Barry, I would not take Helix, if it were given for free. It does not solve any problem for me, at least compared to other bikes. It is mid-way in everything, at least from my perspective. Still, I respect the fact that for some it may be a pinnacle and they may be willing to pay $3500+ for it. However my lack of interest is my business.

2_i_,
I would absolutely have another take one for free, but that would by greedy (!) ... but I otherwise agree with your statement. It is just a (another) bike, a tool ... similar, and different from other tools ...
The Helix is NOT the end-all (folding) bike. I have looked for (the Perfect) one, and will continue to do so ...
But, for me, cycling and owning a bike (not an e-bike) is just fun. I ride because I like to ride; not only for transportation ...
The Helix is a VERY, VERY nice bike (not withstanding the time it took to get to market ..) ..

For me it is both and the transportation is an excuse for riding :). However I love riding under a variety of conditions, including rain, snow and sun, on a variety of surfaces, including mud, ice and sand. It is common for me to carry various junk on bikes. Helix excels in such a narrow niche from my perspective that there would be no point of keeping it. Also I am wary of breakdowns or malfunctions that cannot be fixed in any straightforward manner. (I learned in a hard way to stay away from Ti frames for optical glasses.) However, where Helix excels can be right up the alley for some people and clearly is.

Thank you for your input.
I also used to ride in all conditions, but the need/desire is less so these days ...
The Helix attributes, will be strengthened when/if fenders/bags/luggage etc. come to market ... but, the base bike ... is without question, as nice(er!) as many other mass produced bike out there.
Breakdowns and malfunctions, ... none yet, but I/we will see in the future.

Umm, staying away from Ti frames ... ? Why?

Uh-huh... Staying in Japan, having glasses with Ti Nikon frame. The frame cracks on the eve of a hike up Mt Fuji. Given the conditions expected there, fog, hale, wind blown volcanic ashes, I better have full visual capabilities and need to fix the frame right away. When I had a similar problem with an SS frame, it was fixed in half an hour in the first place off the street I stopped at. OK I step into an optical shop favored by my host. It turns out that to fix the Ti frame it needs to take the route: Japan optical shop -> my US optical shop -> US distributor for Nikon -> Nikon in Japan -> US distributor for Nikon -> my US optical shop -> Japan optical shop. There is no way around it. When I bought the glasses I did not know that it was Nikon - it even had some French sounding name. I did not know I needed to care where the frame was made. I swallowed the cost of buying new glasses with an SS frame and never ever again touched Ti - incidentally the Ti frames are too fragile for me in the first place, hence the breaking just due to use. (The SS one breaking was from a skiing accident.)

Back to bike frames, later in the week I pick up my Brompton from frame repair - the so-called ears started to bend down due to rough use.

He's trying to get the full price for a bike he didn't pay full price for, and I don't think a ti folder without the promised ti weight savings is worth $3500.

Also, I'm getting tired of people telling me I can't have an opinion of a bike I've never owned. I intend to go right on doing that.

2i - Yes, that seems like it was a frustrating experience.
Good luck with the repairs on the B.


Joe - Thanks for your simple explanation.
Also, you can say whatever you like ... it's the 'net after all.

I don't have a problem with the CL guy trying to get full price for a bike he didn't pay full price for - his profit margin isn't an issue. The bike is worth what it is worth, period. If someone thinks it's worth full price and pays it, then that is the value. Otherwise, it's like saying you shouldn't sell your house for market value when it has appreciated, because you didn't pay current market value. Sheesh. Maybe he moved on during the interminable wait for the product and just decided it was easier to sell them once received rather than trying to sell a backer position, and possibly more lucrative as well. He lost any investment value on his money for years, he ran the risk of getting nothing, I'm actually fine with him getting more than he paid. But then, I'm not going to buy his Helixes, lol. But for someone out there who wants them and doesn't want to wait a looooong time to get them, full price is a bargain.

Well, it's not worth $3500 to me..I wouldn't buy from the factory for that, either. The guy can get all the profit he wants, my life will not be affected in any way.

I don't have any issue at all with anyone making a profit. They did, after all, risk a pile of cash and waited over four years to see anything for it, so there's no issue there.

