Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Folding Bikes
Reload this Page >

Brompton: How can I widen the rear wheels to stop the bike falling over?

Folding Bikes Discuss the unique features and issues of folding bikes. Also a great place to learn what folding bike will work best for your needs.

Brompton: How can I widen the rear wheels to stop the bike falling over?

Reply

Old 04-15-18, 05:46 AM
  #1  
chmac
Newbie
Thread Starter
 
chmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Brompton: How can I widen the rear wheels to stop the bike falling over?

My Brompton spends a lot of time with the back wheel flipped under the frame. I have the rear rack. It's not very stable in this position. I noticed that one of the rear wheels on the rack (rear when the bike is riding) is fitted on the inside of the rack. I swapped it to the outside, to make the wheels a little wider.

I'd like to make that set of wheels even wider. Maybe an extra 10cm at each side. Width at the back of the rear rack won't interfere with my feet when pedalling, and could make the bike very stable when standing. But I can't find anything on the internet about making this modification. I've searched a few times over a year or so.

Any advice? Anyone else tried this? Is it obviously a stupid idea for a reason that I've failed to grasp? :-)
chmac is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-18, 06:16 AM
  #2  
Bonzo Banana
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Merry Old England
Posts: 586

Bikes: Muddyfox Evolve 200, Bicycles4u Paris Explorer, Raleigh Twenty Stowaway, Bickerton California, Saracen Xile, Kona Hoss Deluxe, Vertigo Carnaby, Exodus Havoc, Kona Lanai, Revolution Cuillin Sport, Dawes Kingpin, Bickerton, NSU & Elswick Cosmopolitan

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 215 Post(s)
Originally Posted by chmac View Post
My Brompton spends a lot of time with the back wheel flipped under the frame. I have the rear rack. It's not very stable in this position. I noticed that one of the rear wheels on the rack (rear when the bike is riding) is fitted on the inside of the rack. I swapped it to the outside, to make the wheels a little wider.

I'd like to make that set of wheels even wider. Maybe an extra 10cm at each side. Width at the back of the rear rack won't interfere with my feet when pedalling, and could make the bike very stable when standing. But I can't find anything on the internet about making this modification. I've searched a few times over a year or so.

Any advice? Anyone else tried this? Is it obviously a stupid idea for a reason that I've failed to grasp? :-)
10cm or 10mm? 10cm sounds like a Brompton fatbike or water bike. Below's a Brompton with thicker wheels and tyres by the looks of it.




Bonzo Banana is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-18, 08:08 AM
  #3  
tudorowen1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Cleethorpes..the last resort..UK
Posts: 327

Bikes: Brompton S6L ,Bike Friday NWT, Phillips 8 speed folder, Trek 930, Thorn XTC

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 64 Post(s)
Make sure the wheels are on the outside of the rack..I have seen some where they are fitted on the inside of the rack on the supporting members that stick out from the rack..You could simply put a longer bolt on the right hand of the rear rack ..say half an inch longer and fix the wheel on there..The Brompton tends to fall over on that side with a rack because it is a bit lopsided when folded..This doesn't tend to happen when there is no rack fitted..

Last edited by tudorowen1; 04-15-18 at 08:15 AM.
tudorowen1 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-18, 08:12 AM
  #4  
reppans
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 748

Bikes: Brompton M6R, Specialized Tricross Comp, Ellsworth Isis, Dahon Speed P8

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 301 Post(s)
The left rear rack wheel is fitted on the inside of the rack to keep its depth dimension shallower, and perhaps to protect the wheel - for example when folded and lying on its side. If you don't mind an increase in the depth dimension, then sure you can flip the wheel to the outside to match right rear wheel. You could also use longer bolts and spacers on both sides to widen the track.

There's also the X-roller mod for front wheels, but only increases track on the right side, and was really only intended for stability during shopping cart mode, and parked while folded. It will still fall over in one direction in kickstand mode.
reppans is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-18, 08:27 AM
  #5  
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 35,801

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 132 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5134 Post(s)
After market, made for B's in Asia, (not By the company in UK), there es a piece replacing the 2 rear frame wheels ,

and one wheel pulls out wider temporarily ,on a telescoping shaft.. making it wider..
fietsbob is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-18, 10:19 AM
  #6  
BillN33
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
After market, made for B's in Asia, (not By the company in UK), there es a piece replacing the 2 rear frame wheels ,

and one wheel pulls out wider temporarily ,on a telescoping shaft.. making it wider..
not cheap - about 65 plus the cost of wheels - made in the Far East, so add carriage, (sometimes) and if you are unlucky import duties

I'm trying to find a good lightweight kickstand - but all stuff for Brompton's is not cheap and the best I can find is 65

