ADAP7IVE

Hi again guys, just thinking about a couple options in particular since I'll be heading to Kobe and/or Osaka next week to check out commuting bikes. Right now I'm thinking about a Brompton versus a Bike Friday Tikit, and wondering how much the various options really matter.

Brompton is definitely the cheaper of the two, at around ¥190,000 for a M3L with front bag. For another ¥70,000 I can get one of Kinetics' disc brake forks at a later time if I find it necessary, putting the total cost around ¥260,000.

A belt drive Alfine-8 Tikit, on the other hand: the price is around ¥290,000, but can't fit disc brakes, per emails with BF. Plus bag/lights. Over ¥300,000 probably total.

I guess the biggest questions are, how important is a quiet ride, just how much more difficult than a belt is maintenance and messiness on a chain drive on a single ring/cog, and how much more useful would a disc brake be compared to a belt?

On noise, I don't recall ever being annoyed by the noise on any bikes I rode before. On mess, I do recall staining pants and cutting my ankle pretty deep once on the chain ring, but a chain guard could fix that.

Of course, I could just accept that any folder will be a compromise on something and just choose, leaving the "everything" bike for my next full-size build.

linberl

I use a dry wax on my chain instead of lube/oil and it is nearly mess free. I switched to the wax after dropping the chain a couple times on my BF when I folded it (have since learned how to do so without dropping the chain). Now there's no more grease on my pants, hands, etc. And the bike runs great. And it is much cheaper than a belt drive, lol. I do have to apply it more often, but it is a very quick painless procedure. I can buy a lot of wax for what a belt drive would have cost =). My bike has a single chain ring with a chain guard and with the wax it is simple. There are special waxes if you ride where it is very rainy. Just something to consider...

fietsbob

Because Bromptons front wheel comes around to the right side and covers the rest of the drivetrain ,

Its Not easy to make other stuff dirty with the folded up Bike.

invisiblehand

I was fairly indifferent to belt drive before picking up a STRIDA. After a few years with the bike, I can say that there are some real advantages to belt drive -- cleanliness and lack of maintenance. It's efficient enough, IMO.

Now ... whether it's worth the price is something else. It really depends on how you plan on using the bike. Personally, if I was going to use an IGH on a commuter, I'd get the belt drive. I'd also ask about going wireless with the rear hub. As for choosing between the tikit and Brompton, I think the fold versus ride is the biggest factor.

BruceMetras was one of the first guys that I remember advocating belt drive. Hopefully he'll chime in with more details about belt drive.

tds101 

@BruceMetras is, IMO, the go to guy for all things bike. He'd definitely be able to answer your questions,...

ADAP7IVE

I plan to ride it as a commuter, as well as a travel bike. Eventually going car-free as I did in Chicago with my Surly. The folds both look easy enough, but I'm wondering if the BF folded size/shape would make it more difficult to travel with.

By travel I mean take the bike and a bag (backpack and/or a handlebar bag or pannier), the bike, and go by car, plane, bus, train. Lots of multi modal travel when my wife and I travel in Japan.

ADAP7IVE

Another matter is patience lol. My wife doesn't cycle at all, let alone for transport, and doesn't believe that any bike should cost over maybe $300 (so a well-made folder at $1800-3000 is absurd to her). She's firmly in the car-centric mindset. She sees the mamachari-heavy steel beasts that are so common in Japan-going for less than $100 new and thinks I should just get one of those and ride it till the wheels fall off (and store it outside because our apartment is small). In her mind, any bike will do, and riding is riding; if I really want to do it, I'll ride anything.

Having a partner so antagonistic to cycling means I have to arrange funds myself, outside of our normal budget. That means saving every extra penny for eight or ten more months, and not cycling in the meantime.

ADAP7IVE

Hm...Maybe a BF Silk? Larger than Brommie and Tikit, but cheaper and still quick-folding with the folding stem, has disc brakes and belt, and with better tire options. Could transport it easily if it rolls like the Tikit, and if I can fit it in a bag I could wear or carry it, or set it down inside businesses and trains, etc without incident

invisiblehand

Getting a single bike that does everything well is really hard. The Brompton and tikit have obvious tradeoffs.

Keeping it super brief.

The Brompton is a pretty awesome utility bike. Compact fold with a huge carrying capacity with the front bag. Rolls OK while folded. Limited ergonomic adjustability. Excellent resale value.

The tikit has much more ergonomic and drivetrain adjustability. It rolls well while folded. Easily accommodates a single medium sized pannier. Quick fold but there will be times you wish it was smaller.

I'd spend the time to test ride the bikes before purchasing.

The wife thing is your problem!

If it matters, I would point out how much cheaper it is than a second car. But perhaps getting a modest nice-riding used bike and locking it up outside for errands/commuting while saving up money for a nice travel bike is a better idea. I understand that theft is quite a bit lower in Japan. This way, you can ride soon and eventually get the travel bike that fits best which very well could be something other than a tikit or Brompton.

fietsbob

Better get off the fence & order soon!, Silk is being discontinued by Bi Fri, as the Redesign of the NWT renders it Redundant.

ADAP7IVE

I agree, finding a single bike to do it all is difficult. In reading your post I remembered that I still have the Surly in the US, waiting for me. That is a great commuter and utility bike. The Tikit is really attractive primarily for the belt drive and because the seat didn't need adjusting every time you fold. Seems great for longer rides.

The current plan, though, is to remain in Japan for another couple years only, and my commute should only be long for another year (40 km round trip). Your suggestion to get a cheaper bike and store outside and get a dedicated travel bike sounds good. Regardless, I'm starting to think that if it rides well enough for me in test rides, I should just go with the Brompton. Complete (initial) cost is much lower for the bike and necessary accessories, folded size easier to manage, and like you said, the resale value is high and I can get a decent chunk of that back if I REALLY want a different thing later.

LOL, with the saved cost of keeping a car, I could probably afford the one I don't choose within a couple of years anyway.

ADAP7IVE

I think they already did... =/

I saw a post on the forum about it just after posting that idea. BF has a NWT Silk, so I think they've nixed the Silk dedicated frame and added a belt drive option to the NWT like you said.