My only issue was with the obtuse phrasing that might lead an uninformed person to believe that they're selling the bike for close to what they originally paid. Quoting the price they paid for both bikes but then only talking about the new sell price for a single bike is gauche at best and dishonest at worst. It would read better if they just never mentioned their original purchase price. Why bring it up at all?

To be transparent, I say all this as someone who has three pledges, one of which I intend to resell at the best available market rate, most likely via eBay or similar.

Now as far as value goes...my life situation was very different four and a half years ago when I backed the project. At the time, 1300USD for a Ti folder that met Helix's size specifications was a STEAL to me. However, I wouldn't pay 3500USD then, and I wouldn't pay it now. Clearly at least a handful of folks are willing, otherwise they would have been unable to sell out of the "oh my god we need to show new revenue" bikes. Only time will tell how long that price will remain viable.

Cool, you buy it. I'm bewildered that anyone feels the need to tell me I'm wrong about not wanting to buy a bike at its asking price.

I am getting bike #215 tomorrow. Things seem to be rolling along.


Thanks
Yan

Yan - can you share impressions of your new Helix?

Have we heard from any of the 10 buyers who paid full retail price for the 10 bikes that were supposed to be delivered in December?

Helix has a white knight investor, right? Giant? Merida? Fuji-ta? Dahon?

about 200 were sent

First year of production, right?
If they keep up the good work they can reach bike number 500 within 2020!

It's still in the box. I won't have time to tinker with it for a couple of weeks, but it looks really cool.

Overall, I think it is the best bike with 24" wheels. I still don't understand the big wheel requirement, however it is one of the nicest folders I have ever seen.

Helix has great potential moving forward. They can make non-folding ti frames for other companies with scale.

I expect them to grow dramatically in the next two years.

Thanks
Yan

It would be interesting to see a ti minivelo from them. No one mainstream makes one off the top of my head. Only recall one that looks like a Tyrell on aliexpress.

Well, they've got Yan, apparently! Not too shabby.

I'm not an investor. I knew this project was developed by a good guy with a great idea. I thought it would be foolish not to support the development.

FYI we are in a market with nonsense from Tern and all their foolishness. I believe everyone should support something better, Helix is a great option. Dahon is awesome, Brompton is great, BF is good ( if they continue ).

Thanks
Yan

Just curious, but what are the reasons for saying that? Are Tern a notoriously bad company? I have a Tern Verge x10 and it's OK to ride, but kind of a piece of crap with many design flaws. Folding design is terrible and mine suffered from a crack that I thankfully noticed while changing the tyres and managed to get a new frame under warranty (service was actually very good tbh). The issues I have with my Tern are what made me want a Helix, although the company seems OK from my experience. However, I wish I'd bought a Birdy or Dahon folder with my money instead of the Tern I have, but it has taken me to a lot of places and got me excited about travelling with my bike to cycle wherever I go.

There were many documented failures on Tern's website.... until all that information was public, then required login credentials, then it was removed from search engines, and then it was deleted.

They claimed the frames are super safe, however a simple statistical test would contradict their hypothesis.

They filed a frivolous lawsuit against me for speaking the truth.

Their recalls don't define the recalled bikes. The serial numbers should be public....I can't imagine a legitimate reason to keep recalled serial numbers private.

It seems these frames are still breaking, even new bikes....this non-sense started in 2012, and I don't think it will end anytime soon.

Can others please chime in with other details.

Thanks
Yan

I don't own a tern. I've had Dahon speed frame with a hinge that gradually developed a gradually increasing play in the hinge until I had to permanently weld it together. I didn't know if I was just unlucky or if the loaded touring over 2000km with some dirt and gravel roads plus air transport had anything to do with it. For the next bike I thought about getting a tern until I read about the weld cracking problem. So I got another Dahon, but a Vigor aluminum frame this time. I figured that I might have better luck with the different hinge design. So far after 2 years and over 3000km of commuting it seems to still be ok. I had looked at other bikes like bike Friday, Eve, Birdy, etc, but the Dahon had the most readily available replacement parts, at a fairly low cost, with least complexity.

Helix
 

I have a bike still in box. I have not decided if I'm going to keep it or sell it yet.