.

Originally Posted by borjita (Post 20814802)

I know, but too vintage for my pretty ass :-)
Back to the Helix, would you install a Brooks saddle there? It feels so out of place with the rest of the bike.

Originally Posted by Joe Remi (Post 20814843)

The weight of the bike is new and unexpected, and I will not be bullied off this forum. Write this down.

Originally Posted by AvnerBen (Post 20815081)

yes. Mine turned out to be very strong (up to 30kg carry according to maker, but I never passed the 10) and 100 percent compatible with the original. I transferred the straps and both easywheels (minimods) with no problem. I don't have the link with me right now. Will look for it at home.

Originally Posted by 2_i (Post 20815531)

I presume your rack is the one by H&H Design. It is indeed structurally sound unlike most of the aftermarket racks offered for Brompton. My moving of the sideways roller wheel onto that rack would be quite a challenge though. I think will look into just replacing the stays of the original Brompton rack with steel ones.

Originally Posted by Joe Remi (Post 20815543)

David Hunter, thanks! Hey, I still think the bike is cool even if Peter missed a really important target. It's certainly not a problem in my life personally if this fails, it's just frustrating to see him get this far and have this outcome. Maybe I should seem less startled/bewildered, but the weight gain over what he'd planned simply didn't occur to me..I didn't see it coming.

At any rate I'm not in the market now, but would I buy a used one in a few years? Heck yeah!

Originally Posted by AvnerBen (Post 20815644)

I bought mine from a private guy named Maxim Nreg (or something simmilar) on eBay, but I cannot find his listing there any more. H&H make aesthetically pleasing products, but I had some problems with their structural strength. Like I said, replacing the rack was a straightforward ten minute job, no complications involved.

Originally Posted by 2_i (Post 20816033)

Thanks. My problem is that I need to move the location of the roller wheels and the H&H has no place where I could drill. Also the top of the original Brompton rack seems strong enough, maybe even too strong for what it needs to be. On the other hand the stays are feeble. I looked at the strength of tubes from various materials and it seems that stainless steel brings practically no gain in strength for reasonable parameters compared to alu, just gain in weight. However, titanium brings advantage and I ordered titanium tubes for the stays. Incidentally, with shipping there is practically no difference in cost when varying tube material :). With this I am going half way towards a titanium rack :D.

Originally Posted by AvnerBen (Post 20816075)

I had twice stay failures with stock aluminum racks. The small tubes are also unreasonably priced. That's why I changed to titanium. I also replaced the easy wheels with something more practical. I'm looking forwards to see how the helix rolls on its own big wheel.

Originally Posted by 2_i (Post 20816137)

Wow! My current stay solution is described here. It is OK, but could be better, hence my poking around.

Optimization is obviously a complicated process that commonly yields many solutions. Rolling on the wheel in Helix is obviously good - you reuse the existing structure and are able to roll with not much pain over big obstacles. Originally I was put off by the tiny wheels barely sticking out of the rack for rolling the folded Brompton. However, after I got the side wheels mounted, see here, I think I have a winner. The folded bike became extremely versatile. I move over buildings, streets, stairs, elevators, etc. operating like people pulling suitcases and becoming indistinguishable from that crowd. My 2 side wheel are also minimod/bikegang, while the 4 other original.

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Originally Posted by AvnerBen (Post 20814744)

my P6RX Brompton fully equipped (but with Russian-made titanium rack) weighs 13.5kg.

Originally Posted by spambait11 (Post 20816519)

Originally Posted by spambait11 (Post 20816556)

Originally Posted by Jipe (Post 20816574)

I also can confirm that the Chubby is accepted by several airlines. One of its advantage is also light weight compared to most other trailers. Its wheels size is ETRTO 349, same wheel size as the Brompton (there is also a version with ETRTO 355 wheels for the Birdy)..