Multiply UK 's x 1.5 = US $'s approximately
BillN33 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 05:06 AM
  #7  
badmother
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,733
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Originally Posted by BillN33 View Post
not cheap - about 65 plus the cost of wheels - made in the Far East, so add carriage, (sometimes) and if you are unlucky import duties

I'm trying to find a good lightweight kickstand - but all stuff for Brompton's is not cheap and the best I can find is 65

Multiply UK 's x 1.5 = US $'s approximately
Did you look at the different forums to see if anybody did a DIY solution to the problem?
badmother is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 05:09 AM
  #8  
BillN33
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Originally Posted by badmother View Post
Did you look at the different forums to see if anybody did a DIY solution to the problem?
Yep I have, not only for a rack but also for a good, lightweight kickstand

but you don't want to put anything "cheap looking" on a Brompton!!

The Brompton rack seem the best value out there at 80

Last edited by BillN33; 04-17-18 at 05:13 AM.
BillN33 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 05:29 AM
  #9  
badmother
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,733
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Originally Posted by BillN33 View Post
Yep I have, not only for a rack but also for a good, lightweight kickstand

but you don't want to put anything "cheap looking" on a Brompton!!

The Brompton rack seem the best value out there at 80
For sure

I am in the process of buying a rack myself but I am thinking about getting a after market one that somebody here has used for some time.

There has been some talk about the "no rack no fender" B`s (are they called E?) falling over and some gadget to put between the hook and the rear stay to lift the front axel a bit up when folded. Not sure if this makes a difference with the bikes with rack and fender. You could look into it, like cutting open a 1" piece of the rubberhose used in car cooling systems or similar and hook it over the stay under the hook. If it works better than without you could make or buy something less crappy looking for long term use. I think I remember you can buy a "fatter" plastic hook or a plastic or alu piece to atatch to the rear stay. Not super expensive the last time i looked.
badmother is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 05:53 AM
  #10  
BillN33
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Originally Posted by badmother View Post
For sure

I am in the process of buying a rack myself but I am thinking about getting a after market one that somebody here has used for some time.

There has been some talk about the "no rack no fender" B`s (are they called E?) falling over and some gadget to put between the hook and the rear stay to lift the front axel a bit up when folded. Not sure if this makes a difference with the bikes with rack and fender. You could look into it, like cutting open a 1" piece of the rubberhose used in car cooling systems or similar and hook it over the stay under the hook. If it works better than without you could make or buy something less crappy looking for long term use. I think I remember you can buy a "fatter" plastic hook or a plastic or alu piece to atatch to the rear stay. Not super expensive the last time i looked.
I'm not a fan of always flipping the rear wheel under ...... so I have been looking for a lightweight kickstand - there are 2 specific "for" Brompton ones available - one at 65 and the other at 100+...... both ex Singapore/Taiwan

I keep searching Ebay for a kickstand for a 16" Bike - lightweight and fixing to the drop out - but I have not found a suitable one...... kickstands on eBay are cheap, (under 10), but it is finding the right one

There is a rack on Ebay at the moment - made in the Far East - no fender needed - but it is still approaching 90 once you add wheels and more if you add 4 wheels

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BROMPTON-...53.m1438.l2649

Last edited by BillN33; 04-17-18 at 05:56 AM.
BillN33 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 07:30 AM
  #11  
Schwinnsta
Schwinnasaur
 
Schwinnsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 792
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 104 Post(s)



Greenfield rear mount kickstand is superior to the lighter kickstands for stability. However, there is an interference with the stock pump. I changed pumps to a lezyne stored in the seatpost.

Last edited by Schwinnsta; 04-17-18 at 07:31 AM. Reason: format
Schwinnsta is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 08:30 AM
  #12  
BillN33
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Schwinnsta View Post



Greenfield rear mount kickstand is superior to the lighter kickstands for stability. However, there is an interference with the stock pump. I changed pumps to a lezyne stored in the seatpost.
Greenfield rear mount kickstand is superior to the lighter kickstands for stability. However, there is an interference with the stock pump. I changed pumps to a lezyne stored in the seatpost.[/QUOTE]

Thanks I saw that - I think that there are sometimes available on eBay in the UK - but as you say there is the pump problem and it's not the most attractive

This is the one that is sometimes on eBay in the UK - the seller must import them - 65 - made in Japan


BillN33 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 08:55 AM
  #13  
Schwinnsta
Schwinnasaur
 
Schwinnsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 792
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 104 Post(s)
Originally Posted by BillN33 View Post
Greenfield rear mount kickstand is superior to the lighter kickstands for stability. However, there is an interference with the stock pump. I changed pumps to a lezyne stored in the seatpost.
These are less stable. You are better off kicking the wheel under and buying the Greenfield and the Lezyne pump both is less money. You end up with a better kickstand and better pump but some additional weight. The kickstand weighs twice as much.


Thanks I saw that - I think that there are sometimes available on eBay in the UK - but as you say there is the pump problem and it's not the most attractive

This is the one that is sometimes on eBay in the UK - the seller must import them - 65 - made in Japan


[/QUOTE]
Schwinnsta is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-18, 11:20 AM
  #14  
2_i 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 2,156

Bikes: Trek 730, Bike Friday NWT, Brompton M6R*2, Trek 830, Trek 720, Dahon HAT060, Dahon HT060,...

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 247 Post(s)
Originally Posted by BillN33 View Post
I keep searching Ebay for a kickstand for a 16" Bike - lightweight and fixing to the drop out - but I have not found a suitable one...... kickstands on eBay are cheap, (under 10), but it is finding the right one
This is my Brompton with a cheap on-axle Evo kickstand for 16" off Ebay



I have since moved on to expensive ones, but this one worked fine as long as you did not overload the front bag. I tried some that mounted on the chainstay but it was difficult to prevent them from rotating around the round chainstay and I gave up.
2_i is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-18, 06:39 AM
  #15  
chmac
Newbie
Thread Starter
 
chmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Wow, thanks for all the replies folks. I hadn't properly configured email notifications, so only saw the messages today.

@Bonzo Banana: Great pic! I was thinking about extending just the little roller wheel by 10cm horizontally. Now you've got me thinking about an amphibious

@tudorowen1: Good suggestion. I have the wheel on the outside. Longer bolt may well be the simplest solution.

@reppans: I realised after posting the thread, that the wheel is probably on the inside to reduce the folded size of the bike. If I put a fixed extension on that side, the bike will always be 10cm wider. Hmm. Not ideal.

@fietsbob: Awesome, an aftermarket telescopic bolt sounds like it might be the perfect option! Thanks. Is it the one on aliexpress from shouthoutai you were thinking about? (I can't post the URL as I'm a new user on this forum!) Definitely interesting. Import duties are a nightmare in Germany, but maybe worth the headache. Will investigate.

Wow, lots of interesting brompton options on aliexpress. Guess I'm gonna spend a few evenings trawling around there looking at upgrade options! :-)
chmac is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-18, 01:47 AM
  #16  
badmother
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,733
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Originally Posted by chmac View Post

@fietsbob: Awesome, an aftermarket telescopic bolt sounds like it might be the perfect option! Thanks. Is it the one on aliexpress from shouthoutai you were thinking about? (I can't post the URL as I'm a new user on this forum!) Definitely interesting. Import duties are a nightmare in Germany, but maybe worth the headache. Will investigate.

Wow, lots of interesting brompton options on aliexpress. Guess I'm gonna spend a few evenings trawling around there looking at upgrade options! :-)
Take some time to investigate. Sometimes it can be cheaper to buy an item from a local seller instead of importing yourself. Also you do not have to wait 9 months to get your new toy

We have the import duties where I am too and then you have to pay a fee to be allowed to pay the tax...

Brompton is "big" in Germany and in EU so I am sure it can be possible to find locally.

Also look into the solutions for the E brompton I posted about in a different thread. I think I got your thread and another posters thread mixed up when I posted about this solution. I did not try it myself but it is about lifting the hook on the front axel up a bit when folded to get a better weight distribution on the bike- it is leaning less to one side. You can try it by just making up some cheap piece for testing and then buy if you like the solution.

Folding Hook Pillow for E-type Brompton - Brombacher
badmother is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-18, 09:32 AM
  #17  
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 35,801

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 132 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5134 Post(s)
Thats a trade off, Health Care costs are a life threatening nightmare in the US, you get that for a better deal in Germany..
fietsbob is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-18, 10:52 AM
  #18  
reppans
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 748

Bikes: Brompton M6R, Specialized Tricross Comp, Ellsworth Isis, Dahon Speed P8

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 301 Post(s)
Originally Posted by chmac View Post
@fietsbob: Awesome, an aftermarket telescopic bolt sounds like it might be the perfect option! Thanks. Is it the one on aliexpress from shouthoutai you were thinking about? (I can't post the URL as I'm a new user on this forum!) Definitely interesting. Import duties are a nightmare in Germany, but maybe worth the headache. Will investigate.
This is the same thing as the X-roller mod which I own and mentioned in post #4. Again, it's awesome for shopping cart mode and folded stability, but it's pricey as a kickstand solution and only solves half the problem (which frankly can be solved free with a longer wheel bolt on the right-side rack wheel, which doesn't impact the fold). In kickstand mode, the telescopic axle mod will still easily fall over on the left side - and that's the less stable side where the rack wheel is mounted on the inside of the rack.


Originally Posted by badmother View Post
Also look into the solutions for the E brompton I posted about in a different thread. I think I got your thread and another posters thread mixed up when I posted about this solution. I did not try it myself but it is about lifting the hook on the front axel up a bit when folded to get a better weight distribution on the bike- it is leaning less to one side. You can try it by just making up some cheap piece for testing and then buy if you like the solution.

Folding Hook Pillow for E-type Brompton - Brombacher
This hook pillow is also for rolling while folded, and parked while folded and has no effect in kickstand mode.
reppans is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-18, 01:05 PM
  #19  
chmac
Newbie
Thread Starter
 
chmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
@badmother: Hahaha, a fee to pay the tax! I once spent ~4h picking up a package at customs here in Berlin. I swore never again! If I understood correctly, the folding hook pillow only applies when the front wheel is folded back. I'm trying to get the bike to be more stable when it's in "kick stand" mode, so I don't think it would apply to my situation.

@reppans: Gotcha. The telescopic bolt is indeed on the wrong side. Good point. Indeed my bike falls over to the left side, no the right. I was assuming I could mount the telescopic side of the bolt on the left, but that might not be possible. I'll do some more digging. Thanks.

Update: Hmm, seems the telescopic x-mod could be mounted in either direction. However, it ends up at the back of the bike in kickstand mode, which will have less of a stability upgrade. Then it ends up in the path of my feet when the bike is unfolded. So I would need to pull it out and put it back in every single time I stop.

I was hoping for something that would extend at the back of the rack. Then it would be out of the way while riding. I would only need to disable it in when the bike is fully folded. A longer bolt might work, just it wouldn't be possible to disable.

Thanks for all the feedback. My search continues... :-)

Last edited by chmac; 04-23-18 at 01:35 PM. Reason: Added more info
chmac is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-18, 03:31 PM
  #20  
berlinonaut
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 475
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 220 Post(s)
Originally Posted by BillN33 View Post
...kickstand...

Thanks I saw that - I think that there are sometimes available on eBay in the UK - but as you say there is the pump problem and it's not the most attractive

This is the one that is sometimes on eBay in the UK - the seller must import them - 65 - made in Japan
That's a lot for a kickstand. The German Brompton importer sells one - it is 26 and available from any Brompton dealer in Germany for around 26. In fact it is a Humpert X-act Lilliput that can be bought on Amazon for 10. I do not know if there's any difference to the version of the importer but would not expect so. Did not try this kickstand myself as I do not have the need.
berlinonaut is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-18, 03:40 PM
  #21  
BillN33
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Originally Posted by berlinonaut View Post
That's a lot for a kickstand. The German Brompton importer sells one - it is 26 and available from any Brompton dealer in Germany for around 26. In fact it is a Humpert X-act Lilliput that can be bought on Amazon for 10. I do not know if there's any difference to the version of the importer but would not expect so. Did not try this kickstand myself as I do not have the need.
well I suppose that you can then buy another pump, (die Luftpumpe), and strap it on the Bike somewhere ......... that's if you need a pump ...... I always like to carry one just in case
BillN33 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-18, 07:17 PM
  #22  
2_i 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 2,156

Bikes: Trek 730, Bike Friday NWT, Brompton M6R*2, Trek 830, Trek 720, Dahon HAT060, Dahon HT060,...

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 247 Post(s)
Originally Posted by berlinonaut View Post
The German Brompton importer sells one - it is 26 and available from any Brompton dealer in Germany for around 26. In fact it is a Humpert X-act Lilliput that can be bought on Amazon for 10. I do not know if there's any difference to the version of the importer but would not expect so. Did not try this kickstand myself as I do not have the need.
I've got myself a double-legged Humpert kickstand for a regular bike. Upon trying it out I decided that it was a product level I did not want on my bike. Clumsy, overbuilt but still wobbly - just a warning that things might not be rosy in close-up.
2_i is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-18, 07:56 PM
  #23  
Schwinnsta
Schwinnasaur
 
Schwinnsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 792
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 104 Post(s)
Greenfield kickstand is more stable and not expensive. It uses similar design to Humpert. $17 shippedhttps://www.ebay.com/itm/KICKSTAND-GREENFIELD-SKS2B-285mm-REAR-MOUNT-BLK/352050867486?epid=2255361342&hash=item51f7dded1e:g8sAAOSwI8laAenw

This type of stand is more stable because its leg stands out further away the smaller ones. Two downsides. One, twice as heavy as Minoura. Two, you will need to find another way to hold your pump. I you a Leyzrne in seat tube.
Schwinnsta is offline  
Reply With Quote

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service